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Talking to a Robot about Christian Universal Salvation! (AI)

Der Alte

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Remember this Response
Also, your own source gives no conclusive answer on the definition of "Sheol" it seems to be uncertain.
SHEOL
By: Emil G. Hirsch
Hebrew word of uncertain etymology (see Sheol, Critical View), synonym of "bor" (pit), "abaddon" and "shaḥat" (pit or destruction), and perhaps also of "tehom" (abyss)
Found Here
Your source does not say what you claim it does. Hirsch, "Hebrew word of uncertain etymology" You, "no conclusive answer on the definition of "Sheol" it seems to be uncertain." Not the same thing. My previous discussion the poster never clarified his objections.
The Jewish Encyclopedia "Gehenna" article equates "Gehenna" and "Hades" with hell.
 
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YahuahSaves

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My previous discussion the poster never clarified his objections.
It looked like he did in this Post

Your source does not say what you claim it does. Hirsch, "Hebrew word of uncertain etymology" You, "no conclusive answer on the definition of "Sheol" it seems to be uncertain."
So uncertain is conclusive in your opinion? "Sheol" tends to have more than one proposed meaning, that's why I said uncertain. Hirsch used the same word.

Besides, you never clarified why the meaning has changed between the OT and NT and why not everyone agrees. Can you explain that?
 
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Jipsah

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Machines are made of metal and plastic and silica and rubber and what have you. Put them all together without software they do nothing at all. But with software. they do what the instructions written by the programmer(s) tell them to do, neither more nor less. The machine itself is as conscious as a toaster, or maybe even a humidifier. The software has whatever ideas the coder(s) write into it.. What's hard to understand there? The "robot" or "AI" or whatever has as much understanding of Christian soteriology as a ball peen hammer has of Aristotlean philosophy. It is a machine, doing what its circuitry and a stored program make it do. Dat's all. No Mechanical Men outside of science fiction.
 
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Lost Witness

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Machines are made of metal and plastic and silica and rubber and what have you. Put them all together without software they do nothing at all. But with software. they do what the instructions written by the programmer(s) tell them to do, neither more nor less. The machine itself is as conscious as a toaster, or maybe even a humidifier. The software has whatever ideas the coder(s) write into it.. What's hard to understand there? The "robot" or "AI" or whatever has as much understanding of Christian soteriology as a ball peen hammer has of Aristotlean philosophy. It is a machine, doing what its circuitry and a stored program make it do. Dat's all. No Mechanical Men outside of science fiction.
I believe you meant sentient AI? but "mechanical men" do exist :scratch:
 
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Jipsah

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theres a difference between sentient AI and what i posted however "Mechanical men' do exist:scratch:
Sorry to be a killjoy (OK. not really) but there is no such thing as a sentient AI, and there are no mechanical men. Don't scratch too hard, you'll wear the hair offf that spot.
 
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Lost Witness

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Sorry to be a killjoy (OK. not really) but there is no such thing as a sentient AI, and there are no mechanical men. Don't scratch too hard, you'll wear the hair offf that spot.
I'm afraid this argument isn't very compelling...
I'm pretty sure I said Sentient AI was different from what I had posted? which demonstrated mechanical Humanoids?

mechanical man Add to list Share



Definitions of mechanical man
  1. noun
    an automaton that resembles a human being
    synonyms:android, humanoid
 
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Saint Steven

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Stuff it gleans from what you've typed, or if the coders who wrote the thing made it so. No other options. Machines don't have opinions, at all, ever.
And therein lives a danger.
Someone in charges wants control; the programmers are given a task; the mindless computer program does the bidding of the one in charge.

We have seen what this means in social media algorithms. Blocking content and individuals. Some of it good; some of it bad. Mindless machines as "hatchet men". (hatchet persons? - LOL)
 
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Der Alte

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It looked like he did in this Post
So uncertain is conclusive in your opinion? "Sheol" tends to have more than one proposed meaning, that's why I said uncertain. Hirsch used the same word.
Besides, you never clarified why the meaning has changed between the OT and NT and why not everyone agrees. Can you explain that?
Do you know the difference between Hirsch "uncertain etymology" and You "uncertain meaning?" How has the meaning changed between OT and NT? Gehenna is a place of fiery punishment in both.
 
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HSong

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AI Bot Test



Write A Paper by Write For Me



Prompt: Jesus will save all

Psalm NEB 107:43 Let the wise man lay these things to heart, and ponder the record of the Lord's enduring love.



I also ran the robots responses theough a plagirism checker to make sure they weren't copy pasted online and this site says its 0% plagirism, which is incredible.






Me responses will be a paragraph that brgins with me: and also with [square brackets]



Robot: The notion that Jesus will save all might seem, at first, to be a controversial one. After all, many people [falsely] think that salvation must be earned through good deeds [salvation is through faith alone in Jesus Christ] , or perhaps even through the performance of certain religious rituals. [faith alone in Christ saves only] But, in fact, the idea that Jesus will save all is actually a central belief of Christianity.



Me: Yes, Jesus Christ saving everybody is the truth of the Bible. Salvation A shame so many believe in the lies of ECT and Annihilationism. Universal Salvation is true.

PSALM 103:8-14 The Lord is merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in mercy. He will not always strive with us, nor will He keep His anger.



Robot: The Bible teaches that Jesus was sent to earth for the express purpose of providing salvation for every person who believes in him. According to the New Testament, Jesus died as a sacrifice for the sins of humanity. By believing in Jesus and accepting him as their personal savior, anyone can be saved from the punishment of their sins. [wages As the Bible states, “For God so loved the world that he gave his only son, that whosoever believes in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life” (John 3:16).



Me: aion translated as eternal. So theres life for an age, one age of sin now the another age after free of sin which everyone will be in because all will be free from sin.

Ephesians 1:10 As a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in Him, things in heaven and things on earth.



Robot: The notion that Jesus will save all is further reinforced by the teachings of Jesus himself. In the Gospel of John, Jesus tells his followers, “He who believes in me shall be saved” (John 3:15). Similarly, in the Gospel of Mark, Jesus tells his listeners that anyone who believes in him will be saved, no matter who they are (Mark 16:16). Jesus also makes it clear that his love for his followers is unconditional, no matter where they are from or what they have done in the past. As the Bible states, “For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life” (John 3:16).



Me: Interesting it used the same verse twice. So my commentary from above also applied.

Luke 2:10 But the angel said to them, Do not be afraid. I bring you good news that will cause great joy for all the people."



Robot: These verses teach that Jesus is willing and able to save anyone who believes in him, regardless of their past or present sins. This shows that salvation is not dependent on one’s good works, but on one’s faith in Jesus alone. For this reason, it can be confidently said that Jesus will save all those who accept him as their personal savior and place their trust in him. No one is outside of the reach of God’s saving grace.



Me: And thus all people will place their trust in Him and thus all people will be saved.



Robot: In conclusion, the notion that Jesus will save all is a central belief of Christianity. The Bible teaches that Jesus died as a sacrifice for the sins of humanity, and that anyone who believes in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life. Additionally, Jesus himself taught that salvation is a free gift, regardless of who a person is or what they



This was created with Write For Me - Writing Made Easier with Artificial Intelligence!




Me: Incredibly accurate. The best article I've generated from Artificial Intelligence so far. I look forward to when these text models can get trained further to go into more detail about the truth. :)
 
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HSong

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Someone in charges wants control; the programmers are given a task; the mindless computer program does the bidding of the one in charge.
Agreed. Computer programs essentially only follow a series of yes "1" and no "0" (aka binary) instructions. These software extrapolate human morality. A good person can do more good with technology, just like how a bad person can do more bad with the same technologies.
 
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YahuahSaves

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Do you know the difference between Hirsch "uncertain etymology" and You "uncertain meaning?" How has the meaning changed between OT and NT? Gehenna is a place of fiery punishment in both.
The word the OP used is sheol and so did I. They may be similar, but they're not the same. And yes I know what etymology means, and Hirsch said "uncertain".

etymology
noun

1) The origin and historical development of a linguistic form as shown by determining its basic elements, earliest known use, and changes in form and meaning, tracing its transmission from one language to another, identifying its cognates in other languages, and reconstructing its ancestral form where possible.
2) The branch of linguistics that deals with etymologies.
3) That part of philology which treats of the history of words in respect both to form and to meanings, tracing them back toward their origin, and setting forth and explaining the changes they have undergone.
 
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Jipsah

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And therein lives a danger.
Someone in charges wants control; the programmers are given a task; the mindless computer program does the bidding of the one in charge.
Which describes most of the software ever written. <Laugh>
We have seen what this means in social media algorithms. Blocking content and individuals. Some of it good; some of it bad. Mindless machines as "hatchet men". (hatchet persons? - LOL)
Yep, that's the long and short of it.
 
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Jipsah

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I'm afraid this argument isn't very compelling...
Glad I could contribute to your vocabulary.

I'm pretty sure I said Sentient AI was different from what I had posted?
It might be if there was such a thing as a "sentient AI", which there is not. But since there isn't any such thing, you can feel free to define it any way you like.



Definitions of mechanical man​

  1. noun
    an automaton that resembles a human being
    synonyms:android, humanoid
Kinda like Wanda the Walking Doll.

The "mechanical man" of science fiction is typified by C3PO of Star Wars. Seen any of those lately?
 
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Der Alte

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The word the OP used is sheol and so did I. They may be similar, but they're not the same. And yes I know what etymology means, and Hirsch said "uncertain".
***
Uncertain etymology does not mean they did not know the meaning of a word. In the Jewish Encyclopedia Gehenna article they used "sheol" synonymous with "Gehenna."
"When Nebuchadnezzar descended into hell, [שׁאול] all its inhabitants were afraid that he was coming to rule over them (Shab. 149a; comp. Isa. xiv. 9-10)."​
 
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YahuahSaves

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Uncertain etymology does not mean they did not know the meaning of a word.
OK it means they "guess" at the closest meaning then. That makes no difference to my understanding.

etymology
noun

The origin and historical development of a linguistic form as shown by determining its basic elements, earliest known use, and changes in form and meaning, tracing its transmission from one language to another, identifying its cognates in other languages, and reconstructing its ancestral form where possible.
The branch of linguistics that deals with etymologies.
That part of philology which treats of the history of words in respect both to form and to meanings, tracing them back toward their origin, and setting forth and explaining the changes they have undergone.


And you still didn't answer effectively why the meaning of sheol changed over time and why people had differing views. From my earlier posted link:

"Unlike this world, Sheol is devoid of love, hate, envy, work, thought, knowledge, and wisdom ( Ecclesiastes 9:6 Ecclesiastes 9:10 ). Descriptions are bleak: There is no light ( Job 10:21-22 ; 17:13 ; Psalms 88:6 Psalms 88:12 ; 143:3 ), no remembrance ( Psalm 6:5 ; 88:12 ; Eccl 9:5 ), no praise of God ( Psalm 6:5 ; 30:9 ; 88:10-12 ; 115:17 ; Isa 38:18 ) — in fact, no sound at all ( Psalm 94:17 ; 115:17 ). Its inhabitants are weak, trembling shades ( Job 26:5 ; Psalm 88:10-12 ; Isa 14:9-10 ) who can never hope to escape from its gates ( Job 10:21 ; 17:13-16 ; Isa 38:10 ). Sheol is like a ravenous beast that swallows the living without being sated ( Prov 1:12 ; 27:20 ; Isa 5:14 ). Some thought the dead were cut off from God ( Psalm 88:3-5 ; Isa 38:11 ); while others believed that God's presence reached even to Sheol ( Psalm 139:8 )."
 
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Lost Witness

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Glad I could contribute to your vocabulary.


It might be if there was such a thing as a "sentient AI", which there is not. But since there isn't any such thing, you can feel free to define it any way you like.




Kinda like Wanda the Walking Doll.

The "mechanical man" of science fiction is typified by C3PO of Star Wars. Seen any of those lately?
I've supplied evidence of these "mechanical men"?
even a definition for them?

Refer to #24 The Confirmation you seek is at 9:15:oldthumbsup:
Some people don't have to rely on bad movies for references either? :scratch:
 
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Der Alte

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OK it means they "guess" at the closest meaning then. That makes no difference to my understanding.
etymology
noun
The origin and historical development of a linguistic form as shown by determining its basic elements, earliest known use, and changes in form and meaning, tracing its transmission from one language to another, identifying its cognates in other languages, and reconstructing its ancestral form where possible.
The branch of linguistics that deals with etymologies.
That part of philology which treats of the history of words in respect both to form and to meanings, tracing them back toward their origin, and setting forth and explaining the changes they have undergone.
And you still didn't answer effectively why the meaning of sheol changed over time and why people had differing views. From my earlier posted link:
"Unlike this world, Sheol is devoid of love, hate, envy, work, thought, knowledge, and wisdom ( Ecclesiastes 9:6 Ecclesiastes 9:10 ). Descriptions are bleak: There is no light ( Job 10:21-22 ; 17:13 ; Psalms 88:6 Psalms 88:12 ; 143:3 ), no remembrance ( Psalm 6:5 ; 88:12 ; Eccl 9:5 ), no praise of God ( Psalm 6:5 ; 30:9 ; 88:10-12 ; 115:17 ; Isa 38:18 ) — in fact, no sound at all ( Psalm 94:17 ; 115:17 ). Its inhabitants are weak, trembling shades ( Job 26:5 ; Psalm 88:10-12 ; Isa 14:9-10 ) who can never hope to escape from its gates ( Job 10:21 ; 17:13-16 ; Isa 38:10 ). Sheol is like a ravenous beast that swallows the living without being sated ( Prov 1:12 ; 27:20 ; Isa 5:14 ). Some thought the dead were cut off from God ( Psalm 88:3-5 ; Isa 38:11 ); while others believed that God's presence reached even to Sheol ( Psalm 139:8 )."
Good, now you know the meaning of etymology. Where does this quote say the meaning of sheol changed over time? What is your point about it? If it does, so what? Many words change meaning over time. I linked to the JE Gehenna article above. In the article sheol is used synonymously with Gehenna and is referred to as hell.
 
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YahuahSaves

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Good, now you know the meaning of etymology. Where does this quote say the meaning of sheol changed over time? What is your point about it? If it does, so what? Many words change meaning over time. I linked to the JE Gehenna article above. In the article sheol is used synonymously with Gehenna and is referred to as hell.
I quoted it in my post, perhaps read it in full?

I already knew the meaning of etymology, but apparently you didn't.

So what? "Many words change meaning over time", exactly my point. So no one can be 100% certain that sheol literally meant eternal hellfire in the OT (including you), so it's a matter of opinion.
 
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Der Alte

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I quoted it in my post, perhaps read it in full?
I already knew the meaning of etymology, but apparently you didn't.
So what? "Many words change meaning over time", exactly my point. So no one can be 100% certain that sheol literally meant eternal hellfire in the OT (including you), so it's a matter of
opinion.
It ain't my opinion. I quoted the 1906 Jewish Encyclopedia, Gehenna article, it's good enough for them, that's good enough for me. Of course, since it contradicts your assumptions/presuppositions, it probably isn't for you.
 
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