Do creationist beliefs encourage anti-intellectualism?

[pitabread]

Diversification within a species or creation of completely new species?

Evolution of new species.

Examples? Because the only initiatives I see regarding the topic are those seeking to suppress creationist beliefs.

I reworded that. It should have referred to teaching of scientific subjects like evolution.

If you want to read up on the history of it in the U.S., Wikipedia has an overview: Creation and evolution in public education in the United States - Wikipedia. One of the most well-known was the Butler Act in Tennessee which led to the famous Scopes trial in 1925.

Insofar as suppression of creationist beliefs in the U.S., it's not about suppression of creationism. Rather it's about the fact that public schools cannot endorse specific religious beliefs as per the U.S. Constitution.

 

[AV1611VET]

One of the most well-known was the Butler Act in Tennessee which led to the famous Scopes trial in 1925.

Ya ... with a little help from the AntiChrist Lovers Union.

 

[pitabread]

Ya ... with a little help from the AntiChrist Lovers Union.

The ACLU also defends Christians: ACLU Defense of Religious Practice and Expression

Your attempted slander isn't warranted here.

 

[pitabread]

Pita, I take it you don't want to display the votes publicly?

Nope.

 

[Sidon]

This implies the alternatives have merits or validity. Just because one has a contradictory view, there is no necessitation of merit associated with it.

Whether ideas are valid or have merit is something that must be established on their own.

"""""""This implies the alternatives have merits or validity. Just because one has a contradictory view, there is no necessitation of merit associated with it.""""""""

To deny the alternative argument has merit, is to imply that the original idea or argument must be valid and true.
So, in steps opinion as the final answer and Judge and jury, unless we are dealing with provable science, and not a "theory".

A lot of science is theory taught as truth.
For example, science teaches that there must be a "gene".. a genetic component that causes "Gay".
And what is their scientific proof? They say...>"well, eventually we will find it" "so for now just believe us, as we are Science".

A.) Sorry no

""""""""Whether ideas are valid or have merit is something that must be established on their own.""""""

Who gets to decide if an idea is valid or if the rebuttal is invaid?
Who decides that authority?
It depends not on the subject being argued, but only on where the argument is being held.
Also, why does the authority's personal motivation and point of view get to be the decider for the rest?

Generally, money and power and the army, will be the final authority, vs, morality, if we are talking about a big political equation needing to be solved.
Also, In general..... people are comfort loving sheep who are easily herded into the ideas that cause them the most hurt in the long run.
The devil has made a career out of exploiting that weakness regarding "human nature".
Dictators and Communist and Socialist countries love this "sheep" quality found in most of the population.
Some governments force you to be a sheep, by taking away your right to bear arms .
Some countries lead you to be a sheep by inviting you to stay home, get high, watch the tube, and they'll send you a check each month to keep you there.

If only the Government has a gun, then you better duck.

Which reminds me of a joke.
You can get more accomplished with a gun and a smile then you can with just a smile alone.
I think Putin has that tattoo'd on his body, somewhere.....(is my guess)

 

[Occams Barber]

Anecdotally, I did notice that the among the COVID-19 deniers on this forum were a number of creationists that had previously been posting in this C/E forum.

I associate all of them* with evangelical Christianity although not necessarily individual evangelical Christians or exclusively evangelical Christians. I admit I have no hard info to back up this suspicion. It seems to me that belief in conspiracy begets a tendency to more readily accept other conspiracies.

It appears I'm not alone in this.
When it comes to conspiracy theories, is Christianity part of the problem or part of the solution? - ABC Religion & Ethics
Why are Christians so susceptible to conspiracy? – Baptist News Global
How QAnon Conspiracy Is Spreading In Christian Communities Across The U.S. : NPR
conspiracy theory and christians - Google Search


*

• Climate change denial

• Covid virus conspiracies

• Covid vaccine conspiracies

• The Trump election conspiracy

• The Great Reset conspiracy/globalism

• The Critical Race Theory conspiracy

• The 4G conspiracy (is that still a thing?)

• The Great Gay conspiracy (to convert us all to gay)

OB

 

[Oompa Loompa]

Evolution of new species.



I reworded that. It should have referred to teaching of scientific subjects like evolution.

If you want to read up on the history of it in the U.S., Wikipedia has an overview: Creation and evolution in public education in the United States - Wikipedia. One of the most well-known was the Butler Act in Tennessee which led to the famous Scopes trial in 1925.

Insofar as suppression of creationist beliefs in the U.S., it's not about suppression of creationism. Rather it's about the fact that public schools cannot endorse specific religious beliefs as per the U.S. Constitution.

The article shows one example in which a law prohibiting the teaching of evolution (Butler Act) was struck down as unconstitutional followed by several examples of legislation that barred the teaching of creationism in public schools. It seems dishonest to make an assertion that it is only Creationists who are suppressing the topic of evolution based on one example from almost 100 years ago. When in fact, since 1925 it has been the other way around. Today, a public school teacher can't even bring up the topic of creationism without termination being the end result. Today, any discussion, suggestion, idea, or anything that remotely brings evolution into question and does not conform to the established paradigm will be silenced.

 

[pitabread]

To deny the alternative argument has merit, is to imply that the original idea or argument must be valid and true.
So, in steps opinion as the final answer and Judge and jury, unless we are dealing with provable science, and not a "theory".

There is no such thing as "provable science". Right off the bat, this suggests a misunderstanding of the nature of science.

A lot of science is theory taught as truth.

Truth in science is provisional. Proper science education should include this understanding.

For example, science teaches that there must be a "gene".. a genetic component that causes "Gay".
And what is their scientific proof? They say...>"well, eventually we will find it" "so for now just believe us, as we are Science".

This is a gross strawman. Homosexuality is actually considered a multi-variate trait which appears to include complex genetic factors based on numerous studies of the subject. Studies of which you were actually interested, you could probably look up on Google Scholar.

Who gets to decide if an idea is valid or if the rebuttal is invaid?
Who decides that authority?
It depends not on the subject being argued, but only on where the argument is being held.
Also, why does the authority's personal motivation and point of view get to be the decider for the rest?

This is typically the provision of whichever governance body happens to be regulating school curriculums in a given jurisdiction, coupled with the legal authority governing the same.

 

[pitabread]

The article shows one example in which a law prohibiting the teaching of evolution (Butler Act) was struck down as unconstitutional followed by several examples of legislation that barred the teaching of creationism in public schools. It seems dishonest to make an assertion that it is only Creationists who are suppressing the topic of evolution based on one example from almost 100 years ago. When in fact, since 1925 it has been the other way around.

There is more than a single example. Historically speaking there have been multiple laws regarding this in various states.

The Wikipedia article I linked to covers this.

Today, a public school teacher can't even bring up the topic of creationism without termination being the end result.

That depends on the context.

Creationism could be taught in schools in the a secular context (e.g. a comparative religious class). Promotion of specific religious beliefs in public schools is a violation of U.S. Constitutional law.

If you have a problem with that, take it up with the authors of the Constitution.

 

[AV1611VET]

The ACLU also defends Christians: ACLU Defense of Religious Practice and Expression

Even Ted Bundy saved a few peoples' lives.

 

[AV1611VET]

Nope.

Okay.

 

[Oompa Loompa]

There is more than a single example. Historically speaking there have been multiple laws regarding this in various states.

The Wikipedia article I linked to covers this.



That depends on the context.

Creationism could be taught in schools in the a secular context (e.g. a comparative religious class). Promotion of specific religious beliefs in public schools is a violation of U.S. Constitutional law.

If you have a problem with that, take it up with the authors of the Constitution.

Name one law that still exists today that has yet to be tossed out. When every single piece of legislation supporting intelligent design is met with lawsuits until such legislation is repealed, how can you possibly suggest it is creationists who are doing the suppressing when in fact, since 1925, it has entirely been creationists ideas that has been suppressed?

 

[pitabread]

Name one law that still exists today that has yet to be tossed out.

I never said there were current laws.

If you-read the OP, I stated this:

Historically there have been government led initiatives to suppress scientific teaching contradicting creationist beliefs. This includes laws in the United States suppressing the teaching of evolution, as well as similar laws and initiatives in other countries.
​

I was pointing to the historical context of attempts to suppress the teaching of evolution.

 

[Sidon]

There is not such thing as "provable science". Right off the bat, this suggests a misunderstanding of the nature of science.
Truth in science is provisional. Proper science education should include this understanding.This is a gross strawman. Homosexuality is actually considered a multi-variate trait This is typically the provision of whichever governance body happens to be regulating school curriculums in a given jurisdiction, coupled with the legal authority governing the same.

""""""There is not such thing as "provable science". Right off the bat, this suggests a misunderstanding of the nature of science.""""""


Math is a science.
Its provable, pitabread.
Ask any "proof".
Ask any equation.
3x = 21

X =7 , all day and all night long.


'"""""""Truth in science is provisional. Proper science education should include this understanding.""""""

Fluid truth, isn't truth anymore then fluid sexuality is moral.
C'mon.

That cold is the absence of heat does not prove that Heat does not exist.
That you can't seen UV rays, does not keep them from burning you to a red skinned crisp if you stay in the sun tooooo long.

Pragmatism along with its immoral equivalency = "if it does not hurt anyone, its ok to do it", is directly connected to the Satanic Bible.
Have you ever read it?
It has one "law" in it, pitabread.

"""""Do what tho wilt, shall be the whole of the law""""

Paraphrase...>"If it feels good, do it, consequences be damned" "there is no God , so, no worries, be happy in your sin and depravity".

That's secularism, or pragmatism, or....."the gray area"......which teaches that there is no right but might, no truth but opinion, and my army says you will do what we tell you, now get on your knees and beg.

In the Dark ages, you had a lot of this, all over Europe.
People think that the Romans were the real enemies of Christians.
Rome was an amateur, compared to the "dark age" religion..
It was Religion disguised as "god".
It would still be burning people who didnt obey it, but, times caught up with it.

Islam is the new dark ages that mostly operates its darkness out of the middle east.
Just ask any Islamic woman to try to explain why "allah" wont let her into his "paradise", yet he wants her to blow herself up killing jews and infidels....
I asked a islamic fundamentalist about that once, and he told me...>"well you see, ... that is true, but you have to understand that one day, allah, will change that situation".

Uh, huh.

A.) when pigs fly.


"""""""This is a gross strawman. Homosexuality is actually considered a multi-variate trait """""


Yes, Science created that bumper sticker. You like it , huh?
Science had to come up with a new one, as the ...."we are still looking for the gay gene", finally wore out its welcome and stalled in the air, after 60 years.


""""""""This is typically the provision of whichever governance body happens to be regulating school curriculums in a given jurisdiction, coupled with the legal authority governing the same."""""

If you control the minds of the Youth, you can create the next generation according to the master plan.

In the early 60s, Nikita Khrushchev, told JFK, (paraphrase) >we will destroy the USA without firing a shot. We will hook the American Youth on rock music, inappropriate contentography, and alt sexuality, and in just a few generations, your country will decline and then fall as perverted darkness ....watch and see<.

 

[royal priest]

violation of the U.S. constitution (government endorsement of religious beliefs).

The Constitution endorses religious belief. It's one of those inalienable rights which the Constitution recognizes as being endowed upon all men by their Creator.

 

[pitabread]

The Constitution endorses religious belief. It's one of those inalienable rights which the Constitution recognizes as being endowed upon all men by their Creator.

The Constitutions also prohibits the U.S. Government from endorsing a specific religion or religions via legislation. And this is the relevant aspect when it comes to past bills/lawsuits regarding the teaching of creationism in public schools.

This seems to be the point every creationist in this thread keeps missing.

 

[pitabread]

""""""There is not such thing as "provable science". Right off the bat, this suggests a misunderstanding of the nature of science.""""""


Math is a science.
Its provable, pitabread.
Ask any "proof".
Ask any equation.
3x = 21

X =7 , all day and all night long.


'"""""""Truth in science is provisional. Proper science education should include this understanding.""""""

Fluid truth, isn't truth anymore then fluid sexuality is moral.
C'mon.

That cold is the absence of heat does not prove that Heat does not exist.
That you can't seen UV rays, does not keep them from burning you to a red skinned crisp if you stay in the sun tooooo long.

Pragmatism along with its immoral equivalency = "if it does not hurt anyone, its ok to do it", is directly connected to the Satanic Bible.
Have you ever read it?
It has one "law" in it, pitabread.

"""""Do what tho wilt, shall be the whole of the law""""

Paraphrase...>"If it feels good, do it, consequences be damned" "there is no God , so, no worries, be happy in your sin and depravity".

That's secularism, or pragmatism, or....."the gray area"......which teaches that there is no right but might, no truth but opinion, and my army says you will do what we tell you, now get on your knees and beg.

In the Dark ages, you had a lot of this, all over Europe.
People think that the Romans were the real enemies of Christians.
Rome was an amateur, compared to the "dark age" religion..
It was Religion disguised as "god".
It would still be burning people who didnt obey it, but, times caught up with it.

Islam is the new dark ages that mostly operates its darkness out of the middle east.
Just ask any Islamic woman to try to explain why "allah" wont let her into his "paradise", yet he wants her to blow herself up killing jews and infidels....
I asked a islamic fundamentalist about that once, and he told me...>"well you see, ... that is true, but you have to understand that one day, allah, will change that situation".

Uh, huh.

A.) when pigs fly.


"""""""This is a gross strawman. Homosexuality is actually considered a multi-variate trait """""


Yes, Science created that bumper sticker. You like it , huh?
Science had to come up with a new one, as the ...."we are still looking for the gay gene", finally wore out its welcome and stalled in the air, after 60 years.


""""""""This is typically the provision of whichever governance body happens to be regulating school curriculums in a given jurisdiction, coupled with the legal authority governing the same."""""

If you control the minds of the Youth, you can create the next generation according to the master plan.

In the early 60s, Nikita Khrushchev, told JFK, (paraphrase) >we will destroy the USA without firing a shot. We will hook the American Youth on rock music, inappropriate contentography, and alt sexuality, and in just a few generations, your country will decline and then fall as perverted darkness ....watch and see<.

If you're going to break up your responses like this, can I ask that you use the forum's quote feature when formatting your replies? It's a bit of a mess to try to read your posts in their current format and I'm not going to go through all of that as it is.

Thanks.

 

[Ponderous Curmudgeon]

How many years has it been now, that Creationism is suppressed (to put it mildly) in the classroom?

How many years since creationism was exposed to be inappropriate pedagologially?

 

[AV1611VET]

The Constitutions also prohibits the U.S. Government from endorsing a specific religion or religions via legislation.

Creationism isn't a religion -- it is an act of HISTORY.

Is evolution a religion?

 

[Fervent]

How are we defining "anti-intellectualism?" As a creationist, I believe that creationism denies empiricism and some aspects of theoretical science. If we mean to say you must be pro-science to be an intellectual, then creationism excludes intellectuality. If, however, we mean to say that creationism denies using our faculties of reason, logical faculties, and argumentation then absolutely not. We simply take God's word as the final authority rather than human speculation.