anyone else not like Sunday worship?

Yeshua HaDerekh

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You're in the wrong section. I trust the Orthodox opinion on this subject about as much as I trust the Seventh Day Adventist's. Your loyalty to your denomination supersedes any chance at a rational discourse on the subject.

All calendars were lunar before the Romans made the first solar calendar. Sorry to break it to you, man, but that's the truth. The "week" was a function of lunar cycles. Otherwise, the sabbath is an arbitrary designation, and you can call it whatever day you want.

It's the only way that the Day of Atonement can always be on the same day of the year, yet always be a sabbath. It's an impossibility for a solar calendar, and an inevitability for a lunar calendar.

As far as I know, Baptist's do not teach the lunar Sabbath theory and Judaism itself fully disagrees with you. There is no scriptural, historical or any factual basis of it...in Judaism, the new moon was used each month for Rosh Chodesh but not for the weekly Shabbat which was on a 7 day cycle.
 
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tall73

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The Day of Atonement was always on the same day of the year and the same day of the week, because it was part of a lunar calendar. The idea of it being a special floating Sabbath that landed on and off the regular sabbaths on different years is not supported by the text. There is no evidence for this idea.

@Yeshua HaDerekh
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There is evidence for the idea that it is a floating Sabbath:

Lev 23:23 And the LORD spoke to Moses, saying,
Lev 23:24 “Speak to the people of Israel, saying,
In the seventh month, on the first day of the month, you shall observe a day of solemn rest, a memorial proclaimed with blast of trumpets, a holy convocation.
Lev 23:25 You shall not do any ordinary work, and you shall present a food offering to the LORD.”



Lev 23:26 And the LORD spoke to Moses, saying,
Lev 23:27 “Now on the tenth day of this seventh month is the Day of Atonement. It shall be for you a time of holy convocation, and you shall afflict yourselves and present a food offering to the LORD.
Lev 23:28 And you shall not do any work on that very day, for it is a Day of Atonement, to make atonement for you before the LORD your God.
Lev 23:29 For whoever is not afflicted on that very day shall be cut off from his people.
Lev 23:30 And whoever does any work on that very day, that person I will destroy from among his people.
Lev 23:31 You shall not do any work. It is a statute forever throughout your generations in all your dwelling places.



Both the trumpets and the Day of Atonement were days of solemn rest. One was on the first of the month. One was on the tenth of the month. They cannot both be weekly Sabbaths.

 
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prodromos

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@Yeshua HaDerekh
@prodromos

There is evidence for the idea that it is a floating Sabbath:

Lev 23:23 And the LORD spoke to Moses, saying,
Lev 23:24 “Speak to the people of Israel, saying,
In the seventh month, on the first day of the month, you shall observe a day of solemn rest, a memorial proclaimed with blast of trumpets, a holy convocation.
Lev 23:25 You shall not do any ordinary work, and you shall present a food offering to the LORD.”



Lev 23:26 And the LORD spoke to Moses, saying,
Lev 23:27 “Now on the tenth day of this seventh month is the Day of Atonement. It shall be for you a time of holy convocation, and you shall afflict yourselves and present a food offering to the LORD.
Lev 23:28 And you shall not do any work on that very day, for it is a Day of Atonement, to make atonement for you before the LORD your God.
Lev 23:29 For whoever is not afflicted on that very day shall be cut off from his people.
Lev 23:30 And whoever does any work on that very day, that person I will destroy from among his people.
Lev 23:31 You shall not do any work. It is a statute forever throughout your generations in all your dwelling places.



Both the trumpets and the Day of Atonement were days of solemn rest. One was on the first of the month. One was on the tenth of the month. They cannot both be weekly Sabbaths.
Both those days are complete "rests", no work of any kind to be done regardless of what day of the week they fall. These days are referred to as annual Sabbaths. The weekly Sabbath is not set by the day on which those annual Sabbaths fall. Some years you will have two consecutive days where no work is allowed when an annual Sabbath falls just prior or just after the weekly Sabbath. Some years they will coincide.
 
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tall73

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Both those days are complete "rests", no work of any kind to be done regardless of what day of the week they fall. These days are referred to as annual Sabbaths. The weekly Sabbath is not set by the day on which those annual Sabbaths fall. Some years you will have two consecutive days where no work is allowed when an annual Sabbath falls just prior or just after the weekly Sabbath. Some years they will coincide.

Yes, that was the point. They cannot be arranged to fall on weekly Sabbaths because they are not 7 days apart. They are annual sabbaths, and not keyed to the weekly.
 
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GOD Shines Forth!

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Not to be a Judaizer, but I do wish that Baptists at least would go back to Saturday worship, just because Sunday was something instigated by the Roman Catholic Church, and it's kinda like.. even though we're not Catholic, we're obeying a Catholic doctrine that they invented themselves. I don't like the idea of obeying the Pope at all.

Most churches pick Sunday because people tend to have that as free time. I doubt many do it to follow the RC Church. It's simply being practical.
 
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Jamdoc

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Most churches pick Sunday because people tend to have that as free time. I doubt many do it to follow the RC Church. It's simply being practical.
Probably, but at the same time the RCC sees it as a sign that we recognize their authority.
 
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nonaeroterraqueous

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I doubt that. You appear to be reading the same Scriptures with a very different understanding.
If you don't want to discuss it, then that's okay. No hard feelings. Naturally, I won't be convinced by your lack of effort, but I'm not of the opinion that every hill is worth dying on.
 
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nonaeroterraqueous

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I'm not arguing against Baptist theology. I'm arguing against your theology, which to the best of my knowledge is not taught by Baptists anywhere. Also, Yeshua HaDerekh may be Eastern Orthodox, but he is also Jewish. He has very good knowledge of Hebrew traditions.
I'd say you're both knowledgeable of traditions. Neither of you offered anything of substance. HaDerekh offered nothing but mockery and arrogance. I know why I think as I do. All I know about your position is that you believe what you do because someone told you that's what people have always believed.
 
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prodromos

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I'd say you're both knowledgeable of traditions. Neither of you offered anything of substance.
I don't know why you imagine you have. Nothing you have offered has been substantiated.
I know why I think as I do.
As do I.
All I know about your position is that you believe what you do because someone told you that's what people have always believed.
Then you are wrong about this too.
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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If you want to be arrogant and condescending, then I'm sure you can find a suitable forum for non-Christians, where such behavior belongs.

Truth is truth...some can't handle it...
 
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actionsub

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I thought for sure this was going to be about bad preaching and worse singing, lol. That might make me not like Sunday worship.

Did Baptists ever worship on Saturday? Maybe I misunderstood. Besides, I think Christians were observing the Lord's Day as worship before there was an actual Pope, but I'm up for correction on that.

There are small sects of Seventh-Day Baptists.
Seventh Day Baptist General Conference | A Baptist Church That's A Little Different
https://www.isdba.org/

And TBH, William Miller, who started the Adventist movement, was a Baptist preacher in upstate New York. (The whole seventh-day part of 7th Day Adventism was a later development...)
 
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FreeinChrist

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ADVISOR HAT


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This thread was started as a question for Baptists and was started in the Baptist Congregational forum.

As a number of nonBaptists responded, this thread has been moved to Denomination Specific Theology


Folks, you need to respect the Congregational forums. They are for the member of that specific congregation. The site rule is this:

Congregational Forum Restrictions
Members who do not truly share the core beliefs and teachings of a specific congregational forum may post in fellowship or ask questions, but they may not teach or debate within the forum.​



Please do not make us give warnings or do a forum specific ban.​
 
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BobRyan

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Not to be a Judaizer, but I do wish that Baptists at least would go back to Saturday worship, just because Sunday was something instigated by the Roman Catholic Church, and it's kinda like.. even though we're not Catholic, we're obeying a Catholic doctrine that they invented themselves. I don't like the idea of obeying the Pope at all.

The Bible says "the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH)" Ex 20:10
 
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I was raised in a strict Saturday sabbath home, sent to SDA schools. The SDA make a big issue of Saturday sabbath keeping based on the fourth commandment. To me it isn't the day, it is the fact that we take a day to rest and worship the Lord.
 
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BobRyan

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I was raised in a strict Saturday sabbath home, sent to SDA schools. The SDA make a big issue of Saturday sabbath keeping based on the fourth commandment. To me it isn't the day, it is the fact that we take a day to rest and worship the Lord.

To me it is a question of what the Word of God actually says - and so far no one has a text saying it is "any one day in seven that you wish to pick".

Even the Baptist Confession of Faith section 22 does not say that.
 
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Albion

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Not to be a Judaizer, but I do wish that Baptists at least would go back to Saturday worship, just because Sunday was something instigated by the Roman Catholic Church, and it's kinda like.. even though we're not Catholic, we're obeying a Catholic doctrine that they invented themselves. I don't like the idea of obeying the Pope at all.
The decision to make the Lord's Day the principle day of Christian worship precedes the coming of the Roman Catholic Church.
 
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The Liturgist

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Not to be a Judaizer, but I do wish that Baptists at least would go back to Saturday worship, just because Sunday was something instigated by the Roman Catholic Church, and it's kinda like.. even though we're not Catholic, we're obeying a Catholic doctrine that they invented themselves. I don't like the idea of obeying the Pope at all.

That’s not true at all. The Roman Catholic Church did not even exist when worship began on the first day of the week to celebrate the resurrection of our Lord.

The Roman Catholic Church as a discrete entity only emerged at some point between the 9th and 11th centuries.
 
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tall73

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The decision to make the Lord's Day the principle day of Christian worship precedes the coming of the Roman Catholic Church.

Yes, certainly the practice occurred earlier. For those wanting to understand the diversity of practice in the early church this thread in the law and sabbath section lists historic statements regarding both Sabbath and Sunday observance in early centuries:

How common was the observance of the Jewish Sabbath among early Church Christians?

If anybody has additional references, please post them. We can go through eventually and put them all in Chronological order to see what we can glean from it.

Some regional patterns may also be present.
 
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