Taking Questions on Creationism

[inquiring mind]

For the record, I'm completely secure in my own philosophical beliefs. I'm not about to convert any time soon, if that's what you think will happen.

The fundamentals of Christianity are completely illogical to me.

That's okay... logic is not the main reason to convert anyway.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oh, I've given up on presenting evidence that you'd recognize anyway. I'm just saying that your lack of understanding, and the inability of evolutionists in general to 'actually' connect deep-time links, should by default make Creation the more reasonable choice for our being here. There is no evidence for your belief beyond speculation.

I doubt if you even understand the concept of evidence. I have yet to meet a creationist that does. Do not make false claims about others. In the sciences one must use scientific evidence. It is very well defined and there seriously is none for the creationist position.

And no, it is a falsehood to make your last claim. I will assume that your falsehood arose from ignorance and was not an attempt to openly lie. Once again I offer to go over the concept of scientific evidence with you.

And, why should I take your interpretation over mine... when you don't even believe in God.

Because my interpretation does not call God a liar. Creationists simply do not understand the sciences well enough to see how they are doing this. Creationism is blasphemy.

Yeah, right

Well that is quite the refutation. Once again I can tell that you do not understand the scientific method or the concept of evidence. I sincerely offer to discuss these with you. If you understand these basic concepts, that should not go against your Christian beliefs, you will see how all of your claims are false.

 

[pitabread]

That's okay... logic is not the main reason to convert anyway.

Oh, I know. But it's not something I can ignore either.

 

[SelfSim]

That's okay... logic is not the main reason to convert anyway.

When last I looked, 'reason' invokes logic ..(?)

 

[Hans Blaster]

It's telomeres were not moving toward separation; not like they are today.

Care to elaborate what you mean about telomeres moving toward separation (in humans) today?

 

[inquiring mind]

I doubt if you even understand the concept of evidence. I have yet to meet a creationist that does.

I bet you're yet to meet 'anyone' that does.

In the sciences one must use scientific evidence. It is very well defined and there seriously is none for the creationist position.

It's not the scientific evidence that's a problem. I don't care how defined it is; it's the conclusions drawn from it that can result in false claims.

And no, it is a falsehood to make your last claim. I will assume that your falsehood arose from ignorance and was not an attempt to openly lie. Once again I offer to go over the concept of scientific evidence with you.

The 'concept of scientific evidence' doesn't necessarily equal intelligence.

Because my interpretation does not call God a liar. Creationists simply do not understand the sciences well enough to see how they are doing this. Creationism is blasphemy.

And yet you do not believe in God.

Well that is quite the refutation. Once again I can tell that you do not understand the scientific method or the concept of evidence. I sincerely offer to discuss these with you. If you understand these basic concepts, that should not go against your Christian beliefs, you will see how all of your claims are false.

Yeah, right

 

[inquiring mind]

When last I looked, 'reason' invokes logic ..(?)

A relationship with God is by grace.

 

[pitabread]

And yet you do not believe in God.

One does not have to believe in God to see the problems posed by creationist theology.

 

[SelfSim]

A relationship with God is by grace.

'By grace' is still a logical reason though(?)

 

[Subduction Zone]

I bet you're yet to meet 'anyone' that does.

On the contrary, most people have no problem at all discussing the topics. It is creationists that are scared to death to even discuss evidence. I think most know that they are wrong. Deep down inside they know that what they are saying is false. If they understood the concept of evidence they would have no excuse.

It's not the scientific evidence that's a problem. I don't care how defined it is; it's the conclusions drawn from it that can result in false claims.

If you understood the concept of evidence then you could demonstrate claims to be false. How do you think that we know that life is not the product of your sort of creationism? By the way, the standards of evidence that I use are the same that makes your communication here possible.

The 'concept of scientific evidence' doesn't necessarily equal intelligence.

I never claimed that it did. I never implied that you lack intelligence. You lack education. That can be corrected.

And yet you do not believe in God.

And yet I also understand many aspects of your Bible better than you do. In fact the reason that many atheists are atheists is because they understand the Bible.

Yeah, right

Please, you only confirm my claims by running away. Here is an easy way to show that I am wrong. Learn what is and what is not evidence. I do not use "my definition". I will find several reliable sources that support me. This is a concept that you can learn. Living in fear only will get you nowhere.

 

[Subduction Zone]

'By grace' is still a logical reason though(?)

The interpretation of that is going to vary by sect. For example if I remember correctly Calvinists not only believe that "grace" which enables faith comes from God, it is God's choice who gets it and it is chosen before one is born. That seems to make the religion rather pointless.

 

[inquiring mind]

On the contrary, most people have no problem at all discussing the topics. It is creationists that are scared to death to even discuss evidence. I think most know that they are wrong. Deep down inside they know that what they are saying is false. If they understood the concept of evidence they would have no excuse.

So, by most people you mean those that agree with you already?

If you understood the concept of evidence then you could demonstrate claims to be false. How do you think that we know that life is not the product of your sort of creationism?

Because you have all the answers???

I never claimed that it did. I never implied that you lack intelligence. You lack education. That can be corrected.

Well, that's good to know.

And yet I also understand many aspects of your Bible better than you do. In fact the reason that many atheists are atheists is because they understand the Bible.

Atheists are atheists because they have no relationship with God.

Please, you only confirm my claims by running away. Here is an easy way to show that I am wrong. Learn what is and what is not evidence. I do not use "my definition". I will find several reliable sources that support me. This is a concept that you can learn. Living in fear only will get you nowhere.

Yes, I'm sure you would:
2 Timothy 4:3-4
3 For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.

 

[inquiring mind]

'By grace' is still a logical reason though(?)

Well... it's God's grace, not ours.

 

[Subduction Zone]

So, by most people you mean those that agree with you already?

Nope, by the way you are being rude. Making false assumptions about others leads to breaking the Ninth Commandment.

Because you have all the answers???

I never said or even implied that.

Well, that's good to know.

Yes, it is. Are you still afraid?

Atheists are atheists because they have no relationship with God.

It is not possible to have a "relationship" with that which does not exist. But from my perspective we are the same. In my eyes you do not have a "relationship with God" either. In fact when you claim that you do you put a burden of proof upon yourself. How would you demonstrate this?

Yes, I'm sure you would:
2 Timothy 4:3-4
3 For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.

Yes, that is a defensive verse. It is not uncommon among holy books. It is a sign that the writers were not sure of themselves. If one was writing "the truth" there would be no need of such verses. Would you be converted by Hinduism if a follower of that religion quoted their equivalent of that to you? I hope not. Muslims surely have similar verses. Would that make you a Muslim? Again, I hope not. Now see if you can understand how this applies to your own religion. That is a losing argument.


And are you still afraid to learn what is and what is not evidence? The only thing that you gain by avoiding learning is that you can become a master of the Ostrich Defense. Burying your head in the sand only convinces the person hiding. It does not do any good.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Well... it's God's grace, not ours.

Perhaps you might want to tell us what your interpretation of the word "grace" is. I don't think that you mean that he does not bump into things. Too many Christians cannot define that term.

 

[SelfSim]

Well... it's God's grace, not ours.

Yes .. I can see that's your reason.

 

[AV1611VET]

Care to elaborate what you mean about telomeres moving toward separation (in humans) today?

Dying.

 

[inquiring mind]

Perhaps you might want to tell us what your interpretation of the word "grace" is. I don't think that you mean that he does not bump into things. Too many Christians cannot define that term.

In Western Christian theology, grace is "the love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not necessarily because of anything we have done to earn it". It is not a created substance of any kind. ... It is an attribute of God that is most manifest in the salvation of sinners.
Grace in Christianity - Wikipedia

 

[SelfSim]

Dying.

SS#4: Is that a creationist literal (Biblical) transcription?

 

[Hans Blaster]

Dying.

I am unaware that this is part of the death process for individuals (something about telomeres). From the context, it seemed like a reference to something happening to whole species post 4005 BC. I've never heard of it, but my knowledge of biology is not perfect.