LDS Mormons Take Satan's Deception From Genesis

[He is the way]

Right. It is in Jesus Christ that God and man are restored to fellowship. The Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost are one. And Christ and the church are one, like a husband and his wife. But the way Mormonism interprets those scriptures is a perversion. Such beautiful passages have nothing to do with celestial sex, multiple gods, other planets, spirit brothers, exaltation of man, or any other vile, farfetched blasphemy.

I very much like your spoiler. Thanks for that. We do have a divine nature:

(New Testament | 2 Peter 1:3 - 9)

3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

 

[Jamesone5]

Truth is in plain site, let alone in the Bible, but I wouldn't think Paul would be so arrogant as to refer to his own writings as being scripture in the class of the one's he was obviously speaking about and grew up with. In one place he evens says he had no commandment from God about a certain thing, but thought you should listen to him anyway since he was approved of Him.

You are really dismissing the Power of Inspiration from the Holy Spirit. Paul did not arrogantly think his letter would be would be part of what we now call Scripture when he wrote this letter to Timothy. But, he was moved by the Holy Spirit to write those words, based on what scriptures he had available to him at the time. Other men in the future who were also Inspired--- added his Inspired words to make up our Bibles as they were led by God.

I can understand this as I write myself, and when you are Inspired by the Holy Spirit--- the words flow forth. No, I of course, do not write sculpture but I am moved to write letters to others based on their particular problems and advise based on the words of scripture.

 

[Jamesone5]

Sure. Truth can be found anywhere. So can falsehoods. Sometimes they're found alongside one another. Wheat and tares in the same field, that kind of thing. This seems quite uncontroversial to me.
Well, the reason I trust any portion of the Bible at all is because I trust God, who has given me cause to do so. That would apply, then, to any so-called scripture. The pattern here is looking to the source—God—and not the book, as the ultimate source of the answer.
Well, we do have to have a standard against which to measure. You're right about that. In the Restored Gospel, the standard is revelation from God. If that's one's anchor, it's hard to go wrong. In other religions, there may be a different standard.
Well, if you are perpetually dissatisfied in your search, that's a good indicator that you're encountering an impediment. That isn't to say that discontinuing a search and declaring success actually means you've succeeded; it only speaks to the question of discerning the existence of an impediment.

I look to the Source of truth in my prayers and for about 25 years now, He tells me to look to His Word--The Bible.

For me I had a definite hunger for His Word instilled in me. When my son died, I had the Mormon quad [since I was Mormon] and the only thing that could bring me any sort of relief {the start of Peace] --was ONLY through the Bible. And, it has continued that way for a quarter of a Century.

I have found one factor in looking for truth and that is the fact that I can proudly say that a problem in the Bible looks like a real problem--but then it is just me telling God that I am the source of Truth--not God. Then He moves me to go to the resources that I have on hand to study it further--for that understanding.

Dissatisfied in my search?
Hardly, as it is all based on the Bible.

 

[Scott Husted]

You are really dismissing the Power of Inspiration from the Holy Spirit. Paul did not arrogantly think his letter would be would be part of what we now call Scripture when he wrote this letter to Timothy. But, he was moved by the Holy Spirit to write those words, based on what scriptures he had available to him at the time. Other men in the future who were also Inspired--- added his Inspired words to make up our Bibles as they were led by God.

I can understand this as I write myself, and when you are Inspired by the Holy Spirit--- the words flow forth. No, I of course, do not write sculpture but I am moved to write letters to others based on their particular problems and advise based on the words of scripture.

For me it's the dismissing of Paul's arrogance, which is what I said.

Many speak by the spirit let alone write never knowing they had, and even darkness he makes light before us.

 

[Jamesone5]

For me it's the dismissing of Paul's arrogance, which is what I said.

Many speak by the spirit let alone write never knowing they had, and even darkness he makes light before us.

That is a good way to describe it as I never though of that----we should be always seeking the Light.

 

[Scott Husted]

That is a good way to describe it as I never though of that----we should be always seeking the Light.

The single eye ... makes all things pure.

 

[Sam81]

I very much like your spoiler. Thanks for that. We do have a divine nature:

(New Testament | 2 Peter 1:3 - 9)

3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

Those scriptures do not mean anything close to what Mormonism teaches. The way you interpret them is completely contrary to everything that the Holy Spirit represents. We are partakers of the divine nature in that we have been called out of sin and will be made Holy even as He is Holy. And the precious promises is everlasting life and fellowship with God. Such beautiful passages have nothing to do with being a god over our own planet!

The writings of that charlatan takes what the Bible teaches and perverts it to mean something that is not in keeping with the truth. That man was a scammer and well known as a compulsive liar who from an early age was always trying to take advantage of people and manipulate others for personal gain.

Let me know when that temple in Missouri gets built.

 

[Peter1000]

​

Isa_7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Mat_1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Exo 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Mat_22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

Mar 14:61 But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
Mar 14:62 And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
Mar 14:63 Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
Mar 14:64 Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.
Mar 14:65 And some began to spit on him, and to cover his face, and to buffet him, and to say unto him, Prophesy: and the servants did strike him with the palms of their hands.

It was Jesus---the IAM-- that spoke to Moses and led the children of Israel, gave the commandments. The Priests knew what Jesus meant when He said I am.

What has any of these scriprures go to do about: Is Jesus invisible.
Just answer this question: Is Jesus invisible to anyone at this time?

 

[Peter1000]

Am I off my rocker for thinking this way?---BoJ

You words not mine.

And are you in heaven to spritually see Jesus? Are we both here on earth where we can see the Grand Canyon, if we want to?

You make these arguments -----well, you said it about the rocker.

I do make these arguments and they are good arguments.

Of course we are not in heaven to see Jesus (spiritually or physically), but this does not prove that he is invisible. I agree he is invisible to us, not being in heaven, but he is not invisible to those in heaven. Right? So just because we cannot see him, not being in heaven, it certainly does not prove he is invisible.

So here is your post 43
Uh, do you see Him right now?
Gee, do you think He might be invisible because you cannot see Him?

So you are arguing that because we cant see him right now, he is invisible.

My argument says: Just because we can't see him now, does not prove he is invisible.
Those in heaven can see him fine.

So your argument is not true. It is like saying, the grand canyon is invisible because we cannot see it now. Yes, you are right, we can go and see it so we can prove that it is not invisible. And yes, we can go to heaven and prove that Jesus is not invisible, so your argument does not stand.

Try again to prove that Jesus is invisible.

 

[Peter1000]

Those scriptures do not mean anything close to what Mormonism teaches. The way you interpret them is completely contrary to everything that the Holy Spirit represents. We are partakers of the divine nature in that we have been called out of sin and will be made Holy even as He is Holy. And the precious promises is everlasting life and fellowship with God. Such beautiful passages have nothing to do with being a god over our own planet!

The writings of that charlatan takes what the Bible teaches and perverts it to mean something that is not in keeping with the truth. That man was a scammer and well known as a
compulsive liar who from an early age was always trying to take advantage of people and manipulate others for personal gain.

Let me know when that temple in Missouri gets built.

The scriptures say that we can be as perfect as God is perfect. In fact he demands that we are
as perfect as he is. (Matthew 5:48)
The scriptures say that we can be as holy as God is holy. In fact he demands it. (1 Peter 1:16)
The scriptures say that according to God's own divine power, he has given us all that pertains
to life and godliness, and Jesus has called us to this glory and given it unto us, so we can be
as godly as he is, and our Father is. (2 Peter 1:3)
The scriptures say that we are promised that because of this godliness, we can be partakers of
God's divine nature, having overcome this corrupt world. (2 Peter 1:4)

I have many other scriptures that detail what manner of men we can become and the wonderful qualities that we can have if we live the fullness of the gospel and that grace is multiplied unto us to help us achieve that godly stature.

Like I say, the Bible is full of this doctrine, you just choose to ignore it because how you were brought up and how you interpret the scriptures from men and women who deny that your godliness can amount to nothing. That is not what the scriptures tell us.

We are heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Jesus Christ of all that the Father has. What the Father has to give us as heirs is mind boggling and I suspect you have never considered these things.
As it is written: Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

And I will add, those that pertain to godliness, and partake of the divine nature, and overcome this corrupt world, and sit with Jesus in his throne, and receive the glory that he has promised to give those who obtain the same qualities that Jesus and God have. Only those.

 

[Peter1000]

He can be. So can Satan. Jesus is different now as He is human and the Father never was nor ever will be. Jesus remains God, and remains human. Don't even try to figure it out---you can't. Jesus was with the disciples on the road to Emmaus---after they were seated at the table and He broke the bread---He immediately disappeared right in front of them. No conundrum! He disappeared!

I agree that Jesus can become invisible when he wishes to, but his general form is visible.

And for all those that believe God is made up of 3 Persons, you cannot say that Jesus is God, because he is only 1/3 of God. The other 2/3 being God the Father and God the Holy Spirit.
So the best you can say as a trinitarian is that God is God.

If you say Jesus is God then you have to admit that there are 2 other Gods, which I am sure you are not willing to admit.

For members of the Church of Jesus Christ, we can say with out a problem that Jesus is God, because he is one of 3 Gods that make up the Godhead. So Jesus is God and God his Father is God and the Holy Ghost is God, all 3 are Gods, each one is God.

But if all 3 are in 1 God, then you cannot say Jesus is God because your God is made up of 3 Persons, not just Jesus. You can say that Jesus is a Person of the triune God. This would be appropriate, but not "Jesus is God", because according to you he is not the sum-total of your God.

 

[Peter1000]

Right. It is in Jesus Christ that God and man are restored to fellowship. The Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost are one. And Christ and the church are one, like a husband and his wife. But the way Mormonism interprets those scriptures is a perversion. Such beautiful passages have nothing to do with celestial sex, multiple gods, other planets, spirit brothers, exaltation of man, or any other vile, farfetched blasphemy.

Sorry, if The Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost are one, then you have to say: The Father, Son, and the Hoy Ghost and the church are one, like a husband and his wife. You cannot just separate Jesus from the Truine God as you please, or when it is inconvenient.

BTW how do these scriptures have anything to do with celestial sex, multiple gods, other planets, spirit brother, exaltation of man or any other vile, fartetched blasphemies. They only have to do with how you and I can be as one as God and Jesus are one. So answer the question:

How can you and I be one as God and Jesus are one? That is the question. It is simple and sublime just like the prayer Jesus offered to his God and Father just before he went to his passion. So how can you and I be one, as Jesus and God are one?

 

[Peter1000]

This scripture doesn't present a problem at all for those who hold to the proper understanding of the Godhead. John 20:17 is beautiful in that the recently risen Jesus acknowledges what His work on the cross and victory over death had accomplished. Indeed, His Father is now our Father.

As for His God being our God, notice how He said, "Do not touch me yet." Jesus had not yet ascended into Heaven and reunited with the Father, with Whom in the beginning He had shared much Glory. (John 17:5) You see, though Jesus was the second Person of the Trinity, the Son of man was humble and obedient to the death. Indeed, Philippians 2:6 tells us that Jesus, being in the form of God, emptied Himself, choosing not to retain His equality with God. This is why He couldn't yet be touched, and it's why He referred to the Father as His God (otherwise He would still have equality with God!).

But now Jesus has regained His glory; He has ascended. He's with God, and IS God. And to Him alone belongs all praise and glory forever and ever. Amen.


This is a very serious matter. My words are not bitter, they are extremely serious.

Serious or not, you are certainly not holding out an olive branch with the intention of loving us. So use this picture on other sites, but on this one, you should use some other picture to portray your real thoughts and intents. It is not for me to say, just suggesting.

The question is not: "As for His God being our God". That is given. The question is: Why did Jesus say he was going to "my God"? He if obviously telling us the he (Jesus) has a God, and it is the same God as "our God".

I see you use the word "reunited" with the Father. Do you think that he was somehow absorbed back into the Father so that they are now 2 persons in 1 God again.

OR is it like we think, he was reunited with the Father, they both retained their separate compound bodies, and this is why Jesus was able to sit down on the right side of the Father in heaven awaiting he second coming?

 

[Peter1000]

I believe that Jesus can be invisible or visible. It is His choice. Thanks Perer1000.

And I would agree, but to make a blanket statement that God is invisible is not true, would you agree?

 

[Peter1000]

Those scriptures do not mean anything close to what Mormonism teaches. The way you interpret them is completely contrary to everything that the Holy Spirit represents. We are partakers of the divine nature in that we have been called out of sin and will be made Holy even as He is Holy. And the precious promises is everlasting life and fellowship with God. Such beautiful passages have nothing to do with being a god over our own planet!

The writings of that charlatan takes what the Bible teaches and perverts it to mean something that is not in keeping with the truth. That man was a scammer and well known as a compulsive liar who from an early age was always trying to take advantage of people and manipulate others for personal gain.

Let me know when that temple in Missouri gets built.

We are partakers of his divine nature when we have overcome the corruption of this world, and by so doing are called out of sin and will be made holy even as He is Holy. I like your words.

When you say that the precious promises is everlasting life and fellowship with God, it is taking liberty to change the text. It is true but let the text speak for itself. It says:
2 Peter 1:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

When we receive by God's own divine power, all that pertains to godliness, and we become as Holy as He is Holy, and escape this world of corruption, then we receive his precious promises that we can be partakers of his divine nature. IOW not only have everlasting life and fellowship with God, but that eternal fellowship allows us to become like him in all things.

God used his divine power to help us to be holy and godly, so that we can have his divine nature and powers. Come to the proper conclusion, and your eyes will be open to the most glorious future that is in store for you. Holiness, perfection, exaltation, divinity (divine nature)
godliness, eternal progression with God and Jesus as our guides.

What can we be like after 20 million years at the foot of God and Jesus? Think about all the mysteries they will unravel for us, and what we will learn from them. It will be glorious.

 

[Sam81]

Serious or not, you are certainly not holding out an olive branch with the intention of loving us. So use this picture on other sites, but on this one, you should use some other picture to portray your real thoughts and intents. It is not for me to say, just suggesting.

The question is not: "As for His God being our God". That is given. The question is: Why did Jesus say he was going to "my God"? He if obviously telling us the he (Jesus) has a God, and it is the same God as "our God".

I see you use the word "reunited" with the Father. Do you think that he was somehow absorbed back into the Father so that they are now 2 persons in 1 God again.

OR is it like we think, he was reunited with the Father, they both retained their separate compound bodies, and this is why Jesus was able to sit down on the right side of the Father in heaven awaiting he second coming?

I already explained it to you. You did not receive it.

Jesus emptied Himself when He came in the flesh; He set aside His equality with God to take the form of the humble Son of Man. He was fully submitted to God the Father.

Mormonism takes what the Bible says and perverts it. It's not hard to do. For example, the Jesus only Apostolics say that when Jesus said "I have not yet ascended to the Father", it meant that He was ascending into being the Father. As if the Father is a role that Jesus is being promoted into, and only then can He be touched. And they interpret tons of other verses in such a way as to agree with their heresy. But it's folly.

True children of God know the voice of the shepherd. Jesus said that the Holy Spirit would glorify Him by taking what is His and declaring it unto us.

But Mormons believe a lie, and it's not a very persuasive one in my estimate. The idea of multiple planets, multiple Gods, and celestial sex, Jesus and Satan being brothers, men becoming Gods of their own worlds... it all seems very easily discernible as blasphemous, a spirit completely foreign to the Bible. It's very obvious Joseph Smith was being deceptive. I've read the book of Mormon... "and it came to pass, it came to pass, it came to pass and yea, it came to pass and behold, it came to pass, even to pass..." . It's embarrassingly obvious that he wanted the Book of Mormon to sound like the Bible, and was an ignoramus. Not to mention, "it came to pass" that his prophecies did NOT come to pass, disqualifying him as a prophet according to biblical standards.

I'm not trying to offend anyone, but there is just no way Mormonism is at all believable, at least for me.

 

[Sam81]

We are partakers of his divine nature when we have overcome the corruption of this world, and by so doing are called out of sin and will be made holy even as He is Holy. I like your words.

When you say that the precious promises is everlasting life and fellowship with God, it is taking liberty to change the text. It is true but let the text speak for itself. It says:
2 Peter 1:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

When we receive by God's own divine power, all that pertains to godliness, and we become as Holy as He is Holy, and escape this world of corruption, then we receive his precious promises that we can be partakers of his divine nature. IOW not only have everlasting life and fellowship with God, but that eternal fellowship allows us to become like him in all things.

God used his divine power to help us to be holy and godly, so that we can have his divine nature and powers. Come to the proper conclusion, and your eyes will be open to the most glorious future that is in store for you. Holiness, perfection, exaltation, divinity (divine nature)
godliness, eternal progression with God and Jesus as our guides.

What can we be like after 20 million years at the foot of God and Jesus? Think about all the mysteries they will unravel for us, and what we will learn from them. It will be glorious.

Yes, but unfortunately we seem to have a disagreement over what those promises entail, in terms of specifics.

I believe the Book of Mormon specifics are not in keeping with the Bible. But the specifics provided by The Book of Revelation does keep with the Bible.

 

[Sam81]

Speaking of the Book of Revelation, notice that the last few chapters, when the New Jerusalem is unveiled, show no trace of the wild and wacky teachings of the Book of Mormon. No new planets, celestial sex, promotions to God, etc.

And since the Book of Revelation didn't cover it, Mr. Smith is in trouble. Why? "For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book, if anyone adds to these things God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book.. and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his part from The Book of Life and the holy city and from the things which are written in this book." Revelation 22:18-19

 

[Peter1000]

I already explained it to you. You did not receive it.

Jesus emptied Himself when He came in the flesh; He set aside His equality with God to take the form of the humble Son of Man. He was fully submitted to God the Father.

Mormonism takes what the Bible says and perverts it. It's not hard to do. For example, the Jesus only Apostolics say that when Jesus said "I have not yet ascended to the Father", it meant that He was ascending into being the Father. As if the Father is a role that Jesus is being promoted into, and only then can He be touched. And they interpret tons of other verses in such a way as to agree with their heresy. But it's folly.

True children of God know the voice of the shepherd. Jesus said that the Holy Spirit would glorify Him by taking what is His and declaring it unto us.

But Mormons believe a lie, and it's not a very persuasive one in my estimate. The idea of multiple planets, multiple Gods, and celestial sex, Jesus and Satan being brothers, men becoming Gods of their own worlds... it all seems very easily discernible as blasphemous, a spirit completely foreign to the Bible. It's very obvious Joseph Smith was being deceptive. I've read the book of Mormon... "and it came to pass, it came to pass, it came to pass and yea, it came to pass and behold, it came to pass, even to pass..." . It's embarrassingly obvious that he wanted the Book of Mormon to sound like the Bible, and was an ignoramus. Not to mention, "it came to pass" that his prophecies did NOT come to pass, disqualifying him as a prophet according to biblical standards.

I'm not trying to offend anyone, but there is just no way Mormonism is at all believable, at least for me.

If you are not trying to offend, I would hate to see what you would write if you were trying to offend.

So I see what the Apostolics say and I know what we say, but I asked a question about what you say, and you did not answer. So here it is again:

You say that Jesus and God were reunited. Does this mean that they were separated for a time while Jesus was on earth, and now he is going to be absorbed back into the Father again?

Please answer, then I will see how you interpret this crucial scripture. Thanks.

 

[Jamesone5]

I do make these arguments and they are good arguments.

Of course we are not in heaven to see Jesus (spiritually or physically), but this does not prove that he is invisible. I agree he is invisible to us, not being in heaven, but he is not invisible to those in heaven. Right? So just because we cannot see him, not being in heaven, it certainly does not prove he is invisible.

So here is your post 43
Uh, do you see Him right now?
Gee, do you think He might be invisible because you cannot see Him?

So you are arguing that because we cant see him right now, he is invisible.

My argument says: Just because we can't see him now, does not prove he is invisible.
Those in heaven can see him fine.

So your argument is not true. It is like saying, the grand canyon is invisible because we cannot see it now. Yes, you are right, we can go and see it so we can prove that it is not invisible. And yes, we can go to heaven and prove that Jesus is not invisible, so your argument does not stand.

Try again to prove that Jesus is invisible.

Uh, it is based on your perceptions, not the perceptions of someone else who might be in heaven.

We rely on Faith which is this

Hebrews 11:1
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

How are you going to convince a newbie of a Christ he has not seen?

How would even JS try to convince you Mormons of a supposed Christ and a separate Heavenly Father who you have not seen?