Explaining the disastrous “grace-only” doctrine

[redleghunter]

Yes, it was (and is) a fantastic book for
which his denomination crucified him for!
IMO, he had to retract it ... and apparently
now he is preaching a lot of nonsense.
IMO, he opened a door ...
and Satan took full advantage.
Satan attacks hardest those whom
he considers to be his greatest threat.

He never retracted his work and continues to preach from the Reformed doctrines which support his works.

 

[Dave L]

In salvation, God gives us a new nature (person) designed to love him and holiness. So any talk of "lordship salvation" or "cheap grace" only concerns those who think they are saved through works. They need to pony up or else. But the born again know it's an empty argument. We hate sin and love righteousness by nature.

 

[timothyu]

But the born again know it's an empty argument. We hate sin and love righteousness by nature.

I hear the religious right say that but they are the furthest from righteousness there is. Theirs is the governance of man, not God, yet they seem to think their politics represent God's will. So easy to misuse God but hard to change oneself to do His will.

 

[Dave L]

I hear the religious right say that but they are the furthest from righteousness there is. Theirs is the governance of man, not God, yet they seem to think their politics represent God's will. So easy to misuse God but hard to change oneself to do His will.

It no doubt happens. But the proof is in the life style.

 

[timothyu]

But the proof is in the life style.

Well, there are only two choices.. traditional ways of man or ways of the Kingdom. Both opposite in nature so hard to confuse.

 

[Aldebaran]

I hear the religious right say that but they are the furthest from righteousness there is. Theirs is the governance of man, not God, yet they seem to think their politics represent God's will. So easy to misuse God but hard to change oneself to do His will.

Religious Right is more of a political stance than a spiritual decision. Those who are Christian and voting for a politician is quite limited in who their choices are, and the choice will be far from perfect when the politician is measured against Christ's standards.
To me, a Christian voting for a politician is like a vegetarian deciding whether to eat chicken or a cheeseburger for dinner when there are no other choices available. Neither one is a vegetable, so he then has to decide which one is healthier. The vegetarian would probably opt for the chicken in this case.

 

[timothyu]

The vegetarian would probably opt for the chicken in this case.

Well as they seem to believe in grace with no need for obedience, then yes chicken might be an option. But for those obedient to God rather than the governance of man, neither are an option.

 

[timothyu]

the finished work of Jesus Christ at Calvary

The only thing finished was His part in doing only the will of the Father and not His own. The Father resurrected Him and so the Kingdom and it's King came into being. Thee Kingdom is our salvation, compliments of the grace of God. But not everyone gets in except those of the Kingdom and no longer allied to the world of man. Two opposing systems. Can't have it both ways.

 

[Butch5]

The following is only one PROOF
against the “grace-only” doctrine:

“For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to
the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.” (Romans 8:29-30)

From above, BACs are predestined for 2 things:
(1) – to be conformed to the likeness of Jesus
(2) – to be called, justified, and glorified

God does (2) w/o any co-operation from BACs!
However, BACs are involved in (1) because they are not robots; they have free-will to co-operate, or not co-operate!

WHY does God predestine BACs to be conformed to become like Jesus?
(1) – for walking around in this life? ... or ...
(2) – for preparing to be qualified for heaven?

If this is about (2) … then we’re talking about
being prepared for salvation and for heaven!

Being conformed to the image of Jesus is called “sanctification”. To be sanctified means to be set apart (and to be made holy) … and … there is a positional sanctification, and then a progressive sanctification.

Will the instantaneous justification of a believer make him like Jesus? NO.
Man is made up of 3 parts: body, soul, and spirit.
Our whole being (body, soul, spirit) is to be made into Jesus’ likeness!

Now, returning to Romans 8:28-30 above …
All of the underlined items are the major parts of God’s saving work.
God will NOT justify those He does NOT sanctify.
There is NO separating justification and sanctification so much … that we focus on one and ignore the other.
God does NOT offer justification as a stand-alone means of salvation.
Justification cannot be isolated and made to represent all of God’s saving work!

JUSTIFICATION (taking Jesus as SAVIOR)
SANCTIFICATION (making Jesus our LORD)

If we take Jesus as SAVIOR,
then we also take Him as LORD.
Which do you prefer “Savior and LORD”
or “LORD and Savior”?
There are NT verses for both.

What is required for the believer to be progressively sanctified unto holiness?
Co-operation with the precious Holy Spirit, obedience, and repenting of sins.
Believers who are habitually sinning
are not on the narrow path to heaven!

That passage isn't talking about Christians, it's talking about the Jews.

 

[His student]

Philippian jailor, "What must I do to be saved?"

The only thing finished was His part in doing only the will of the Father and not His own. The Father resurrected Him and so the Kingdom and it's King came into being. Thee Kingdom is our salvation, compliments of the grace of God. But not everyone gets in except those of the Kingdom and no longer allied to the world of man. Two opposing systems. Can't have it both ways.

Great news. Count me in - me and my whole family.

 

[Blade]

Thanks for sharing my brother. I do agree in part. You said "The problem with easy-believism is it allows those who are NOT walking in obedience to live comfortably with a false sense of assurance leading to the tragedy described in Matthew 7:21-23.'"

You applied Matt 7 21-23 to what you said. Not how Christ meant it. Context....Clearly unless I am reading it wrong Matt 25 talks about when Christ comes He gathers the nations (what TIME period is this? After the trib?) He then splits the sheep and goats. See Christ as we know can not lie so when He says to the goats that said they did all these things in His name.. He says "I never knew you". He is not like us.. does not think like man. When Christ aka GOD says I never knew you. That is exactly what He means. They were never saved.

2 Peter 1:20 "Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation of things."

Forgive me .. it seems very hard to just talk and in love disagree with you..well you said "So, are both J and S required for salvation? If you say NO, then you are trashing the OP." Trashing?

What I know.. is what HE told me.. show'd me as in written in His word. If one believes in Christ you are saved. We start this walk.. He leads for what He started He will finish. We tell someone we got saved.. He then tells the Father all heaven already rejoiced when we got saved..so He can NEVER say "He never knew me". The Father knows me.. its the sweet sweet Holy Spirit told me what righteousness was. I look at all the SIN.. I then judge me self...yet in the Fathers eyes.. I am 100% in right standing simply only because of what CHrist did.. is what I believe in. Its not MY righteousness.. anyway..

Thank you for all this.. awesome work.. just I disagree on part.. bless you richly and your family in Christ

 

[BCsenior]

What I know.. is what HE told me.. show'd me as in written in His word. If one believes in Christ you are saved. We start this walk.. He leads for what He started He will finish.

Perhaps above is the portion of disagreement?
Are you saying that Christ will finish what He started in a person ... regardless and with no exceptions?
Is the true BAC just not capable of rejecting
Christ and God's grace and His efforts to sanctify him/her?

 

[royal priest]

Explaining the disastrous “grace-only” doctrine

Maybe send Paul an epistle explaining you see him in error?

As Lloyd Jones had observed that if our explanation of the Gospel does not solicit a " shall we then sin that grace may abound?" response, then we have not properly explained the Gospel.

 

[redleghunter]

Well, there are only two choices.. traditional ways of man or ways of the Kingdom. Both opposite in nature so hard to confuse.

Now that is a sobering and true statement.

 

[AspiringTheologian]

Because of the whole of the NT,
true saving belief/faith
must include these 5 concepts:
endurance, repentance, obedience,
works, and practicing righteousness.

I have one full page of NT verses
for each of the 5 concepts above,
which prove their validity.

And there are other factors also,
for which I do NOT have a full page
of proof verses.

In other words, our understanding of scripture is identical? My question to you is, what must a man do to be saved?

Thanks

 

[JAYPT]

BC Senior calling the new covenant disastrous (Romans 6:14). Apparently he doesnt think God knows what He is doing (Titus 2:11-12). Amazing..... am I surprised? Not at all, and yet people still buy into his bait and try to convince him otherwise when everyone else around him has tuned him out, that is why he is here.

See its easy to throw stones at grace when you're afraid of it (1 John 4:18).

Make your choice, its either all grace or all law, you choose. Flirting with Moses is cheating on Jesus.

You cannot mix law and grace, anyone who has read a bible understands this.

 

[devin553344]

The following is only one PROOF
against the “grace-only” doctrine:

“For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to
the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.” (Romans 8:29-30)

From above, BACs are predestined for 2 things:
(1) – to be conformed to the likeness of Jesus
(2) – to be called, justified, and glorified

God does (2) w/o any co-operation from BACs!
However, BACs are involved in (1) because they are not robots; they have free-will to co-operate, or not co-operate!

WHY does God predestine BACs to be conformed to become like Jesus?
(1) – for walking around in this life? ... or ...
(2) – for preparing to be qualified for heaven?

If this is about (2) … then we’re talking about
being prepared for salvation and for heaven!

Being conformed to the image of Jesus is called “sanctification”. To be sanctified means to be set apart (and to be made holy) … and … there is a positional sanctification, and then a progressive sanctification.

Will the instantaneous justification of a believer make him like Jesus? NO.
Man is made up of 3 parts: body, soul, and spirit.
Our whole being (body, soul, spirit) is to be made into Jesus’ likeness!

Now, returning to Romans 8:28-30 above …
All of the underlined items are the major parts of God’s saving work.
God will NOT justify those He does NOT sanctify.
There is NO separating justification and sanctification so much … that we focus on one and ignore the other.
God does NOT offer justification as a stand-alone means of salvation.
Justification cannot be isolated and made to represent all of God’s saving work!

JUSTIFICATION (taking Jesus as SAVIOR)
SANCTIFICATION (making Jesus our LORD)

If we take Jesus as SAVIOR,
then we also take Him as LORD.
Which do you prefer “Savior and LORD”
or “LORD and Savior”?
There are NT verses for both.

What is required for the believer to be progressively sanctified unto holiness?
Co-operation with the precious Holy Spirit, obedience, and repenting of sins.
Believers who are habitually sinning
are not on the narrow path to heaven!

The following is only one PROOF
against the “grace-only” doctrine:

“For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to
the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.” (Romans 8:29-30)

From above, BACs are predestined for 2 things:
(1) – to be conformed to the likeness of Jesus
(2) – to be called, justified, and glorified

God does (2) w/o any co-operation from BACs!
However, BACs are involved in (1) because they are not robots; they have free-will to co-operate, or not co-operate!

WHY does God predestine BACs to be conformed to become like Jesus?
(1) – for walking around in this life? ... or ...
(2) – for preparing to be qualified for heaven?

If this is about (2) … then we’re talking about
being prepared for salvation and for heaven!

Being conformed to the image of Jesus is called “sanctification”. To be sanctified means to be set apart (and to be made holy) … and … there is a positional sanctification, and then a progressive sanctification.

Will the instantaneous justification of a believer make him like Jesus? NO.
Man is made up of 3 parts: body, soul, and spirit.
Our whole being (body, soul, spirit) is to be made into Jesus’ likeness!

Now, returning to Romans 8:28-30 above …
All of the underlined items are the major parts of God’s saving work.
God will NOT justify those He does NOT sanctify.
There is NO separating justification and sanctification so much … that we focus on one and ignore the other.
God does NOT offer justification as a stand-alone means of salvation.
Justification cannot be isolated and made to represent all of God’s saving work!

JUSTIFICATION (taking Jesus as SAVIOR)
SANCTIFICATION (making Jesus our LORD)

If we take Jesus as SAVIOR,
then we also take Him as LORD.
Which do you prefer “Savior and LORD”
or “LORD and Savior”?
There are NT verses for both.

What is required for the believer to be progressively sanctified unto holiness?
Co-operation with the precious Holy Spirit, obedience, and repenting of sins.
Believers who are habitually sinning
are not on the narrow path to heaven!

While it's important for people to serve God and keep his commandments we must also recognize that Grace saves since there are many mentally ill people that fall under salvation thru grace.

 

[BCsenior]

In other words, our under-standing of scripture is identical? My question to you is, what must a man do to be saved? Thanks

What's wrong with what you have quoted?

"Because of the whole of the NT,
true saving belief/faith
must include these 5 concepts:
endurance, repentance, obedience,
works, and practicing righteousness."

I recently came across another good verse
re: BACs NOT YET being counted as righteous ...

"But we (faithful BACs) who live by the Spirit eagerly wait to receive by faith
the righteousness God has promised to us." (Galatians 5:5)

I continue to WARN all of you BACs ...
salvation is a process, which can be abandoned, fallen away from, etc.
It's possible to fall from grace!

 

[Hammster]

What's wrong with what you have quoted?

"Because of the whole of the NT,
true saving belief/faith
must include these 5 concepts:
endurance, repentance, obedience,
works, and practicing righteousness."

I recently came across another good verse
re: BACs NOT YET being counted as righteous ...

"But we (faithful BACs) who live by the Spirit eagerly wait to receive by faith
the righteousness God has promised to us." (Galatians 5:5)

I continue to WARN all of you BACs ...
salvation is a process, which can be abandoned, fallen away from, etc.
It's possible to fall from grace!

You are preaching law, not gospel.

 

[BCsenior]

You are preaching law, not gospel.

I thought you were against "grace-only", which means progressive sanctification is necessary, i.e. there is NO instantaneous justification.
Please note Galatians 5:5 ...
Partakers are those who LIVE by the Spirit.
They are NOT habitual sinners, for example.

IMO, there are actually more NT verses about
progressive sanctification than about OSAS.

Also, IMO, obeying Jesus' NT commandments
are NOT law, but simply expressing love for Jesus. He kept saying, "Those who love Me will obey My commandments." (John 14)
This has nothing to do with keeping any law.