Explaining the disastrous “grace-only” doctrine

[frogoon234]

Jesus came to set us FREE from the bondage
of sin in our lives ... so we actually are able to
NOT sin!
Yes, the Holy Spirit works in our lives to sanctify us unto holiness through the process of sanctification.

But, we are NOT forced to co-operate!
We are NOT robots ... we have free will.

I don't have a strong opinion for or against Calvinism and the Westminster Confession of Faith allows for this attitude. However if you want to prove your point to me you are going to have to use scripture.

 

[frogoon234]

@yeshuaslavejeff thanks for praying for me. I'll pray for you too brother.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

You are going to have to try harder than that. Explain how that is not pertinent. Jesus Christ is the living God.

No, I don't have to try harder, nor at all.

It looks like everyone who posts the truth, is ignored by you, and you don't answer
truthfully what Scripture says,
so trying harder has no benefit here.

 

[BCsenior]

Doing what a Calvinist does best...my goodness...I hope that one day you Calvinists come out of your slumber and Truly see Grace for what it is rather than defining it as an auster method with God having his nose stuck in the air. One day you will see when you can no longer deny the Holes right on front of your eyes that you keep filling with dirt from other holes you dig yourself.

Sorry, I'm not following you!
Please translate into simple obvious English.
E.G. Do you believe in eternal security?

Question: Are there any Americans
who know how to make a noun plural?
Hint: add an "s", not an apostrophe "s".

 

[nolidad]

Jesus came to set us FREE from the bondage
of sin in our lives ... so we actually are able to
NOT sin!

Yes, the Holy Spirit works in our lives
to sanctify us unto holiness
through the process of sanctification.

But, we are NOT forced to co-operate!
We are NOT robots ... we have free will.

Habitual (unrepentant) sinners are NOT allowed to enter the Kingdom of God/Christ ... they are NOT allowed into heaven.

I agree we now as believers are able to not sin anymore! But the sad reality is we still fall short at times.

I agree that unrepentant sinners will not inherit the kingdom of God. But believers who fall into a season of sin are still the children of God and are still seated in heavenly places and their lives are still hid in Christ. They are disobedient children but children none the less. One cannot become un-born again! The only answer of Scripture is that these people who fellowshipped with the saints may not have ever been saved!

1 John 2:19
They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Also the parable of the wheat and tares! but it is up to God and not us to decide if they are or are not saved! I know of a fantastic christian Musician who had many albums and blessed countless saints. He came out of the closet and is now very gay! Whether he is saved or not only God knows. It could be a season oof sin or it could be he left because he was never a believer! I pray for the former!

 

[frogoon234]

No, I don't have to try harder, nor at all.

It looks like everyone who posts the truth, is ignored by you, and you don't answer
truthfully what Scripture says,
so trying harder has no benefit here.

ok.

 

[nolidad]

You don't want to see the dozens of warning verses, do you.
Dozens of all kinds, shapes, and sizes.
E.G. the list of "IF" conditional NT verses like:
IF you endure in the faith, you will be saved.

When you take all those "if" verses and keep them in their context- then you realize they are not soteriological at all!

Every time the word "saved" appears in the NT it is not always speaking of eternal salvation.

But when one looks at all the absolute verses of eternal security- you do not see "ifs" but "nevers"

Jesus will never leave us or forsake us (so even if we try to leave Him, He won't leave us)

We have been perfect FOREVER.

No one can pluck us out of Jesus hand (not even yourself!)

He gives eternal life- not conditional eternal life and we shall NEVER perish.

We are dead and our life is Hidden with Christ in god!

He that started a good work in you - shall perform it until the day of redemption!
We are saved by grace through faith and not of works! That also means we do not maintain our salvation by works!

 

[BCsenior]

Nolidad,

So, God's dire NT warnings to people in the churches are NOT really to BACs after all.
They are to unsaved people?
Or, they are bluffs, exaggerations, lies even?

Do you recall the NT verses that say believers
will be tested to see IF their faith is genuine?

Those who ignore God's warnings are simply
rejecting them ... Yes, there are also NT verses about rejecting God.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

....
We have been perfect FOREVER.....
No one can pluck us out of Jesus hand (not even yourself!)
....
He that started a good work in you - shall perform it until the day of redemption!
We are saved by grace through faith and not of works! That also means we do not maintain our salvation by works!

Most people are NEVER in Jesus' hand.
He NEVER start "a good work" in most people on earth.
So most people have NO SALVATION to "maintain" - they are not saved.

 

[frogoon234]

what does BAC stand for? I looked it up and it said Blood Alcohol Content.

 

[frogoon234]

Most people are NEVER in Jesus' hand.
He NEVER start "a good work" in most people on earth.
So most people have NO SALVATION to "maintain" - they are not saved.

i doubt that. Do you have biblical evidence for this specific notion?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

i doubt that. Do you have biblical evidence for this specific notion?

ALL the BIBLE supports this - it is all in harmony with all of God's Word.

Why do you doubt God's Word, Plan and Purpose in Christ Jesus, all of which are all in perfect harmony in TRUTH (in JESUS)> ?

 

[Aldebaran]

Nolidad,

So, God's dire NT warnings to people in the churches are NOT really to BACs after all.
They are to unsaved people.
Or, they are bluffs, exaggerations, lies even.
Do you recall the NT verses that say believers
will be tested to see IF their faith is genuine?

Yes. But how does that mean that those who believe in eternal salvation wouldn't pass the test?

 

[BCsenior]

He gives eternal life - not conditional eternal life and we shall NEVER perish.

You don't understand the verses.
For example, your John 10:
27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

Do you hear Jesus' voice?
Does He know you?
Do you follow him?

 

[frogoon234]

ALL the BIBLE supports this - it is all in harmony with all of God's Word.

Why do you doubt God's Word, Plan and Purpose in Christ Jesus, all of which are all in perfect harmony in TRUTH (in JESUS)> ?

I don't. I guess its time for me to quote scripture again. Revelation chapter 12.

 

[RDKirk]

The problem you have is that you confuse descriptive passages and descriptive passages. And, you rarely take into consideration the context of the verses you quote. So you end up confusing the law with the gospel.

Did you mean "prescriptive passages and descriptive passages?"

 

[BCsenior]

Yes. But how does that mean that those who believe in eternal salvation wouldn't pass the test?

Why would God have tests for us,
if He knew we would all pass them?

 

[Calvin_1985]

What?

Which part are you whating?

The OP sounds very Calvinistic so I was basically making fun of it.

 

[Calvin_1985]

Prove it or just agree to disagree. Jesus Christ watches his flock closely.

Prove what exactly?

 

[frogoon234]

Why would God have tests for us,
if He knew we would all pass them?

With out quoting scripture, i believe God goes in and out of control of his universes because he likes a challenge but doesn't like to be defeated. This is pure speculation. If you disagree that is completely acceptable as far as i'm concerned. A great video to watch on youtube is "10 dimensions explained". Also look up the history of "scientific determinism" on bing or google.