International Feminism

[bèlla]

Check the list of issues in Post # 14 - what in there is about

I don't need to check anything. Allow me to explain so there's no confusion.

I was reared in an environment where men honored their obligations and stood upright. There were no eunuchs to be found or some misshapen oddity that called itself male whose essence is foreign. Man in all his glory.

I have no empathy, sympathy, or capacity to aid your cause. It is an abomination to my senses and all I hold sacrosanct. You lack the ability to sway me or the argument to keep pace. I've got 40+ years to draw on and a decade spent in the other teams' camp.

It is a cancer meant to delude the confused and disgruntled who don't recognize the dignity of their divinity from the Most High. They traded the Holy for chains that fed their flesh with a promise of glory with a cost they never knew they'd pay.

There is too much lodged in my cranium to ever agree with the apostasy you're proposing. It will never happen.

 

[mindlight]

Well you dont know a thing about me so dont try and personalise this discussion

I was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt. BUt I will rephrase my post cause you are right this should not be personalised

 

[mindlight]

The list I have there now is as prominent today as it has ever been. It concerns feminists because men are the predominant perpetrators of those crimes and the victims are predominantly women.

But from a legal point of view the gender does not matter. The crime matters and since this is already enshrined in statute law it is not a live agenda. Feminists job done so why not retire now or move onto more pressing issues like social mobility for instance.

So we female teens have concerns that I do not like ridiculed. It is not like we don't want men to work with us on this - But I come here ...a Christian site - and note the threads are largely adversarial. Don't deny it. I'm sure you have seen enough posts to know its true.

That is the British political model and the Australian one also. One person speaks and the other contradicts until we find something that can survive the war of words.

You say you did international politics?????? truly?? Follow your logic - Lets say you vote Republican therefore you must be : anti-immigration, racist, rich, anti-support for anyone needing social benefits etc etc

I was a student a long time with politics, theology and philosophy all in the mix. But yes your point is my one also. Noone likes being associated with the sins of the group the commit to. Sometimes the label Republican , Democrat, Feminist or whatever actually becomes so toxic in common usage as to be redundant and unhelpful. I would argue the word Feminist has reached that point for Christians.

A republican will tell you - they have views that lie on a continuum with some occupying quite extremist views and some moderate. So too for feminists - I have declared my points of interest.

But I suspect you know all this and suspect you may be trolling.

No I am genuinely interested why Christians still call themselves feminists when the dominant perspectives associated with that word are now so deeply antiChristian

 

[timewerx]

Do the benefits of feminism still outweigh the costs?

I'd still rather have feminism than what I have experienced concerning the opposite.

I've live and worked in an ultra-conservative Muslim country. Never would I like it. Things are a lot worse when men are in absolute power.

 

[Hieronymus]

I'd still rather have feminism than what I have experienced concerning the opposite.

I've live and worked in an ultra-conservative Muslim country. Never would I like it. Things are a lot worse when men are in absolute power.

^This.

But what do we see sometimes?
Feminists hooking up with Muslims to stand against Christian Conservatism.
That should make quite clear who or what the object of hate really is.

 

[Nithavela]

I don't need to check anything. Allow me to explain so there's no confusion.

I was reared in an environment where men honored their obligations and stood upright. There were no eunuchs to be found or some misshapen oddity that called itself male whose essence is foreign. Man in all his glory.

I have no empathy, sympathy, or capacity to aid your cause. It is an abomination to my senses and all I hold sacrosanct. You lack the ability to sway me or the argument to keep pace. I've got 40+ years to draw on and a decade spent in the other teams' camp.

It is a cancer meant to delude the confused and disgruntled who don't recognize the dignity of their divinity from the Most High. They traded the Holy for chains that fed their flesh with a promise of glory with a cost they never knew they'd pay.

There is too much lodged in my cranium to ever agree with the apostasy you're proposing. It will never happen.

So... what are you doing over here in the debate forum?

 

[bèlla]

That isn't your concern.

 

[Nithavela]

That isn't your concern.

Ooh, how inscrutable.

 

[bèlla]

Why are you messaging me? Don't you have liberals to commiserate with?

 

[Nithavela]

Why are you messaging me? Don't you have liberals to commiserate with?

I am messaging you because you are taking part in a discussion. If you dont want to hear people talking to you and replying and questioning your statements, I suggest starting a blog (and disabling the comment section).

 

[bèlla]

I am messaging you because you are taking part in a discussion. If you dont want to hear people talking to you and replying and questioning your statements, I suggest starting a blog (and disabling the comment section).

I don't recall inviting your suggestions. If this is the cavalry they'd better request reinforcements.
Not that I begrudge a need to be heard where it is possible. As you will. It is a waste of time.

Liberal rhetoric means nothing to me.

 

[LaSorcia]

women have been liberated from abuse

That's quite an amazingly false statement there. I wonder why women's shelters still have occupants. Slumming it for a holiday, I suppose?

exploitation

So, there's no human trafficking issue in Western nations then. That's just a myth I suppose.
So, based on your assertion that women are now free from abuse, and the fact that there have been several female heads of state in Europe, one can assume that women have full legal and social equality? I'm afraid I'm not so easily convinced, especially when there is so much data otherwise, conveniently left out of the OP.

 

[Zoii]

The crime matters and since this is already enshrined in statute law it is not a live agenda. Feminists job done

That would be Ok if the crimes were not only continuing but increasing statistically in every single country. It is a problem for us all but unfortunately, the victims are mostly women and the perps overwhelmingly male.

What we need from men like you is to stand up and mentor your young men and cut this cycle. From my end, women on my campus are doing practical things to improve our safety. Please stop dismissing us by saying - 'hey laws are passed so stop worrying your pretty little head'

One person speaks and the other contradicts until we find something that can survive the war of words

You are discussing this well for me - look around at the other posts and identify the caustic responses - that's not discourse - its vitriol. But at least for forums where I live, these posts are helpful to understand just what Christian men think of us, and how we are perceived with such vitriol, and accused of everything from killing babies to causing marriage breakdowns. Its like Christian men won't take responsibility for the issue I raised.

why Christians still call themselves feminists when the dominant perspectives associated with that word are now so deeply antiChristian

because I identify as Christian and feminist. Why are you so arrogant to call me anti-christian .

 

[Zoii]

But it's not about mechanics or pedophiles.
It's about the animosity between men and women, fueled by feminism.

They want us divided.
Feminism is one of the means to divide us.
It's based on adoption of victim status and accusations.
Same thing as BLM and LBGT does.
Social Justice Warriors horribly overshooting the good cause, violating actual social justice themselves..

No you haven't read any feminist theory then. I want men working with us on the issues that confront us. I don't want division. I want you to look at eg domestic violence and rape and go...Ok yea - it's a growing problem. We men need to stand up, own up to it, and act on it.

Instead, all I am getting from you and others is hysteria and comments about division...that's not being responsible - its being adversarial.

 

[Hieronymus]

No you haven't read any feminist theory then.

I'm 47.
I think i get the idea by now.

I want men working with us on the issues that confront us. I don't want division. I want you to look at eg domestic violence and rape and go...Ok yea - it's a growing problem. We men need to stand up, own up to it, and act on it.

There are laws against violence.
There are more laws against physical violence then there are against psychological violence.

Look, people suck sometimes.
The have hate and anger in them.
There is a difference between how a man expresses it and how a woman expresses it.

I think the problem is not as bad in western civilisation, actually.
It's much much worse in Muslim civilisation.

None the less, the problems should be addressed and dealt with.
Demonizing masculinity is not the solution, because it's not the cause of the problems.

Instead, all I am getting from you and others is hysteria and comments about division...that's not being responsible - its being adversarial.

Yeah, why not just flip it around like that...
Feminism is just as wrong as 'masculinism'.

 

[Zoii]

I'm 47.
I think i get the idea by now.
There are laws against violence.
There are more laws against physical violence then there are against psychological violence.

Look, people suck sometimes.
The have hate and anger in them.
There is a difference between how a man expresses it and how a woman expresses it.

I think the problem is not as bad in western civilisation, actually.
It's much much worse in Muslim civilisation.

None the less, the problems should be addressed and dealt with.
Demonizing masculinity is not the solution, because it's not the cause of the problems.Yeah, why not just flip it around like that...
Feminism is just as wrong as 'masculinism'.

OK...I feel like you've taken a step forward. So surely you can see that the list of things that teens and others on my campus listed (see post 14) - are they so outrageous. What has you so fearful of us. That a group of us call ourselves feminist because there's a bunch of issues affecting largely our gender - what's so evil about it... why aren't you on our side when we talk about rape or DV....why tell us that our kids will be 'rotten fruit' , that we are all lesbians, that we break up your marriage and kill babies - am I seriously meant to admire you and your peers here for saying this about us?

 

[Hieronymus]

OK...I feel like you've taken a step forward. So surely you can see that the list of thing that teens and others on my campus listed (see post 14) - are they so outrageous. What has you so fearful of us.

It's not fear, dear. It's repulsion rather.
Not much wrong with a bit of empowerment if that's what's lacking, but there is this apparent need for an enemy and a victim status.

That a group of us call ourselves feminist because there's a bunch of issues affecting largely our gender - what's so evil about it... why aren't you on our side when we talk about rape or DV....

Why do you assume i'm not?

why tell us that our kids will be 'rotten fruit' , that we are all lesbians, that we break up your mariage and kill babies - am I seriously meant to admire you and your peers here for saying this about us?

Are you talking to me? Or are you talking to your stereotype object of hate?

Sorry, i use too strong terms perhaps..
Can't always find milder synonyms...

 

[Phil.Stein]

Do the benefits of feminism still outweigh the costs?​

Nope. But the benefits of toxic feminism never outweighed the costs.

Do you honestly believe that giving women the vote really accomplished anything, other than sending Western nations down the tubes faster? More votes based on emotion, rather than reason, is not a rationale for a successful country.

Or do you believe allowing women to work enriched the nation? Nay, it impoverished families, and turned us all into slaves. Now women who still truly want to do true women's work - i.e. serving their husbands, and raising children - often find they are unable to afford it.

Toxic feminism is a root cause of all manner of evils - divorce, abused children, adultery, homosexuality, gender confusion, poverty, rape, suicide, debt, and outright nastiness. This toxin has done its job. Sadly, the organism still largely does not understand what poisoned it.

 

[Hieronymus]

Oof... @Phil.Stein

Although i see some valid points in your post, how you put it into words is like pouring oil on the fire (Dutch expression)...

 

[Phil.Stein]

Oof... @Phil.Stein

Although i see some valid points in your post, how you put it into words is like pouring oil on the fire (Dutch expression)...

That, my friend, is simply the truth. "The truth is like a lion; you don't have to defend it. Let it loose; it will defend itself."