Debunking Flat Earth

[dgiharris]

Science is difficult, and makes disconcerting claims; if you don't have a decent science grounding, it can feel exclusive and elitist. Rejecting it in favour of provocative pseudoscience and reversing the burden of proof takes back control of the narrative.

What scares me the most about FE believers is not so much what they believe, but rather, their thought process in coming up with their beliefs.

I would argue that there are plenty of people who believe mainstream stuff however have thought processes that aren't too far removed from FE-ers.

The scary types of these are Youtube Videos featuring Ego-maniac idiot police...

Stop and think about this scenario. You get pulled over by someone who has the same thought process and reasoning abilities as a Flat Earther. They accuse you of doing XYZ when you did not do XYZ. You then go on to try to prove your case and argue with the officer (albeit politely of course) but all the evidence and reason you submit to said cop is rejected...

Of course, I'm not saying all police (or even a decent percentage) of them are FE-ers... what I am saying in general is that there is a non-trivial percentage of people (in various professions) who have horrifically bad and illogical thought processes and reasoning abilities that are on par with FE-ers.

That is why I find threads like this interesting and quite frankly scary.

Imagine running into these types of people in a situation in which they are in a position of power over you

 

[Freodin]

What scares me the most about FE believers is not so much what they believe, but rather, their thought process in coming up with their beliefs.

I would argue that there are plenty of people who believe mainstream stuff however have thought processes that aren't too far removed from FE-ers.

The scary types of these are Youtube Videos featuring Ego-maniac idiot police...

Stop and think about this scenario. You get pulled over by someone who has the same thought process and reasoning abilities as a Flat Earther. They accuse you of doing XYZ when you did not do XYZ. You then go on to try to prove your case and argue with the officer (albeit politely of course) but all the evidence and reason you submit to said cop is rejected...

Of course, I'm not saying all police (or even a decent percentage) of them are FE-ers... what I am saying in general is that there is a non-trivial percentage of people (in various professions) who have horrifically bad and illogical thought processes and reasoning abilities that are on par with FE-ers.

That is why I find threads like this interesting and quite frankly scary.

Imagine running into these types of people in a situation in which they are in a position of power over you

I would hope that there is still enough control out there to prevent the real fringe groups from completely taking over... at least enough oversight from those who understand that our society would collapse if these people were allowed to run the shop.

But it is indeed frightening to see what kind of positions this fringe groups propagates. A lot (many/most) Flat Earthers don't treat this as a scientific discussion about diverging positions... for them, it is a cultural war against the forces of evil. A lot of them aren't only Flat Earthers... they are also Anti-Vaxxers, sovereign citizen, Truthers, Birthers. Many are very anti-semitic (Globalists = joos, don'tchaknow?), holocaust deniers, or adhere to even more weird ideas about the way the world works.

And they treat Flerfism as a religious question. "The Globe", in their view, is a satanic conspiracy to "keep the sheeps in bondage", while the Truth of the Flat Earth will "set people free."

One of the more lunatic Flat Earthers recently posted a video demanding that Flat Earth promotion should be considered a protected class and "laws" should be established to protect them from criticism.

 

[dgiharris]

I would hope that there is still enough control out there to prevent the real fringe groups from completely taking over... at least enough oversight from those who understand that our society would collapse if these people were allowed to run the shop.

But it is indeed frightening to see what kind of positions this fringe groups propagates. A lot (many/most) Flat Earthers don't treat this as a scientific discussion about diverging positions... for them, it is a cultural war against the forces of evil. A lot of them aren't only Flat Earthers... they are also Anti-Vaxxers, sovereign citizen, Truthers, Birthers. Many are very anti-semitic (Globalists = joos, don'tchaknow?), holocaust deniers, or adhere to even more weird ideas about the way the world works.

And they treat Flerfism as a religious question. "The Globe", in their view, is a satanic conspiracy to "keep the sheeps in bondage", while the Truth of the Flat Earth will "set people free."

One of the more lunatic Flat Earthers recently posted a video demanding that Flat Earth promotion should be considered a protected class and "laws" should be established to protect them from criticism.

About a year ago I was with a friend at TGIF or Applebees... and the table next to us had 3 parents arguing with one parent about vaccinating their kids. 2 of the parents were anti-vaxxers and 1 was normal and 1 was "open" to both points of view. It was all I could do to not jump into the argument... It just seems so insane to me that in this day and age, people have these beliefs.

But the more insane thing is that these beliefs are sprinkled across all the professions. Granted they are much less in the educated professions but still

 

[d taylor]

That is why this earth will welcome the coming millennium, no more having to listen to sciences lies.

 

[Freodin]

That is why this earth will welcome the coming millennium, no more having to listen to sciences lies.

Please, turn off your computer or smartphone or what ever you use to connect to the Internet to make these posts.

We don't want these diabolical machines to pollute you with their science lies.

 

[A_Thinker]

That is why this earth will welcome the coming millennium, no more having to listen to sciences lies.

No more television, radio, internet, automobiles, refrigeration, air conditioning, central heat, modern medicines, pasteurized milk, clean water, etc.

Science is merely a TOOL God has given us to use. It is not inherently good ... or evil ...

The printing press ... is a product of Science. And the printing press has made it possible for everyone to have access to the scriptures ... in their own language.

 

[d taylor]

No more television, radio, internet, automobiles, refrigeration, air conditioning, central heat, modern medicines, pasteurized milk, clean water, etc.

Science is merely a TOOL God has given us to use. It is not inherently good ... or evil ...

The printing press ... is a product of Science. And the printing press has made it possible for everyone to have access to the scriptures ... in their own language.

Do you have trouble understanding, I stated science lies. Where in my post do you see me saying everything created by technology is a lie.

I guess that is why you can not see the clear teaching in the Bible that God's creation described in the Bible, is completely different from sciences description.

 

[A_Thinker]

the clear teaching in the Bible that God's creation described in the Bible, is completely different from sciences description.

Really ... ???

He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing. Job 26:7

It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in: Isaiah 40:22

 

[Whyayeman]

SeventyOne, I don't think you are right to conflate what you are now calling ignorance with lying. We generally distinguish between lying, which has to be a deliberate effort to deceive, and ignorance. this rather spoils the leg-pull aspect of the theory you propound.

I do not agree with you about the idea of a flat earth because it goes against all the evidence of a longish life. I find that the science follows the evidence very satisfactorily. The accepted idea of a spherical earth gives us rigorous explanations for the phenomena neatly and convincingly, whereas flat earth assertions simply do not.

We exploit the spherical nature all the time. Ships and aeroplanes use the idea of Great Circles to minimise journey lengths. Artificial satellites orbit the earth by balancing the gravitational pull of earth with the inertia given by their launch vehicle and so continue without further need for fuel.

 

[Strathos]

If Jesus returned and revealed to me that the earth was flat, I'd be very surprised, but I'd believe Him. However I have the feeling that the majority of flat eathers wouldn't believe Him if He told them it was round.

 

[SpiritualBeing]

Hey there is going to be a flat earth cruise. Anyone on this site going?

Flat-Earthers Are Organising a Massive Cruise And The Hypocrisy Is Just Too Much

 

[A_Thinker]

Hey there is going to be a flat earth cruise. Anyone on this site going?

Flat-Earthers Are Organising a Massive Cruise And The Hypocrisy Is Just Too Much

Maybe they'll go to Antarctica ...

 

[morse86]

No one has explored past these ice walls. The further you go past the ice walls, the lower the temperature, and more turbulent the weather. No machinery will work at that level.

 

[Freodin]

No one has explored past these ice walls. The further you go past the ice walls, the lower the temperature, and more turbulent the weather. No machinery will work at that level.

Except those who did... but I guess you would choose to label them "liars".

 

[Radagast]

Except those who did... but I guess you would choose to label them "liars".

Countries that have one or more bases in Antarctica:

 

[SeventyOne]

SeventyOne, I don't think you are right to conflate what you are now calling ignorance with lying. We generally distinguish between lying, which has to be a deliberate effort to deceive, and ignorance. this rather spoils the leg-pull aspect of the theory you propound.

We can disagree on this point, but it has no bearing on the validity of the flat earth either way as I'm personally not the foundation on which the argument rests.

I do not agree with you about the idea of a flat earth because it goes against all the evidence of a longish life. I find that the science follows the evidence very satisfactorily. The accepted idea of a spherical earth gives us rigorous explanations for the phenomena neatly and convincingly, whereas flat earth assertions simply do not.

We exploit the spherical nature all the time. Ships and aeroplanes use the idea of Great Circles to minimise journey lengths. Artificial satellites orbit the earth by balancing the gravitational pull of earth with the inertia given by their launch vehicle and so continue without further need for fuel.

I would advise you to actually prove out your assumption of 'whereas flat earth assertions simply do not'. An honest assessment would show that to be more difficult to prove than you might imagine. If you are willing, be a bit more competent than most and seek to gain a working knowledge of the flat earth paradigm before simply writing it off as being unable to accommodate anything. That's one of the great frustrations even discussing this topic here, as it's ridiculed and dismissed quickly by too many who don't show even the most basic understanding of the concept.

I found this clip amusing. An excerpt of a glober live stream who is preparing for a debate on the topic with Eric Dubay, having a meltdown because he's finding that he is unable to debunk flat earth in under an hour as he assumed would be able to do. As he looks into the arguments critically, he finding it makes a whole lot more sense than a globe, and he's really fighting against himself in that reality.

Oh, PROFANITY ALERT!!!!

 

[Freodin]

I would advise you to actually prove out your assumption of 'whereas flat earth assertions simply do not'. An honest assessment would show that to be more difficult to prove than you might imagine.

Well, yes, you are actually correct here. It is quite difficult, even impossible sometimes, to prove a negative.

It is a better way to express his sentiment would be: "none of the 'flat earth assertions' that I have ever seen - including the ones that you provided or cited as reference - give us these rigorous explanations of observations".

That is rather easy to prove.

 

[SeventyOne]

Well, yes, you are actually correct here. It is quite difficult, even impossible sometimes, to prove a negative.

It is a better way to express his sentiment would be: "none of the 'flat earth assertions' that I have ever seen - including the ones that you provided or cited as reference - give us these rigorous explanations of observations".

That is rather easy to prove.

A great example of why I just stopped responding to much of what you all have said on this topic.

When any of you start to show understanding of the flat earth paradigm, you may have some credibility while patting each other on the back and congratulating each other that you are not 'dumb' flat-earthers, but until then, you have nothing substantive to contribute.

 

[A_Thinker]

No one has explored past these ice walls. The further you go past the ice walls, the lower the temperature, and more turbulent the weather. No machinery will work at that level.

Colin O’Brady Completes Crossing of Antarctica With Final 32-Hour Push

 

[A_Thinker]

When any of you start to show understanding of the flat earth paradigm, you may have some credibility while patting each other on the back and congratulating each other that you are not 'dumb' flat-earthers, but until then, you have nothing substantive to contribute.

I think that even you must see something a little wrong with the position ...

"You all need to educate yourselves to the point where you agree with me ... "