The question cessationists must answer.

[RDKirk]

But you go beyond scripture to say another means of distribution exists.

So who in the New Testament was even saved, except by the direct preaching of Jesus or an apostle? From your point of view, the possibility of salvation ended with the death of John.

 

[Dave L]

WADR, the spiritual gifts are distributed by the Holy Spirit to whomever He desires to give them.

But not apart from an apostle.

“He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?” (Galatians 3:5) (KJV 1900)

 

[W2L]

Uh, I think you and Dave are on the same side of the debate. You may want to read what people are posting before commenting.

You are the one who is misreading me. I know hes on my side. You need to stop making such accusations. That has become a pattern for you thus far in the thread.

 

[Dave L]

So who in the New Testament was even saved, except by the direct preaching of Jesus or an apostle? From your point of view, the possibility of salvation ended with the death of John.

We preach the gospel till the end of the world.

 

[Deborah D]

But not apart from an apostle.

“He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?” (Galatians 3:5) (KJV 1900)

Here's a different version of Gal. 3:5--"So then, does God supply you with the Spirit and work miracles among you by the works of the law or by hearing with faith?"

It's not the apostles who minister the Holy Spirit to us, but God. And He does this by hearing His word with faith, not by the works of the law.

 

[Deborah D]

You are the one who is misreading me. I know hes on my side. You need to stop making such accusations. That has become a pattern for you thus far in the thread.

Wow, w2l, no accusation in what I said!

 

[Dave L]

Here's a different version of Gal. 3:5--"So then, does God supply you with the Spirit and work miracles among you by the works of the law or by hearing with faith?"

It's not the apostles who minister the Holy Spirit to us, but God. And He does this by hearing His word by faith, not by the works of the law.

“And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,” (Acts 8:18) (KJV 1900)

 

[Deborah D]

“And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,” (Acts 8:18) (KJV 1900)

Like others who are debating this, I don't see God saying that the only way to receive the gifts of the Spirit is by one of the original apostles laying hands on people.

Edit: If that were the case, wouldn't it apply to all the gifts???


Edit 2: This has been covered over and over in this debate. I have to say that I'll never agree with your position on this because I don't see it as scriptural.
.

 

[W2L]

Wow, w2l, no accusation in what I said!

You accused me of not reading posts i was responding to. Your replies are very dishonest. I will stop talking to you now.

 

[Deborah D]

You accused me of not reading posts i was responding to. You are very dishonest. I will stop talking to you now.

Wrong again! I said, "You may want to read what people are posting before commenting." I KNOW that you haven't read everything I've posted!

 

[Dave L]

Like others who are debating this, I don't see God saying that the only way to receive the gifts of the Spirit is by one of the original apostles laying hands on people.

Edit: If that were the case, wouldn't it apply to all the gifts???


Edit 2: This has been covered over and over in this debate. I have to say that I'll never agree with your position on this because I don't see it as scriptural.
.

But we go beyond scripture when we assume other ways of distributing the gifts happened. It is without warrant. This is adding to God's word.

 

[Deborah D]

But we go beyond scripture when we assume other ways of distributing the gifts happened. It is without warrant. This is adding to God's word.

I disagree that this is adding to God's word. You didn't address the other gifts.

 

[Dave L]

I disagree that this is adding to God's word. You didn't address the other gifts.

There are many gifts in place today. But tongues, prophecy and word of knowledge were like pieces of a jigsaw puzzle. When you rounded them all up and put them together, the full picture emerged. Scripture is the big picture, where the revelatory gifts were only pieces of it.

 

[W2L]

Wrong again! I said, "You may want to read what people are posting before commenting." I KNOW that you haven't read everything I've posted!

How did you know i wasnt reading his posts? You assumed and then accused. Get real. Please dont respond to me further. Without love none of the gifts profit anything. Show me some love and dont reply again.

 

[RDKirk]

There are many gifts in place today. But tongues, prophecy and word of knowledge were like pieces of a jigsaw puzzle. When you rounded them all up and put them together, the full picture emerged. Scripture is the big picture, where the revelatory gifts were only pieces of it.

So are you limiting your cessationism to the "revelatory gifts" then?

 

[NBB]

There are many gifts in place today. But tongues, prophecy and word of knowledge were like pieces of a jigsaw puzzle. When you rounded them all up and put them together, the full picture emerged. Scripture is the big picture, where the revelatory gifts were only pieces of it.

Can God reveal if you have an evil spirit on you?

 

[Dave L]

So are you limiting your cessationism to the "revelatory gifts" then?

I think we see the sign gifts and command miracles dwindling as the NT unfolds. We have the prayer of faith but no body is performing the level of miracles we saw in the gospels and Acts.

 

[Dave L]

Can God reveal if you have a bad spirit on you?

Scripture will reveal this in ourselves and others.

 

[NBB]

Scripture will reveal this in ourselves and others.

Ok, ehm, we disagree here, if it were for that a lot of people would have just have not got free from a lot of problems related to evil spirits, myself included. A lot of them not manifest themsevles in obvious ways.

 

[LoveofTruth]

And what would be the point of telling them to "covet earnestly the best gifts" rather than, "I'll hook you up the next time I'm in town" if the gifts were administered only by apostles?

This is my point they don’t need just apostles to lay hands on them.

And the apostles are after the resurrection as well Ephesians 4:8-11

And nowhere does it say the gifts have ceased

A manifestation of the Spirit is given to EVERY man to profit withal 1Cor 13:7