- Oct 27, 2017
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And I have understood the torment means that he is burned forever. That doesn’t necessary mean he is living, especially because according to the Bible, eternal life is for righteous.
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46
If all live eternally, I don’t see any reason to say that only righteous will live.
Firstly, I want to say, I don’t think people are punished because the rejected Jesus. People are judged because of sin, and sin remains, if person doesn’t accept the forgiveness that is offered through Jesus.
Secondly, I think the rescue operation is significant, even if there is no eternal suffering.
(1) How is it torment if you don't feel it? If I beat on a dead piece of meat in a meat freezer with a baseball bat, is that tormenting the cow who is already dead? So, at the point that you are dead, how is it everlasting punishment? Why would Jesus use the same word (translated "eternal") for both? Why wouldn't He just say: "These will be permanently killed" or "tormented to death" if what you think He meant is actually what He meant?
(2) He didn't say we all live eternally, because we don't. Jesus defined eternal life differently than we do. Jesus said in John 17:3: "And this is eternal life, that they might know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, Whom You have sent." So, those who don't know Him don't have eternal life, by the very definition Jesus gives.
(3) For those who are suffering eternal punishment, it certainly wouldn't seem like "life" to be tormented. Jesus doesn't call it "eternal life", he calls that "eternal punishment".
(4) I do agree that we are all worthy of death, because of our sin. However, Jesus paid the price for all. Jesus even said He would draw all men to himself. We are saved from the wrath of God (not the wrath of another god, but of GOD), right? God put the stipulation that "whosoever believes...", not me., right?
(5) You are right that the rescue operation is significant whether it is eternal suffering or not. I didn't word that correctly. The opportunity to know and live with God is a far greater consequence, either way.
(6) My bigger point was that if something about people wasn't everlasting, then why did Jesus talk as if some consciousness was living on and tormented in hades (presumably all the way until the judgment)? And, if they were still conscious for that long, then why would it be logical to believe that it all stopped when they are cast somewhere where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth? And, Scripture says the devil is tormented day and night forever, not tormented day and night until he dies.
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