Seemingly Anti-OSAS Scriptures

Gr8Grace

Well-Known Member
Mar 11, 2018
1,389
394
51
South Dakota
✟75,931.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I'm trying to see your point of view, so I ask these questions.



JLB

See ,this is difference. We see and understand your point of view. And have addressed your point of view ad nauseam. We have addressed your point of view over and over and over.......But ours is never addressed. Never. And after 5 or 6 years our point of view is still an enigma?
 
Upvote 0

JLB777

Newbie
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2012
5,905
1,258
✟403,811.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You couldn't figure that out from post #874?


No. You have your opinion tagged with scripture references but no actual scripture and no definition of the word lost.

In your theology does lost mean:

Saved or unsaved.

Just or unjust.

Seperated from God or reconciled to God


Sinner in need of repentance or saint.



JPT
 
Upvote 0

FreeGrace2

Senior Veteran
Nov 15, 2012
20,401
1,703
USA
✟184,557.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
JLB777 said:
I'm trying to see your point of view, so I ask these questions.
JLB
See ,this is difference. We see and understand your point of view. And have addressed your point of view ad nauseam. We have addressed your point of view over and over and over.......But ours is never addressed. Never. And after 5 or 6 years our point of view is still an enigma?
This is just clear evidence that he has never had any intention of anything other than pushing his own opinions.

There is no interest in those who disagree with him. And he doesn't care. So he has to ignore our views and act like he's "just trying" to understand them.

Nonsense.

What's really interesting is how he seems totally unaware of how embarrassing his position is. That he CAN'T deal with our view, nor our verses, so he ignores them.

But, the really sad thing is that, just like Pharaoh, the more he resists the truth, the
more he is hardening his heart.

Tragic.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Gr8Grace
Upvote 0

JLB777

Newbie
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2012
5,905
1,258
✟403,811.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
No, you ignored the core of my question. I PROVED that the gift of etenral life is given to those who BELIEVE, not at the end of one's physical life as you erroneously misunderstand Scripture.

So your answer inserts a FALSE PREMISE, unlike my question, which presents the truth of Scripture.


I've given a list of 24 verses that clearly teach that eternal life and salvation are by faith in Christ, and NONE of them mentions "continuance in doing good".

Further, Paul, who wrote Rom 2:7,8 went on to state that no human is good, that all are sinners and that all have fallen short of God's glory.

So if you're banking on Rom 2:7,8 to getting to heaven, you'll be sadly disappointed.


Paul was addressing the self-righteous who thought they could earn eternal life.


Just back up to v.24 in John 5 to learn HOW to possess eternal life; believing.


Sure. Ignore relevant context.
v.24 - “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.

Why do you always ignore this verse? I mean, other than the fact that it totally destroys your opinion.


And this is permanent.


I don't care how you describe it. It is permanent.


Jesus said clearly that recipients of eternal life shall never perish in John 10:28, yet your view has been just as clear; recipients of eternal life CAN perish.

Therefore, you don't believe what Jesus said. So 1 John 2:4 applies to you:
He who doesn't believe what Jesus teaches in John 10:28 is a liar and the truth is not in him.


No Scripture. Just more erroneous opinion.


Where does this anonymous verse say that keepiing His commandments continue to have eternal life?

Your statement is a LIE and not found in Scripture.

Eph 1;13,14 says when one believes, they are sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit as a deposit which guarantees their inheritance until their redemption as God's possession.


Nonsense.


Since you reject the teaching of fellowship, it's no use to explain this verse from 1 John, which is about fellowship.


I answered your question using scripture.

eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7


This verse whereby we receive eternal life occurs on the Day of Judgement in which eternal life is given to to those who do good.




Does a born again Christian brother who is offended by his brother, and does not for him, but hates his brother, still have eternal life in Him?


  • Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15



Does a born again Christian have to continue in the teachings of Christ, to still have God?



  • Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9



Is a born again Christian required to continue to keep His commandments, to continue to have eternal life?


  • He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


If a born again Christian claims he knows Him, but does not keep His commandments, is he a liar?


  • But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.” Revelation 21:8



JLB
 
Upvote 0

FreeGrace2

Senior Veteran
Nov 15, 2012
20,401
1,703
USA
✟184,557.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
No. You have your opinion tagged with scripture references but no actual scripture and no definition of the word lost.
Why do you persist in this phony nonsense? The website allows anyone to read the verse by putting their cursor over the verse cited, or "tagged" as you claim.

These are nothing more than petty.

Change in name? What happened to JLB?
 
Upvote 0

JLB777

Newbie
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2012
5,905
1,258
✟403,811.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
See ,this is difference. We see and understand your point of view. And have addressed your point of view ad nauseam. We have addressed your point of view over and over and over.......But ours is never addressed. Never. And after 5 or 6 years our point of view is still an enigma?


Your point of view ignores scripture, and has been exposed as false doctrine.


eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7

Eternal life is given on the Day of Judgement to those who do good.


JLB
 
Upvote 0

Danthemailman

Well-Known Member
Jul 18, 2017
3,688
2,805
Midwest
✟303,775.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
No. You have your opinion tagged with scripture references but no actual scripture and no definition of the word lost.

In your theology does lost mean:

Saved or unsaved.

Just or unjust.

Seperated from God or reconciled to God

Sinner in need of repentance or saint.

JPT
You just don't get it and there is also just no getting through to you. :(
 
Upvote 0

JLB777

Newbie
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2012
5,905
1,258
✟403,811.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Why do you persist in this phony nonsense? The website allows anyone to read the verse by putting their cursor over the verse cited, or "tagged" as you claim.

These are nothing more than petty.


Change in name? What happened to JLB?


eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7


Here is who will receive eternal life.



JLB
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

JLB777

Newbie
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2012
5,905
1,258
✟403,811.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
See ,this is difference. We see and understand your point of view. And have addressed your point of view ad nauseam. We have addressed your point of view over and over and over.......But ours is never addressed. Never. And after 5 or 6 years our point of view is still an enigma?


Does a born again Christian brother who is offended by his brother, and does not for him, but hates his brother, still have eternal life in Him?


  • Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15



Does a born again Christian have to continue in the teachings of Christ, to still have God?



  • Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9



Is a born again Christian required to continue to keep His commandments, to continue to have eternal life?


  • He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


If a born again Christian claims he knows Him, but does not keep His commandments, is he a liar?


  • But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.” Revelation 21:8



JLB
 
Upvote 0

FreeGrace2

Senior Veteran
Nov 15, 2012
20,401
1,703
USA
✟184,557.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
I said this:
"No, you ignored the core of my question. I PROVED that the gift of etenral life is given to those who BELIEVE, not at the end of one's physical life as you erroneously misunderstand Scripture."
I answered your question using scripture.
The verses you abused failed to even be relevant to my question. And you ignored the proof that Rom 2:7-8 cannot be fulfilled by ANY PERSON other than Jesus Christ.

eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7

This verse whereby we receive eternal life occurs on the Day of Judgement in which eternal life is given to to those who do good.
Go ahead and ignore or reject what ELSE Paul wrote and what I said:
"Further, Paul, who wrote Rom 2:7,8 went on to state that no human is good, that all are sinners and that all have fallen short of God's glory.

So if you're banking on Rom 2:7,8 to getting to heaven, you'll be sadly disappointed."

Rom 3:9 - What shall we conclude then? Do we have any advantage? Not at all! For we have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under the power of sin.

So, how can anyone who is under the power of sin fulfill Rom 2:7?

Rom 3:23 - for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

So, since ALL have sinned, they SURE haven't fulfilled Rom 2:7.

And here's the clincher:
Rom 3:20 - Therefore no one will be declared righteous in God’s sight by the works of the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of our sin.

And you KNOW that you CANNOT explain that somehow you are above these verses and CAN earn eternal life by "continuance in doing good".

Not so, buddy.

Does a born again Christian brother who is offended by his brother, and does not for him, but hates his brother, still have eternal life in Him?
Jesus said those given eternal life shall never perish in John 10:28. But you don't believe that.

But the real issue is that you're now talking out of both sides of your mouth. You've also argued that no one receives eternal life until the day of judgment.

So your question here is bogus if you still believe that eternal life is given at the day of judgment. So there's no answer to a question where the questioner is conflicted in his views.

So, go and figure out which position to stick with, and then stick with it.

Is a born again Christian required to continue to keep His commandments, to continue to have eternal life?
Said the phony who also argues that no one has eternal life until the day of judgment.

If a born again Christian claims he knows Him, but does not keep His commandments, is he a liar?
Actually, the one who claims to be a Christian and knows Christ, but rejects the teachings of Christ, does NOT keep His commandments and IS a LIAR.

But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.” Revelation 21:8
Ok, one more time, since it appears you didn't absorb it the first time.

The first word in this list "cowardly" means "fearful", or "lack of trusting", which means no saving faith in Jesus Christ.

The next on the list is "unbelieving", so John was really emphasizing who end up in the lake of fire; unbelievers.

The rest of the list are less serious than unbelief in Christ.

Christ died for all the sins of all of mankind. Maybe you, like Calvinists, don't believe that. I don't know, because you've never dealt with this point, but He did and the Bible says so.

So, no one goes to the lake of fire for sins. Any sins. They go there for NOT having eternal life, which is why their names are not in the book of life, per Rev 20:15. Go ahead and look it up. The book of Revelation is the last book of the Bible, in case you're not very familiar with the Bible.
 
Upvote 0

FreeGrace2

Senior Veteran
Nov 15, 2012
20,401
1,703
USA
✟184,557.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Eternal life is given on the Day of Judgement to those who do good.
Then why to you persist in asking if a Christian who hates his brother "still has eternal life in him"?

Your views are conflicted. You need to figure yourself out.
 
Upvote 0

FreeGrace2

Senior Veteran
Nov 15, 2012
20,401
1,703
USA
✟184,557.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7

Here is who will receive eternal life.
Scripture says differently. It isn't by effort, works, doing good. That's what the Pharisees thought. So you are one of them. Congratulations.

Rom 3:9 and 23 refute your false ideas. And Rom 3:20 seals the deal.

I've already quoted them for you. You have no excuse for your unbiblical ideas.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

FreeGrace2

Senior Veteran
Nov 15, 2012
20,401
1,703
USA
✟184,557.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Does a born again Christian brother who is offended by his brother, and does not for him, but hates his brother, still have eternal life in Him?
You are a phony. This is what you said to gr8grace in post #886:
"Your point of view ignores scripture, and has been exposed as false doctrine.

eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7

Eternal life is given on the Day of Judgement to those who do good.
JLB"

So, which is it? Does a believer "STILL HAVE eternal life IN Him" while on earth, or only on the Day of Judgment?

Your view is so conflicted.

Busted.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: Gr8Grace
Upvote 0

Gr8Grace

Well-Known Member
Mar 11, 2018
1,389
394
51
South Dakota
✟75,931.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Your point of view ignores scripture, and has been exposed as false doctrine.


eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7

Eternal life is given on the Day of Judgement to those who do good.


JLB
Look at the word 'good' in Rom 2:7. You will find that it is a singular good work.

To Those who are, on the basis of expectation of a SINGULAR good work(the Lord Jesus Christ on the cross) are seeking eternal life,glory,honor and immortality.

As Freegrace has pointed out, the way you are interpreting this verse is vehemently apposed by Paul in this very book. Not to mention throughout scripture.

And most level headed, reasonable and sane persons would look at this verse and at least pause a bit and question themselves if they interpreted Rom 2:7 like you:

1 John 5:13~~New American Standard Bible
These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.
 
Upvote 0

JLB777

Newbie
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2012
5,905
1,258
✟403,811.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You are a phony. This is what you said to gr8grace in post #886:
"Your point of view ignores scripture, and has been exposed as false doctrine.

eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7

Eternal life is given on the Day of Judgement to those who do good.
JLB"

So, which is it? Does a believer "STILL HAVE eternal life IN Him" while on earth, or only on the Day of Judgment?

Your view is so conflicted.

Busted.
Scripture says differently. It isn't by effort, works, doing good. That's what the Pharisees thought. So you are one of them. Congratulations.

Rom 3:9 and 23 refute your false ideas. And Rom 3:20 seals the deal.

I've already quoted them for you. You have no excuse for your unbiblical ideas.
I said this:
"No, you ignored the core of my question. I PROVED that the gift of etenral life is given to those who BELIEVE, not at the end of one's physical life as you erroneously misunderstand Scripture."

The verses you abused failed to even be relevant to my question. And you ignored the proof that Rom 2:7-8 cannot be fulfilled by ANY PERSON other than Jesus Christ.


Go ahead and ignore or reject what ELSE Paul wrote and what I said:
"Further, Paul, who wrote Rom 2:7,8 went on to state that no human is good, that all are sinners and that all have fallen short of God's glory.

So if you're banking on Rom 2:7,8 to getting to heaven, you'll be sadly disappointed."

Rom 3:9 - What shall we conclude then? Do we have any advantage? Not at all! For we have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under the power of sin.

So, how can anyone who is under the power of sin fulfill Rom 2:7?

Rom 3:23 - for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

So, since ALL have sinned, they SURE haven't fulfilled Rom 2:7.

And here's the clincher:
Rom 3:20 - Therefore no one will be declared righteous in God’s sight by the works of the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of our sin.

And you KNOW that you CANNOT explain that somehow you are above these verses and CAN earn eternal life by "continuance in doing good".

Not so, buddy.


Jesus said those given eternal life shall never perish in John 10:28. But you don't believe that.

But the real issue is that you're now talking out of both sides of your mouth. You've also argued that no one receives eternal life until the day of judgment.

So your question here is bogus if you still believe that eternal life is given at the day of judgment. So there's no answer to a question where the questioner is conflicted in his views.

So, go and figure out which position to stick with, and then stick with it.


Said the phony who also argues that no one has eternal life until the day of judgment.


Actually, the one who claims to be a Christian and knows Christ, but rejects the teachings of Christ, does NOT keep His commandments and IS a LIAR.


Ok, one more time, since it appears you didn't absorb it the first time.

The first word in this list "cowardly" means "fearful", or "lack of trusting", which means no saving faith in Jesus Christ.

The next on the list is "unbelieving", so John was really emphasizing who end up in the lake of fire; unbelievers.

The rest of the list are less serious than unbelief in Christ.

Christ died for all the sins of all of mankind. Maybe you, like Calvinists, don't believe that. I don't know, because you've never dealt with this point, but He did and the Bible says so.

So, no one goes to the lake of fire for sins. Any sins. They go there for NOT having eternal life, which is why their names are not in the book of life, per Rev 20:15. Go ahead and look it up. The book of Revelation is the last book of the Bible, in case you're not very familiar with the Bible.


Here is who the bible says will receive eternal life on the Day of Judgement -


eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7



This is granted to the one who hears His Voice and follows Him throughout their life.


Can't be refuted, because this teaching is from Jesus!


Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation. John 5:28-29


  • those who have done good, to the resurrection of life


You have not answered any of my questions, nor have you presented any scripture that can refute these words.



  • eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;

  • those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.



Your doctrine teaches people they can do evil, and hate, and still receive eternal life.


  • those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.


Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15




You will surely perish with your doctrine of demons if you don't repent.




JLB
 
Upvote 0

Gr8Grace

Well-Known Member
Mar 11, 2018
1,389
394
51
South Dakota
✟75,931.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Does a born again Christian brother who is offended by his brother, and does not for him, but hates his brother, still have eternal life in Him?
Eternal life is given on the Day of Judgement to those who do good.
Friday at 10:20 PM#707

Gr8GraceActive Member
343
✟13,994.00
+177
United States
Christian
Married
I don't even understand how you think you can ask this!?

In your theology we are not born again and do not become sheep until we have worked ourselves to death.

Everybody has to answer, " I don't know" based on your theology.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

JLB777

Newbie
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2012
5,905
1,258
✟403,811.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
As Freegrace has pointed out, the way you are interpreting this verse is vehemently apposed by Paul in this very book. Not to mention throughout scripture.


  • eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; Romans 2:7

  • those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation. John 5:28-29



Your doctrine teaches people they can do evil, and hate, and still receive eternal life.


  • those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.


Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15




JLB
 
Upvote 0