The Restitution Of All Things A.K.A. Universalism

[FineLinen]

It most certainly does say both... as I said the lens you read through is what you will see.

And each lens we are looking through, can and will be changed by an explosion of His Presence in the quickening of the Holy Ghost and fire!

what link? send again? i

Depression Disorders

P.S. Clement has overwhelming resources that have taken many moons to accumulate. If you are patient, and break some of it down in little bits, you will be amazed at what you can see.

My friend, a new Day breaks on the horizon. Let us arise and go to meet the Author!

 

[needhugs]

And each lens we are looking through, can and will be changed by an explosion of His Presence in the quickening of the Holy Ghost and fire!



Depression Disorders

P.S. Clement has overwhelming resources that have taken many moons to accumulate. If you are patient, and break some of it down in little bits, you will be amazed at what you can see.

My friend, a new Day breaks on the horizon. Let us arise and go to meet the Author!

i'm not depressed, except when under demonic attack, of course
i have been diagnosed with bipolar, coz when i first got attacked by demons, i thought I MUST HAVE GONE INSANE, and when a psychiatrist hears 'demons' you are branded bipolar.

sorry, did i talk too much again in that last post? i see you didn't respond to it.
it's only 2 am... i'm still awake from yesterday

 

[gordonhooker]

And each lens we are looking through, can and will be changed by an explosion of His Presence in the quickening of the Holy Ghost and fire!



Depression Disorders

P.S. Clement has overwhelming resources that have taken many moons to accumulate. If you are patient, and break some of it down in little bits, you will be amazed at what you can see.

My friend, a new Day breaks on the horizon. Let us arise and go to meet the Author!

From one to the other or a third transcended lens?

 

[FineLinen]

That would be the Third lens!

"We all must die and are like water spilled on the ground that cannot be gathered up again>>>>>`

BUT

the Lord does not take away life>>>>>>>

INSTEAD

He deviseth ways for the banished to be restored."

 

[FineLinen]

i'm not depressed, except when under demonic attack, of course
i have been diagnosed with bipolar, coz when i first got attacked by demons, i thought I MUST HAVE GONE INSANE, and when a psychiatrist hears 'demons' you are branded bipolar.

sorry, did i talk too much again in that last post? i see you didn't respond to it.
it's only 2 am... i'm still awake from yesterday

My dear Lady: In the section F.L has asked you to visit, there is a section where stories of inspiration are being presented by F.L. I have no intention of not staying focused on the wonderful theme of our Father (Abba) and His "cherished purpose"; with that said, I intend on continued prayer to Him for you & every individual brought before me under the curse of anything.

 

[FineLinen]

I really like this poem from the 1800's I believe it says it all but many would not agree because there always needs to be a them and us, humans cannot help themselves...

The Fullness of Time
By James Stephens (b. 1882)
On a rusty iron throne
Past the furthest star of space
I saw Satan sit alone,
Old and haggard was his face;
For his work was done and he
Rested in eternity.

And to him from out the sun
Came his father and his friend
Saying, now the work is done
Enmity is at an end:
And he guided Satan to
Paradises that he knew.

Gabriel without a frown,
Uriel without a spear,
Raphael came singing down
Welcoming their ancient peer,
And they seated him beside
One who had been crucified.

F.L. likes it too. I cannot behold a more glorious place to be seated!

 

[FineLinen]

MORE, MUCH MORE

"But not as the offence, so also the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many." (Romans 5:15)

It is interesting to observe that while all Christendom will acknowledge that by one man, and his offence, death passed upon all men, yet they cannot accept the glorious fact that much more the grace of God shall abound unto all men. That one man's offence could cause such devastation of the human race, because death passed upon all men, does not provoke an argument, for the evidence is all around us. But when one man, Christ Jesus, releases the outflow of grace, through His obedience to the will of God, then people find it hard to believe that this shall have the same coverage, for ALL men.

Yet there is also a MUCH MORE to be brought into account here, for the FREE GIFT is not the same as the offence. One act of disobedience brought the judgment unto condemnation. But by the time the free gift came on the scene, there was not just one offence to take care of, but now it must cover many offences and a multitude of sins. Therefore, how much greater is this free gift, able to go beyond all sin and gain the victory, until ALL shall receive His life.

"For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ," (Rom. 5:17). There is no need to describe to what extent death has reigned. But there is a realm, which is greater in its dominion, as we much more reign in life.

Death cannot keep its prey, for LIFE is greater than all death, and Jesus Christ is Lord, both of the dead and the living. He hath the keys of death and hell, and when He opens the gates of death, every captive shall be set free, and shall come forth into His life. "Where sin abounded, grace did MUCH MORE ABOUND," (Romans 5:20).

Much more than all the sin and strife,
We see in Christ abundant LIFE. -Ray Prinzing-

 

[Der Alte]

Because you are not going to change the minds of the ones who do believe that scripture tells us the salvation is universal and scripture also tells us it is not, and it all depends on what lens you are reading the scripture through. No one's mind is going to be changed by it.

I decided that here in the 20th century. The hard core heterodox believers are almost impossible to reach so I continue that perhaps I might reach someone who is undecided, wavering on the fence thinking about joining or leaving such groups. And I am glad to say that I have had some success.

 

[FineLinen]

I decided that here in the 20th century. The hard core heterodox believers are almost impossible to reach so I continue that perhaps I might reach someone who is undecided, wavering on the fence thinking about joining or leaving such groups. And I am glad to say that I have had some success.

Stories Of Hope & Inspiration

 

[ClementofA]

why do you call Him 'Love Omnipotent'? is that your own nickname for Him?

It combines two things Scripture tells us about God, that He is omnipotent & love. It recalls to my mind the question, if He doesn't save all is it because His love expired like a carton of milk, or because He is not powerful enough to do so?

 

[needhugs]

It combines two things Scripture tells us about God, that He is omnipotent & love. It recalls to my mind the question, if He doesn't save all is it because His love expired like a carton of milk, or because He is not powerful enough to do so?

a rose by any name would smell as sweet

 

[needhugs]

My dear Lady: In the section F.L has asked you to visit, there is a section where stories of inspiration are being presented by F.L. I have no intention of not staying focused on the wonderful theme of our Father (Abba) and His "cherished purpose"; with that said, I intend on continued prayer to Him for you & every individual brought before me under the curse of anything.

I WAS talking about the wonderful theme... i just also put some of my humanity into it, because people care about matters of the heart, not just ... what they think are 'theories' presented in the same way over and over... i'm not a nag haha

James 2:
15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

Romans 12:15
Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.

 

[Hillsage]

We have those who actually believe the Father of all fathers, does not simply correct, and at times chastise, His wayward children, BUT is intent on endless punishment for any that "cross" Him! To add to this already nasty scene, actually adds "unending torment" to the mix. I have no idea what would entertain a person to follow a god like this? I cannot grasp it, not for a second. Fine Linen, for one, will rest His weary head on Abba, who will join me?

I believe I do know what entertains a person to follow a god like that.

JER 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
Unfortunately I believe that this interpretation of the Hebrew is sadly wrong. According to Strong's, alternative words could be;

"deceitful" 6121 `aqob: in the orig. sense, a knoll (as swelling up); in the denom. sense (trans.) fraudulent or (intrans.) track: crooked, deceitful, POLLUTED.

"wicked" 0605 'anash: to be frail, feeble, or (fig.) melancholy: incurable, SICK, woeful

IOW The heart is POLLUTED above all things, and desperately SICK: who can know it?

Our admonition from God at creation was thus. "Let US make man IN OUR IMAGE and AFTER our LIKENESS."

Indeed mankind was made in the image/substance of God which, according to scripture means man is spirit because "God is spirit". And God put a "spirit in man" from Him, into a 'just created' body of clay. God never had a clay body, "GOD IS SPIRIT". And the cry of the heart of that man was to be pursuing "after His likeness". But Adam/Eve were NOT 'LIKE GOD', because God would not have sinned, but they did.

Now 'the gist' of my answer to your query. I think most entertain a 'likeness of God' which is more akin to a cosmic Hitler with an eternal Auschwitz. And they do so because the indoctrinated hearts of men are polluted and sick. An historical example, is that of 'Bloody queen Mary' who justified the horrific torture of even martyring saints (judged heretics by 'the church') by burning them at the stake. And the defensive motive she gave for justifying such horror was, 'God is going to burn the heretics for eternity, I'm just going to help them get started.' For me, that subliminal likeness of God comes from polluted and sickening theology like I was first taught and believed. I once was blind, but now I see. 'They' can not see that though.

 

[FineLinen]

I believe I do know what entertains a person to follow a god like that.

JER 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
Unfortunately I believe that this interpretation of the Hebrew is sadly wrong. According to Strong's, alternative words could be;

"deceitful" 6121 `aqob: in the orig. sense, a knoll (as swelling up); in the denom. sense (trans.) fraudulent or (intrans.) track: crooked, deceitful, POLLUTED.

"wicked" 0605 'anash: to be frail, feeble, or (fig.) melancholy: incurable, SICK, woeful

IOW The heart is POLLUTED above all things, and desperately SICK: who can know it?

Our admonition from God at creation was thus. "Let US make man IN OUR IMAGE and AFTER our LIKENESS."

Indeed mankind was made in the image/substance of God which, according to scripture means man is spirit because "God is spirit". And God put a "spirit in man" from Him, into a 'just created' body of clay. God never had a clay body, "GOD IS SPIRIT". And the cry of the heart of that man was to be pursuing "after His likeness". But Adam/Eve were NOT 'LIKE GOD', because God would not have sinned, but they did.

Now 'the gist' of my answer to your query. I think most entertain a 'likeness of God' which is more akin to a cosmic Hitler with an eternal Auschwitz. And they do so because the indoctrinated hearts of men are polluted and sick. An historical example, is that of 'Bloody queen Mary' who justified the horrific torture of even martyring saints (judged heretics by 'the church') by burning them at the stake. And the defensive motive she gave for justifying such horror was, 'God is going to burn the heretics for eternity, I'm just going to help them get started.' For me, that subliminal likeness of God comes from polluted and sickening theology I was first taught and believed. I once was blind, but now I see. 'They' can not see that though.

My brother, the deceitfulness of the human heart has produced polluted and sickening theology indeed. When blindness and hearing impairment are added, a ghastly sight is to be viewed. You continue to be an asset to this link, and more importantly, a testimony to the Father! May He continue to expand all of us in the knowledge of His glorious Plan.

 

[FineLinen]

P.T. Barnum

"These arguments assert a God who either cannot, or will not, bring the creation of His hands to order; hence he is not God -not infinite. His name should begin with a small letter. The atheist accepts the argument, and if there is an arch-fiend he certainly laughs. No argument for a finally harmonious universe can be made save on the basis of Christian theism. I do not, indeed, insist that a man must accept my definition or conception of Deity; but some conception which does not rob Him of the necessary attributes of His being. He may say with Arnold, " A power not ourselves which makes for righteousness." Very well; if only Arnold's God continues to make for righteousness, Universalism is assured. If, however, one is able to say with Jesus, "Our Father who art in heaven," the argument is still stronger. To him who believes neither of these ideas of God nor their equivalent, I can make no argument which will avail."

WHY I AM A UNIVERSALIST - P.T. BARNUM

"I WAS educated in the strictest So-called "orthodox faith." When I was from ten to fourteen years of age, I attended prayer meetings where I could almost feel the burning waves and smell the sulphurous fumes. I remember the shrieks and groans of suffering children and parents and even aged grandparents. I would return to my home and with the utmost sincerity ask God to take me out of the world if He would only Save me from hell. I professed to love God, Said I hoped I loved Him as I heard my elders do. Necessarily before this seething sulphurous sea of flame my love must have been similar to the love a woman would feel to a tyrant who with a loaded pistol pointed at her heart bade her love him or die. I grew to know that true love cannot be forced. We cannot love the unlovely. "We love Him because He first loved us." -P.T. Barnum-

 

[needhugs]

oh come ON!! you CANNOT tell me, that Christians who actually believe in eternal torture in flames for almost all of humanity are not WEEPING!!! they may not know they are, but that is a hideous wound to the soul and spirit, and they may have shoved it down into their unconscious mind, but THEY ARE WEEPING... and well... i do think we are called to weep with those who weep...

but nevermind lol

 

[FineLinen]

oh come ON!! you CANNOT tell me, that Christians who actually believe in eternal torture in flames for almost all of humanity are not WEEPING!!! they may not know they are, but that is a hideous wound to the soul and spirit, and they may have shoved it down into their unconscious mind, but THEY ARE WEEPING... and well... i do think we are called to weep with those who weep...

but nevermind lol

The entire concept is rooted in depravity, not in the Father of all fathers! There are many who are attempting to make the mass of humanity weep, who will be the most proficient weepers in the Kingdom.

Destruction=

"Destruction" is a key term in the Bible used to support the teaching of either annihilation of the wicked or hell fire for eternity or "burning as long as one deserves." The term "destruction" leads to many differences of opinion. But most of the conclusions are not Scripturally based.

The "Destruction" of the Wicked

 

[needhugs]

The entire concept is rooted in depravity, not in the Father of all fathers! There are many who are attempting to make the mass of humanity weep, who will be the most proficient weepers in the Kingdom.

Destruction=

"Destruction" is a key term in the Bible used to support the teaching of either annihilation of the wicked or hell fire for eternity or "burning as long as one deserves." The term "destruction" leads to many differences of opinion. But most of the conclusions are not Scripturally based.

The "Destruction" of the Wicked

you know... when i believed that hellfire for eternity was true, it was because i thought it was a package deal i had to believe to get to Jesus.

the pain of that doctrine caused insanity in me, but i don't think i believed it out of depravity, i think i believed it coz it's what 'the church' teaches.... i was willing to separate myself from that crowd, and stopped going to church, i mean honestly, you know how they tell you 'don't believe me GO HOME AND READ THE SCRIPTURES FOR YOURSELF'.... i think they just assume that nobody ever does that... BUT I DID, and mostly found out they were either LYING or twisting scripture to mean something else entirely. (that could be depravity, i don't know)

plus, lazy preachers just listen to other preachers preaching lies, and they just copy cat it.. this is how we get a dante's inferno under our butts as we listen to them... and how we get this 'tradition of men, that makes God's Word of no effect'

i know that destruction means to be brought down to nothing, until you admit God is God hehe... like king nebudchenezzer ... but i will go read your link.

it seems that we have won the argument... at least nobody is left arguing with us lol

 

[FineLinen]

you know... when i believed that hellfire for eternity was true, it was because i thought it was a package deal i had to believe to get to Jesus.

the pain of that doctrine caused insanity in me, but i don't think i believed it out of depravity, i think i believed it coz it's what 'the church' teaches.... i was willing to separate myself from that crowd, and stopped going to church, i mean honestly, you know how they tell you 'don't believe me GO HOME AND READ THE SCRIPTURES FOR YOURSELF'.... i think they just assume that nobody ever does that... BUT I DID, and mostly found out they were either LYING or twisting scripture to mean something else entirely. (that could be depravity, i don't know)

plus, lazy preachers just listen to other preachers preaching lies, and they just copy cat it.. this is how we get a dante's inferno under our butts as we listen to them... and how we get this 'tradition of men, that makes God's Word of no effect'

i know that destruction means to be brought down to nothing, until you admit God is God hehe... like king nebudchenezzer ... but i will go read your link.

it seems that we have won the argument... at least nobody is left arguing with us lol

 

[FineLinen]

My dear NeedHugs: Our God specializes in bringing His purpose to bear in every life. Destruction is not a feel good experience, but if one is to be destroyed let it be Abba who is at the Source! We can trust the One who does all things well.

Originally Posted by Wardendresden

"But as I stated it does not say He is righteousness, He is justice, He is holiness. It does say He is love.

And since Jesus summed up the entire OT by stating love God with all your mind and strength and heart, and love your neighbor as yourself, why do you add to it by stating you have to be "righteous," or "not believe in universalism?"

If one lives by love in all circumstances there is no sin that they can commit that will separate them from God.

Yet you lift Scripture from the Bible as much as anyone else---because the Bible remains contradictory on many subjects. But if one applies LOVE to every subject in the Bible, one will always make the choices Jesus made. The Bible is full of inconsistencies, hundreds if not thousands of them. The only way to "reconcile" them is to have a yard mark. For me that yard mark is Jesus. Anything, any action, any purpose that does not fit in with how God in the Flesh revealed Himself to us means nothing at all.

So what about universalism bothers you other than you "don't believe it." If God decides to save all is He somehow a lesser god than if He shows us all He can bring down fire and brimstone upon the greater part of humanity?

I would suggest you read the book of James slowly and carefully once again--and then again---and then a third time in hopes that you will absorb the importance of love above all other attributes.

As Paul said, "The greatest of these is love."

FineLinen=

Warden: That is one class post indeed! I can only find three Scriptures that define what our God is (His essential Nature)."

God is

Spirit= John 4.24

Fire= Hebr 4.29

Love= 1 John 4.8