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Listening to Hillsong

Dave-W

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Nothing in the Bible says to "respect given congressional leadership."
Other than Hebrews 13. 17.

But we do have Paul's example of going into synagogues to teach in Acts. He waited until the leaders invited him to speak.
 
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Dave-W

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Don't know about the others but I LOVE Paul Wilbur
Really? You never heard of Joel Chernoff? How is that possible for anyone in the Messianic movement?

BTW - Barry Segal was a housemate of mine back in 1976.
 
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Sammy-San

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Hi, I’m a born again Christian, (Baptist) and I only listen to Christian music. So I love worship music. I used to love listening to Hillsong, Jesus Culture and Bethel music. For the past year, I know deep down in my spirit, God doesn’t want me to listen to their music anymore. I came across some of their church practices and they looked totally demonic to me, nothing to do with the Gospel of Jesus Christ. I felt extremely convicted and decided that I will no longer buy their music or listen to their songs. (Just my personal conviction.) I know they have some of the best Christian songs, but I want to honour God and not my flesh. I don’t agree with what goes on in their churches. Many things are not biblical and their pastors don’t speak the truth when they they are in public like pastor Carl Lentz, when asked about gays in the church and if abortion is sinful or not. He never has biblical answers, although the Bible is very clear. He’s scared not to offend men, and would rather offend God. The way I look at it is this, if an amazing band, mocked my own parents, and didn’t honour my parents in any way, would I still buy their music and listen/sing their songs? Or would I be upset and hurt and want nothing to do with them and just pray for them instead? What these churches/elders are doing is mocking Jesus’ name and then selling music and making millions of dollars and claiming to be Christians just because they “sang” about Jesus yet their works show bad fruit that do not honour the Lord in any way. I am upset because I loved their music and also because I see them using the Lord’s name to make profit while not living a godly Christian lifestyle. (Matthew 7:22-23)

Now my question is this, thankfully my church does not sing any of their songs, but this bothers me so much that I always think what if they sing one of their songs this Sunday?! If my church does, should I say something? Just the thought of it really bothers me.

 
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rockytopva

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Make thee two trumpets of silver; of a whole piece shalt thou make them: that thou mayest use them for the calling of the assembly, and for the journeying of the camps. - Numbers 10:2


I believe that these two trumpets represent the two most important part of a Christian service (and I include a video below)...

1. Worship - Time in prayer, praise, and in fellowship.
2. Word - A time in the Word of God

If the worship and the time in the word are good, we can leave feeling refreshed and blessed as Christians.

The problem I have with Hillsong is that while I sometimes have enjoyed their worship... I never did get into the preaching, or the time in the Word. Not to criticize it, but it was not something I enjoyed. I like good worship, but the preaching is something better if done under the correct unction.

 
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WolfGate

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If your comments relate to Hillsong at all, are you saying that dancing around onstage in a cowboy hat, in your underwear, is just another style of worship, no big deal, perfectly okay with the Almighty, a great way to get His message across?

No, that is not appropriate and should not have happened. I am not defending that at all.

My comment was related to the calling out of 3 Pentacostal based church worship ministries and then stating that they didn't believe charismatic churches were real churches. That is dangerous and really not appropriate for someone to do when they do not know the beliefs and ministry of the church. So I posted the statement of belief from one of them (not Hillsong). IMHO, the essentials are all there. Your mileage may vary.
 
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LoricaLady

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Other than Hebrews 13. 17.

But we do have Paul's example of going into synagogues to teach in Acts. He waited until the leaders invited him to speak.
We also have the Messiah's example of saying things the leaders of the Synagogue n way wanted to hear.

We are to treat all people with respect, actually. However, obviously if someone is a congressional leader, but preaches what is contrary to the Gospel, though you can treat that person with respect in a general sense, you do not have to respect what they are teaching.
 
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LoricaLady

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No, that is not appropriate and should not have happened. I am not defending that at all.

My comment was related to the calling out of 3 Pentacostal based church worship ministries and then stating that they didn't believe charismatic churches were real churches. That is dangerous and really not appropriate for someone to do when they do not know the beliefs and ministry of the church. So I posted the statement of belief from one of them (not Hillsong). IMHO, the essentials are all there. Your mileage may vary.
Okay, I hear you. I speak in tongues myself, so some call that charismatic. I just call it Biblical.
 
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LoricaLady

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Really? You never heard of Joel Chernoff? How is that possible for anyone in the Messianic movement?

BTW - Barry Segal was a housemate of mine back in 1976.
Actually I have heard of him,, come to think of it. I went on a search on YT to see who he was and remembered, then, having heard some of his songs. He is good, but I prefer Wilbur by far.
 
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ViaCrucis

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Hi, I’m a born again Christian, (Baptist) and I only listen to Christian music. So I love worship music. I used to love listening to Hillsong, Jesus Culture and Bethel music. For the past year, I know deep down in my spirit, God doesn’t want me to listen to their music anymore. I came across some of their church practices and they looked totally demonic to me, nothing to do with the Gospel of Jesus Christ. I felt extremely convicted and decided that I will no longer buy their music or listen to their songs. (Just my personal conviction.) I know they have some of the best Christian songs, but I want to honour God and not my flesh. I don’t agree with what goes on in their churches. Many things are not biblical and their pastors don’t speak the truth when they they are in public like pastor Carl Lentz, when asked about gays in the church and if abortion is sinful or not. He never has biblical answers, although the Bible is very clear. He’s scared not to offend men, and would rather offend God. The way I look at it is this, if an amazing band, mocked my own parents, and didn’t honour my parents in any way, would I still buy their music and listen/sing their songs? Or would I be upset and hurt and want nothing to do with them and just pray for them instead? What these churches/elders are doing is mocking Jesus’ name and then selling music and making millions of dollars and claiming to be Christians just because they “sang” about Jesus yet their works show bad fruit that do not honour the Lord in any way. I am upset because I loved their music and also because I see them using the Lord’s name to make profit while not living a godly Christian lifestyle. (Matthew 7:22-23)

Now my question is this, thankfully my church does not sing any of their songs, but this bothers me so much that I always think what if they sing one of their songs this Sunday?! If my church does, should I say something? Just the thought of it really bothers me.

I more-or-less stopped listening to Christian pop music many years ago, which I include "praise and worship" to be a genre of. My reasons largely had to do with a growing sense that much of the music being produced in the Christian music industry came up extremely shallow; for a variety of reasons. I'll still listen to some stuff, but it's pretty limited.

It kind of boiled down to that if I want music as entertainment, then I can listen to entertaining music, I don't subscribe to the idea that Christians are obligated to have "Christian" entertainment; as that feeds into a culture of tribalistic thinking. Imagine for a moment refusing to eat pizza unless it was "Christian" pizza. On some level it becomes absurd--music is music, pizza is pizza, etc. So if I want music for the sole purpose of the enjoyment of music then I should find music that I enjoy.

Secondly, if I wanted music that intentionally communicates a Christian point, or is intended as sacred song, then such music needs to have something far more substantive about it than simply calling itself "Christian"; it should actually say something. And if it intended as sacred song then it should be held to a much higher standard, it should be theologically true and be worshipful. I became keenly aware over the years, as I paid attention, that so much of what calls itself "praise and worship" boils down to me singing about my feelings about Jesus, or singing about how Jesus makes me feel. Now declaring the love we have for Christ is certainly not in and of itself wrong, neither is acknowledging the joy we have in Christ wrong--but at what point have we in fact stopped talking about Jesus at all and are simply talking about ourselves? So much of it ultimately degenerates into self-congratulatory worship of self.

Further, spend some time comparing the lyrical composition of such music to the historic songs of the Church, and I don't simply mean "old" 19th and early 20th century hymns, I mean really start looking back to the history of Church music. It's not all great, but it is by and large significantly more substantial in its depth and actually declares and confesses our faith and what we believe. There is an old saying, lex orandi lex credendi, the law of prayer is the law of belief. What and how we pray (or how we worship) shapes how and what we believe. The average church-goer is going to almost certainly get far more theological teaching and information from the music we sing then from the sermon; it is psychologically factual that human beings retain musical information better than the spoken word (this is why it is much easier to remember the words from a song than to remember words from a speech). If we are singing theologically impoverished music then expect the theology of the congregation to suffer for it.

Conversely, we can expect that if a theologically impoverished person is going to write theologically impoverished music. If we aren't worshiping mindfully then we are unintentionally spreading false religion to one another--and there is no worship in that at all.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Gregory Thompson

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Hi, I’m a born again Christian, (Baptist) and I only listen to Christian music. So I love worship music. I used to love listening to Hillsong, Jesus Culture and Bethel music. For the past year, I know deep down in my spirit, God doesn’t want me to listen to their music anymore. I came across some of their church practices and they looked totally demonic to me, nothing to do with the Gospel of Jesus Christ. I felt extremely convicted and decided that I will no longer buy their music or listen to their songs. (Just my personal conviction.) I know they have some of the best Christian songs, but I want to honour God and not my flesh. I don’t agree with what goes on in their churches. Many things are not biblical and their pastors don’t speak the truth when they they are in public like pastor Carl Lentz, when asked about gays in the church and if abortion is sinful or not. He never has biblical answers, although the Bible is very clear. He’s scared not to offend men, and would rather offend God. The way I look at it is this, if an amazing band, mocked my own parents, and didn’t honour my parents in any way, would I still buy their music and listen/sing their songs? Or would I be upset and hurt and want nothing to do with them and just pray for them instead? What these churches/elders are doing is mocking Jesus’ name and then selling music and making millions of dollars and claiming to be Christians just because they “sang” about Jesus yet their works show bad fruit that do not honour the Lord in any way. I am upset because I loved their music and also because I see them using the Lord’s name to make profit while not living a godly Christian lifestyle. (Matthew 7:22-23)

Now my question is this, thankfully my church does not sing any of their songs, but this bothers me so much that I always think what if they sing one of their songs this Sunday?! If my church does, should I say something? Just the thought of it really bothers me.

In general, if the music is good for you in the middle of a spiritual attack, it's good anytime. Ear candy worship relaxes the flesh but doesn't help with spiritual discipline.
 
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LoricaLady

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If anyone is interested, there are some songs that have nothing but Scriptures in their lyrics. They are kind of old fashioned sounding as they were made in the 90s. I personally have found they grew on me, though, and became a real blessing more and more over time. Here is an example of Integrity Music's Scripture Memory Songs.


Maranatha has some strictly Scripture based songs with maybe more up to date music. Esther Mui has tons of scripture-only songs on You Tube. To be honest, and I'm not sure why,but her songs make me cringe and I avoid them. I don't think her voice is that great. But maybe that is just me.
 
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I listen to all kinds of music, but am more picky when it comes to Christian music, but the expectations are different. So far as men go, all will let you down, all have sinned, all still struggle with the temptations of the flesh, and weaknesses that go with it.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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Devin P

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Hi, I’m a born again Christian, (Baptist) and I only listen to Christian music. So I love worship music. I used to love listening to Hillsong, Jesus Culture and Bethel music. For the past year, I know deep down in my spirit, God doesn’t want me to listen to their music anymore. I came across some of their church practices and they looked totally demonic to me, nothing to do with the Gospel of Jesus Christ. I felt extremely convicted and decided that I will no longer buy their music or listen to their songs. (Just my personal conviction.) I know they have some of the best Christian songs, but I want to honour God and not my flesh. I don’t agree with what goes on in their churches. Many things are not biblical and their pastors don’t speak the truth when they they are in public like pastor Carl Lentz, when asked about gays in the church and if abortion is sinful or not. He never has biblical answers, although the Bible is very clear. He’s scared not to offend men, and would rather offend God. The way I look at it is this, if an amazing band, mocked my own parents, and didn’t honour my parents in any way, would I still buy their music and listen/sing their songs? Or would I be upset and hurt and want nothing to do with them and just pray for them instead? What these churches/elders are doing is mocking Jesus’ name and then selling music and making millions of dollars and claiming to be Christians just because they “sang” about Jesus yet their works show bad fruit that do not honour the Lord in any way. I am upset because I loved their music and also because I see them using the Lord’s name to make profit while not living a godly Christian lifestyle. (Matthew 7:22-23)

Now my question is this, thankfully my church does not sing any of their songs, but this bothers me so much that I always think what if they sing one of their songs this Sunday?! If my church does, should I say something? Just the thought of it really bothers me.
You can always listen to hebraic music - that is where our faith comes from anyway - the hebrew language.

 
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Since we're on the subject, and I've listened to tons of CCM, Praise & Worship, and other genres within Christian music, the primary problem I ran into with so much of it (even some beloved hymns), is the central focus of so much of it, so much of it is self-focused, and just borderline near self-worship, if you really pay attention to the words and think on them. Don't get me wrong there is a place for self, but it should not be the central focus, especially in praise & worship.
 
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coffeeandprayer

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I don't know of the other groups, but I do not listen to Hillsong. I have heard scary and concerning things about them, too. I saw one of their albums and it had a cover that looked like it had the "all seeing eye", a pagan symbol, on it, if you looked closely.

Listen to the Holy Spirit. No matter how beautiful Hillsong's songs may be - and indeed they are beautiful - evil can leak out of evil sources, and it happens all the time. The Church, and Christian music, have definitely got some big time wolves in sheep's clothing in them. Christian music is a big money maker, so of course the wolves aren't going to leave it alone.
Thank you for taking the time to comment! I really appreciate it. I too know, that the devil can make something sinful appear beautiful just to draw people into the wrong so called "churches" where sin is accepted and repentance is never required. God has opened my eyes to see this and I am so thankful to God for it because I don't want to support a fake church of God.
 
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