Millennial Considerations

[seventysevens]

What part of 2 Peter 3:8 dont you understand?

One day is a thousand years, ans a thousand years one day?

is it one day or a thousand years?

1 foot is as 12 inches and 12 inches as 1 foot
1 day as 1000 years and 1000 years as 1 day

or is it a representation of no measurement of time and distance ?

 

[DavidPT]

1 foot is as 12 inches and 12 inches as 1 foot
1 day as 1000 years and 1000 years as 1 day

or is it a representation of no measurement of time and distance ?

24 hours is as 1 day. 1 day is as 24 hours. If those statements are literally true, why wouldn't 1 day as 1000 years and 1000 years as 1 day, not be literally true as well?

 

[Truth7t7]

24 hours is as 1 day. 1 day is as 24 hours. If those statements are literally true, why wouldn't 1 day as 1000 years and 1000 years as 1 day, not be literally true as well?

They are literally true, one day is a thousand years is conveying to the human mind there is no literal time in Revelation 20:1-6, that is the Lords spiritual realm.

Angel, heaven, devil, Satan, the souls, the dead, God, Christ, 100% spiritual, no earthly time.

Big smiles to your avoidance of this scriptural truth.

 

[seventysevens]

They are literally true, one day is a thousand years is conveying to the human mind there is no literal time in Revelation 20:1-6, that is the Lords spiritual realm.

Can you give in detail a summarize of what you think it means ?

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

who is being reigned over as we are reigning with Christ ?

 

[LastSeven]

I don't get your reasoning sometimes? There's only one group in view in that sentence, and that group is the rest of the dead.
...
The text is only meaning these, so to say 'only' like I have been saying, this is the correct conclusion to come to.

That would only be the correct conclusion to come to if both resurrections were of the same type.

Resurrection literally means "to rise again". Now as you now, man suffers two deaths. The first is spiritual (fall into sin), the second is natural (fall into the grave). So it is with the resurrections.

As "resurrection" means "to rise again", there are two ways that we rise again. The first resurrection brings us back to God through Jesus. ie. we rise up spiritually from our fall into sin. The second revives our bodies. ie. we physically rise up again after falling into the grave.

As with your example of the two groups of people, the first group rises from sin in the first resurrection, and then also rises physically in the second resurrection. The second group only rises physically. So it would be incorrect to say that "only the second group rises physically".

Simply put, the second resurrection gives us life, but the first resurrection gives us eternal life.

 

[LastSeven]

I know this wasn't directed at me, but this is too simple. The first resurrection is for the righteous only. The second resurrection is for both the righteous and the wicked.

In other words, the righteous get two resurrections. A spiritual, and a physical. Those who take part in the spiritual resurrection (accepting Jesus) don't have to fear the lake of fire.

Please provide scripture to support this Bible interpertation.

For which part of my statement would you like me to post supporting scriptures?

 

[LastSeven]

Do you not see how far you have stretched the meaning , this is not a bodily resurrection- if it is then we are resurrected every day of our lives if we follow

1 Cor 15 (KJV)
31 I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.

Paul is not saying that he dies daily. He's saying that he faces death daily, as in he could die at any time. He's explaining that he has hope in a resurrection because Jesus was resurrected, and if Jesus did not rise then his hope is in vain.

When speaking of Revelation 20 it is speaking of a literal body resurrection that was dead and now risen bodily to reign with Christ for 1000 years

The bodily resurrection happens at the last day, just as Jesus and Paul both said.

it is not correct to say that we have two resurrections as that will confuse people who are not studied on the subject and cause them to think righteous rise from the grave twice

So because it might confuse people we shouldn't believe it? Really?

 

[LastSeven]

Wrong . Where you are creating confusion is calling it a resurrection to compare with scriptural resurrection , that is why the scripture makes it clear to avoid this confusion , we understand the point but you are creating unnecessary confusion by categorizing as a resurrection as a spirit does not die so it cannot be resurrected

Why do you insist that one can only rise physically?

You're right that a spirit does not die, as spirit is life and it comes from God, but wouldn't you agree that without God we have no life because God is our source of life? And wouldn't you agree that falling into sin caused us to be separated from God? Didn't God tell Adam that he would surely die if he falls into sin? Isn't our separation from God analogous to death?

And if we can analogize our separation from God as a "fall", then can we not analogize our reconciliation with God as a "rising"?

 

[Original Happy Camper]

For which part of my statement would you like me to post supporting scriptures?

This one
the righteous get two resurrections. A spiritual, and a physical

 

[LastSeven]

Revelation 20:4-6

There is one future resurrection of all that have ever lived, both righteous wicked John 5:28-29.

This same event is also seen in Daniel 12:1-2, that will take place near the time of great tribulation, when the final judgment takes place, as the book of life is open.

This event of the resurrection takes place on "The Last Day" John 6:40

Two resurrections will take place on the last day, "First" the righteous to eternal life, "Second" the wicked to eternal damnation in the Second Death/Resurrection

"First" Righteous, Eternal Life.

"Second" Wicked, Second Death/Resurrection

The saved believer is blessed to be in the "First" resurrection, on such the Second Death/Resurrection has no power.

I'm not sure why you take what scripture so clearly defines as a single resurrection and divide it into two.

Acts 24:15
and I have the same hope in God as these men themselves have, that there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.

 

[seventysevens]

Paul is not saying that he dies daily. He's saying that he faces death daily, as in he could die at any time. He's explaining that he has hope in a resurrection because Jesus was resurrected, and if Jesus did not rise then his hope is in vain.

Yes Paul IS saying He dies daily - it is referencing the scripture to pick to up your cross daily - which means to crucify your flesh daily - not your skin of your body but biblical flesh the carnal nature of mankind that can lead us into temptations of the flesh - Paul is saying to bury the carnal temptations in order to please God

The bodily resurrection happens at the last day, just as Jesus and Paul both said.

The last day ...depending on how the term is used
Rev20
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

These are people who are martyred during the Great Trib and are resurrected to reign with Christ during the 1000 years that satan is imprisoned

 

[Original Happy Camper]

For which part of my statement would you like me to post supporting scriptures?

Read you explaination above but would like scripture to support it

 

[LastSeven]

Romans 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

Take this passage for instance. His resurrection is clearly meaning Christ's, where I'm certain you wouldn't dispute that. His resurrection then, was it bodily or not?

Of course Christ's resurrection was bodily, just as we will experience a bodily resurrection, but first we must be reconciled to God and that is our first resurrection.

Galatians 2:19
19 “For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me.

Romans 6:4
For we died and were buried with Christ by baptism. And just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glorious power of the Father, now we also may live new lives.

Romans 6:6
For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body ruled by sin might be done away with,[a] that we should no longer be slaves to sin— 7 because anyone who has died has been set free from sin.

Romans 6:13
Do not offer any part of yourself to sin as an instrument of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life

John 5:24-25
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

Ephesians 2:4-6
But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus

Matthew 10:39
whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

 

[Truth7t7]

That would only be the correct conclusion to come to if both resurrections were of the same type.

Resurrection literally means "to rise again". Now as you now, man suffers two deaths. The first is spiritual (fall into sin), the second is natural (fall into the grave). So it is with the resurrections.

As "resurrection" means "to rise again", there are two ways that we rise again. The first resurrection brings us back to God through Jesus. ie. we rise up spiritually from our fall into sin. The second revives our bodies. ie. we physically rise up again after falling into the grave.

As with your example of the two groups of people, the first group rises from sin in the first resurrection, and then also rises physically in the second resurrection. The second group only rises physically. So it would be incorrect to say that "only the second group rises physically".

Simply put, the second resurrection gives us life, but the first resurrection gives us eternal life.

The word "resurrection" in the new testament always refers to the"Bodily" never the spiritual.

 

[seventysevens]

Of course Christ's resurrection was bodily, just as we will experience a bodily resurrection, but first we must be reconciled to God and that is our first resurrection.

.

I see the point you are making but it is in conflict with Rev 20 as it speaks of bodily resurrection and even Jesus did not use the term resurrection in that regard , Jesus uses the term born -again in spirit - not resurrection in spirit just as Jesus does not use the term born again in reference to a bodily resurrection

 

[Truth7t7]

I'm not sure why you take what scripture so clearly defines as a single resurrection and divide it into two.

Acts 24:15
and I have the same hope in God as these men themselves have, that there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.

You post the scripture that stated "Both" that means "Two" different resurrections at the same time.

"First" the righteous, to eternal life

"Second" the wicked to eternal damnation.

Two completely different resurrections on the "Last Day" John 6:40, John 5:28-29

 

[LastSeven]

This one
the righteous get two resurrections. A spiritual, and a physical

Spiritual Resurrection

Galatians 2:19
19 “For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me.

Romans 6:4
For we died and were buried with Christ by baptism. And just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glorious power of the Father, now we also may live new lives.

Romans 6:6
For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body ruled by sin might be done away with,[a] that we should no longer be slaves to sin— 7 because anyone who has died has been set free from sin.

Romans 6:13
Do not offer any part of yourself to sin as an instrument of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life

John 5:24-25
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

Ephesians 2:4-6
But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus

Matthew 10:39
whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

Physical Resurrection

John 6:39
And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all that he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.

John 6:40
For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.’

John 6:44
No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.

John 6:54
Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

John 11:24
Martha answered, 'I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.'

Acts 24:15
and I have the same hope in God as these men themselves have, that there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.

1 Corinthians 15:42-44
42 So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable; 43 it is sown in dishonour, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; 44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.

1 Corinthians 15:52
For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised

1 Corinthians 15:54
When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: ‘Death has been swallowed up in victory.’

 

[LastSeven]

The last day ...depending on how the term is used

It can only mean one thing. There are no more days after that day. The sun will no longer rise and set. There will be no night.

 

[seventysevens]

You post the scripture that stated "Both" that means "Two" different resurrections at the same time.

"First" the righteous, then "Second" the wicked.

No it does mean at the same time , just as when a parent has two children in High school and one is a senior and the other is a sophomore and they are both going to graduate , it does not mean at the same time - just that it will happen to both

 

[LastSeven]

I see the point you are making but it is in conflict with Rev 20 as it speaks of bodily resurrection

Really?

They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection.

I don't see the word "body" in there anywhere.

... and even Jesus did not use the term resurrection in that regard , Jesus uses the term born -again in spirit - not resurrection in spirit just as Jesus does not use the term born again in reference to a bodily resurrection

So because Jesus didn't use this particular word, John can't possibly have used it in Revelation?