he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Is that supposed to be some sort of link?
do I need to put the www? it is a website for people who understand Greek.
A.B. Bruce says regarding Luke 8:35: "Insanity is much nearer the Kingdom of God than world-mindedness. Men with shattered reason felt the spell, while the wise and strong-minded too often used their intellect, under the bias of passion or prejudice, to resist the force of truth."
In the first place, you observe, that in this case a malignant disorder had been endured.
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
He's citing one of his University of Chicago sources because they espouse the same faithless theology he does. He-man, if you could, present the case in full for a translation of "fatalities" for the Greek τὰ δαιμόνια. Also, the word is used in Matthew 9:33-34 of the Pharisees accusing Jesus of "casting out demons through the prince of demons." If proper translation is "He casts out fatalities through the prince of fatalities," who would this prince be? He is Beelzebub in Matthew 12:24. Is he a human prince or a spiritual one? In Luke 4:33-35, the demons spoke to Jesus, and He ordered them to be quiet and come out of the demon-possessed man. How would "fatalities" speak, and how could Jesus command them to be quiet?
It is clear that you do not know Greek. Luke 8:35 δαιμονια and is a Noun, NOMINATIVE, PLURAL, NEWTER AND MATTHEW 9:33-34 IS NOT THE SAME WORD OR TENSE. It is δαιμονιου a Noun, Genitive, Singular, Newter and that word is only used in Matthew 9:33-34 Luke 4:33 he had a fatality like a tied tongue or some malady; Luke 8:29; Luke 11:14 fatalities like he was dumb. I don't have time to teach you Greek, so go and get a book or University.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

InterestedApologist

Active Member
Aug 17, 2017
123
63
49
Earth
✟29,376.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
There are some things most sane people will consider evil.

However you can be assured that lots of things your cultural upbringing makes you perceive as evil is not shared by people of different age, culture, habits and upbringing.

Just few things here ; abortion, mercy killing, cannibalism, subjugating women, beating kids , raising children as religious fundamentalist, beating dogs with sticks to get their adrenaline high so they taste better.

I agree. This is exactly why humanity needs a source external to itself for defining morality, and one of the many reasons why the Bible is so critically important. Left to ourselves, mankind will justify any behavior, but GOD provides a true standard that surpasses modern day subjectivity. Morality is not subjective and evil is not a matter of personal interpretation, but rather is defined by our Creator.
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
[QUOTE
IMG_20170927_135945.jpg
IMG_20170927_135945.jpg
IMG_20170927_135945.jpg
IMG_20170927_135945.jpg
="he-man, post: 71809064, member: 271484"][/QUOTE]
ok here is the part you left out:
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
I agree. This is exactly why humanity needs a source external to itself for defining morality, and one of the many reasons why the Bible is so critically important. Left to ourselves, mankind will justify any behavior, but GOD provides a true standard that surpasses modern day subjectivity. Morality is not subjective and evil is not a matter of personal interpretation, but rather is defined by our Creator.
Amen
 
Upvote 0

InterestedApologist

Active Member
Aug 17, 2017
123
63
49
Earth
✟29,376.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private

How do you reconcile a disbelief in demons when confronted with the story of Mark 5, 1-20? I know you have touched on this a bit, but clearly there is a man who exhibits self harm, multiple personalities, rage and superhuman strength. While initial assumptions may lead one to attribute this behavior to disassociative/schizophrenic/multiple personality disorders, but the Bible removes this as a possibility by following up Jesus’ command that the demons leave the man with the Jesus allowing the request to enter the herd of swine. Once Jesus casts the demons out of the man, the herd of swine behaves violently and throws themselves off a cliff only to drown in the sea.

In summary, the story indicates that the man had many demons, Jesus casts them out and there were enough demons to enter 2000 pigs who then behaved just like the man was behaving prior to Jesus’ exorcism of him. I don’t see any other way to interpret this as anything less than demonic possession as the text clearly states, and certainly, no naturalistic explanation exists for the sudden transfer of psychosomatic illness from a human into a herd of animals...
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Hidden In Him

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 7, 2017
3,426
2,845
59
Lafayette, LA
✟544,986.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It is clear that you do not know Greek. Luke 8:35 δαιμονια and is a Noun, NOMINATIVE, PLURAL, NEWTER AND MATTHEW 9:33-34 IS NOT THE SAME WORD OR TENSE. It is δαιμονιου a Noun, Genitive, Singular, Newter and that word is only used in Matthew 9:33-34 Luke 4:33 he had a fatality like a tied tongue or some malady; Luke 8:29; Luke 11:14 fatalities like he was dumb. I don't have time to teach you Greek, so go and get a book or University.

What in the world are you doing now? For starters, the word is spelled neuter. A newt is a small lizard.

The fact that the word is used as a nominative in some places and a noun in others doesn't change the essence of the word. So how about if you just tell me how you interpret Matthew 9:33-34 and Luke 4:33?
 
Upvote 0

1213

Disciple of Jesus
Jul 14, 2011
3,661
1,117
Visit site
✟146,199.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Isn't it strange that no devils or demons have appeared for 2000 years? Have you seen any? If so, prove it; photos, documentation, etc.

What is demon or devil? How could you know have you ever seen them?

I think they are evil spirits. And evil spirits are the spirits that makes person lie and do all other evil things (hate, envy, fear…). And God is the good spirit that is love, which makes person love others and remain in truth.

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.
John 4:24


He who doesn't love doesn't know God, for God is love.

1 John 4:8
 
Upvote 0

Dawnhammer

Well-Known Member
Mar 5, 2017
545
436
48
Denmark
✟23,474.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Morality is not subjective and evil is not a matter of personal interpretation, but rather is defined by our Creator.

Ah yes, our creator. Over 4000 religions have slight disagreements about the nature of Creator and whatever definitions he would prefer so morality is very much subjective and evil is a matter of personal interpretation.

If you say God has absolute morality someone is still going to interpret it in any which way.
 
Upvote 0

Ron Gurley

What U See is What U Get!
Supporter
Sep 22, 2015
4,000
1,029
Baton Rouge, LA
Visit site
✟87,595.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
OP: Q: "Why no devil or demons for 2000 yrs?"
A: FALSE DOCTRINE...there were and are!

Q2: Have you "seen" any?
A2: Yes. I have spiritually discerned their spiritual presence... as have MANY others from the early "CHURCH" fathers until today. They will not be "bound" until after Jesus' "Second Coming" and during His Millenial Reign in Jerusalem.

Revelation 20:2
And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him (and his followers) for a thousand years;

Q3: If so, prove it; photos, documentation, etc.
A3: Shirley you jest. It is impossible to scientifically and with true empirical certainty to PROVE conclusively the existence or NON-existence of spirit and soul. These dudes are SPIRIT beings...Man!

But good news!: they are like snakes with their heads cut off. Jesus dealt them a death blow!

1 John 3:8... The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
OP: Q: "Why no devil or demons for 2000 yrs?" A: FALSE DOCTRINE...there were and are! Q2: Have you "seen" any? A2: Yes. I have spiritually discerned their spiritual presence... as have MANY others from the early "CHURCH" fathers until today. They will not be "bound" until after Jesus' "Second Coming" and during His Millenial Reign in Jerusalem.
Revelation 20:2 And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him (and his followers) for a thousand years; Q3: If so, prove it; photos, documentation, etc. A3: Shirley you jest. It is impossible to scientifically and with true empirical certainty to PROVE conclusively the existence or NON-existence of spirit and soul. These dudes are SPIRIT beings...Man!
But good news!: they are like snakes with their heads cut off. Jesus dealt them a death blow! 1 John 3:8... The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.
Luke 8:35 commentary: We shall direct our attention to certain views suggested by his insane condition, as characteristic of men who have not been reduced to a state of spiritual soundness by the healing power of Christ. (Free from Mental Disorder.) LSJ "φοβεισθαι μη το δαιμονια πραγματ ελαθωη" Noun, Nominative, Plural, Neuter ld. 9.54. [logeion.uchicago.edu] Translation: do not be afraid of fatality, driven by some influential agency.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

parousia70

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow
Supporter
Feb 24, 2002
15,533
4,826
57
Oregon
✟793,718.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
. They will not be "bound" until after Jesus' "Second Coming" and during His Millenial Reign in Jerusalem.

I guess Jesus was mistaken when He claimed to have bound him in the 1st century?:

22 And the scribes who came down from Jerusalem said, “He has Beelzebub,” and, “By the ruler of the demons He casts out demons.”

23 So He called them to Himself and said to them in parables: “How can Satan cast out Satan? 24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. 25 And if a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. 26 And if Satan has risen up against himself, and is divided, he cannot stand, but has an end. 27 No one can enter a strong man’s house and plunder his goods, unless he first binds the strong man. And then he will plunder his house. (Mark 3:22-27)

And he was also mistaken when he told the apostles that they too had the power to BIND Satan:

And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”(Matthew 16:19)

“Assuredly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven. (Matthew 18:18)

Revelation 20:2
And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him (and his followers) for a thousand years;

Uh oh.....Careful there!

Revelation 20:2 - the ACTUAL TEXT:
He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years;

Revelation 22:18 - The admonition AGAINST ADDING ANYTHING TO THE BOOK AS YOU DID:

[ A Warning ] For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;

Jesus dealt them a death blow!

1 John 3:8... The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.

And He did!
... too bad we Christians hardly act like it.
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
I guess Jesus was mistaken when He claimed to have bound him in the 1st century?:

22 And the scribes who came down from Jerusalem said, “He has Beelzebub,” and, “By the ruler of the demons He casts out demons.”

23 So He called them to Himself and said to them in parables: “How can Satan cast out Satan? 24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. 25 And if a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. 26 And if Satan has risen up against himself, and is divided, he cannot stand, but has an end. 27 No one can enter a strong man’s house and plunder his goods, unless he first binds the strong man. And then he will plunder his house. (Mark 3:22-27)

And he was also mistaken when he told the apostles that they too had the power to BIND Satan:

And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”(Matthew 16:19)

“Assuredly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven. (Matthew 18:18)



Uh oh.....Careful there!

Revelation 20:2 - the ACTUAL TEXT:
He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years;

Revelation 22:18 - The admonition AGAINST ADDING ANYTHING TO THE BOOK AS YOU DID:

[ A Warning ] For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; And He did! ... too bad we Christians hardly act like it.
Revelation 19:19-21 TELLS YOU EXACTLY WHO ARE THE DEVILS
 
Last edited:
  • Optimistic
Reactions: parousia70
Upvote 0

InterestedApologist

Active Member
Aug 17, 2017
123
63
49
Earth
✟29,376.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Ah yes, our creator. Over 4000 religions have slight disagreements about the nature of Creator and whatever definitions he would prefer so morality is very much subjective and evil is a matter of personal interpretation.

If you say God has absolute morality someone is still going to interpret it in any which way.

I understand what you are saying, but what is your ultimate point? Acknowledging that there are other religions that see God and evil differently than the Christian is obvious, but that does not negate my point that true morality stems from the creator.

Are you suggesting that all religions are equally valid and as such, their morality is also equally valid? Are you suggesting that evil is only a man made construct attributed to gods devised by men? Where are you trying to take this?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Segaz
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
I understand what you are saying, but what is your ultimate point? Acknowledging that there are other religions that see God and evil differently than the Christian is obvious, but that does not negate my point that true morality stems from the creator. Are you suggesting that all religions are equally valid and as such, their morality is also equally valid? Are you suggesting that evil is only a man made construct attributed to gods devised by men? Where are you trying to take this?
Yes, evil is only a man made construction attributed to gods, and devised by evil men who are themselves, deceived by their own evil thoughts and actions. James 1:13-16
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums