On Free Will

[Hammster]

God did. and I will happily send lots of them.
PS JESUS did say HOW often would I have gathered you only YOU WOULD NOT
Jesus also is word of GOD and GOD is his word.
however let me go show you the scrips.

I have a dollar that says he never said that.

 

[frienden thalord]

Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die , saith the LORD
and not that he should return from his wicked ways and LIVE. ezzikial
Might want to read all of ezz chapter eighteen
but it ends on this too...
For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dies
saith the Lord , wherefore TURN YE from you inquities and LIVE.

 

[frienden thalord]

Oh jerusalme , Jerusalem
thou which kills the prophets and stones them that come unto thee
How OFTEN would I have gathered thee as a mother hen does her chicks
under her wings...........only YE WOULD NOT.
Yeah JESUS DID SAY THAT......
its in I think at least two of the gosples.

 

[frienden thalord]

My work here is done . Off to go encourage elsewhere. praise the LORD PEOPLES .

 

[Hammster]

Oh jerusalme , Jerusalem
thou which kills the prophets and stones them that come unto thee
How OFTEN would I have gathered thee as a mother hen does her chicks
under her wings...........only YE WOULD NOT.
Yeah JESUS DID SAY THAT......
its in I think at least two of the gosples.

I know you keep saying it. But He never did.

 

[Hammster]

Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die , saith the LORD
and not that he should return from his wicked ways and LIVE. ezzikial
Might want to read all of ezz chapter eighteen
but it ends on this too...
For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dies
saith the Lord , wherefore TURN YE from you inquities and LIVE.

I never said He had pleasure. That's not what you asked.

 

[frienden thalord]

I know you keep saying it. But He never did.

Go read luke chapter thirteen verse 34
my job here is done.

 

[Hammster]

Here's what He actually said.

“"Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭23:37‬ ‭NASB‬‬

 

[Hammster]

Go read luke chapter thirteen verse 34
my job here is done.

Yep, doesn't say what you say it says.

 

[frienden thalord]

How have you arrived at that conclusion?



Is that how God does it, He leaves people's eternal destinies up to chance?



Every read the parable of the Sower? There is good soil and bad soil.



That is true.



"And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil."

This is a statement regarding all of mankind, or, are you prepared to tell me that when you were not yet a Christian, you loved the light because you deeds were not evil, but good?

Your right you did not , JIMMY JIMMY asked it.
its harder to keep up with whomever when both ask questions.
anyway I am off, I will keep praying for you all. But its time to go exhort and encourage
elsewhere.

 

[frienden thalord]

Here's what He actually said.

“"Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭23:37‬ ‭NASB‬‬

I knew it was in more than one place. Thanks for this one too.

 

[Hammster]

I knew it was in more than one place. Thanks for this one too.

But it doesn't say what you said.

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

Here's what He actually said.

“"Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭23:37‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Luke 13:34 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!

 

[Hammster]

Luke 13:34 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!

Right. Doesn't say what he said it says.

 

[fat wee robin]

Saying that God has a divine plan completely negates any concept of free will we might have.

There is something that many in the Catholic Church belief in ,very common in Ireland and France ,and that is that we have been born before ,as I know to be true. God has set up a programme that we work through in a period or cycle of time . At the end of the long period ,this end comes , after Jesus has given us the age of Pisces,(after His death and resurrection ) to approach Him to be saved as we cannot enter into permanent eternal life without believing in Him .
During the long cycle we are free too choose ,but the wrong choice once we have been 'saved', will bring death spiritually , whereas before
it was only bodily .
There is no question that we live in a programme
in which God 'evolves us ' .The RCC has this knowledge but only for the .......

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

Right. Doesn't say what he said it says.

You strain at gnats and you'll swallow a camel...

2 Peter 3:8 ...not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

EDIT: And Ezekiel 18:32

 

[Hammster]

You strain at gnats and you'll swallow a camel...

2 Peter 3:8 ...not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Who? Where in that passage does it say every person? (Context matters)

 

[fat wee robin]

There are people who are gay, and born of god according to this verse.
1 John chapter 4 verse 7
Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God.
You awful picky about what you accept.

We would have to define what love is here ,or is it something that looks like love ,but is not like self love ,narcissism ,carnal desire ,rebellion ?
After all there are those who love evil ,lwho love Satan.
One would have to define ,to ask John exactly what he meant ,as loving God, means loving as God does in a pure way , not by our human senses , perverted par le Diable .

 

[GingerBeer]

Motives are extremely relevant. Otherwise "good" people can get to heaven by their "good" works.

That is not true.

 

[HeLeadethMe]

Ponder this , anything that goes against the nature of GOD. HE cannot do.
HE desires none to perish. So everyone gets a chance. Most just reject.
God does harden a heart, but only after that heart has rejected Him.
We were all once what.............now ponder these next words well
We were all once vessels of wrath, children of wrath as paul says in galations or ephesians.
YET LOOK how long suffereing God was towards us children of wrath.
He gave grace. And we became good vessels no longer under wrath.
All vessels good or bad were created the same. , we were all once appointed unto wrath.
EVERYONE WAS. EVERYONE
But as paul says God shows his longsuffering towards us, And grace entered our heart.
I know so many mess up what pual is saying in romans. The key is
if our understanding contradicts JESUS or HIS sayings, we simply have misunderstood.
We who have come by faith , by grace , were first created as vessels of destruction
and appointed unto wrath. As all are. JESUS said he wont return till all nations
have heard the gospel. UNDERSTAND this means EVERYONE did have the chance
to be saved. EVERYONE , every single man or woman .
But when grace is rejected , that is on the one who rejected it.
EVERYONE had a chance. ALL were once vessels of wrath , ALL.
And no, the pot cannot say , why did you make us as this..........instead
be greatful you were called out of darkness. We were all made with free will.
we were all made in carnal flesh. We were all once vessels , children of wrath.
IS this sinking in yet. God desires the GLORY
and our repentance gives him the glory. All is by grace
faith in Christ . But if one rejects or continues not in the goodness of GOD, CHRIST
their remains no more sacrifice for sins.
Everyone go look in the mirror and say , THE ONLY GOODNESS I have is from GOD
I was once the same vessel of wrath as our these who do not know HIM
BUt he was long suffering , not willing for me to perish
just as he is long suffering , not willing for any to.
However many will.......and check this out...by their OWN FREE WILL CHOICE.
FOr all who hate ME loves death .
And the only condemnation a man has , is that he wont come out of darkness
even when he was unctioned too, or if he comes , he wont continue
because some lust or threat will have him flee away.
ALL have a body that is contrary to the SPIRIT
and all have the chance to come unto HIM by his own grace.
MOST REJECT for they love darkness rather than light .

I agree frienden thalord..........looking at these scriptures afresh, I am seeing afresh here that the Lord rules and "elects" by His foreknowledge.......we have to look at it in light of His foreknowledge and not one word of His contradicts the other, and nor can He act unfairly or unrighteously, as you said He cannot deny His own nature:

2 Timothy 2:20-21

But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.

If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.



Romans 9:11-23

(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth

It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?

What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,