Can you be good without God?

[MennoSota]

Not while I am alive.

Why then? Do the wolves and gorillas have a heaven to look forward to?

I did not say that morality=good, I said, that is what morality is, by definition. Morality is simply a system of values and principles of conduct held by a society or population.

You obviously do not know my worldview.

Another Unsuccessful Test

• Davian
• Feb 27, 2016

As in Christian societies. And what about foreskins? Now there is sacrifice that makes one cringe, knowing the level of surgical skill and antiseptics of the time.

Only your misrepresentation of it.

Point to it where? Are you just holding your arm out and pointing, while sitting in your chair there? You have yet to present anything in this forum.

To be clear, you cannot show this belief you have in this alleged "creator" of yours to be anything by illusory? Correct?

LOL, you desperately wiggle to get out of the net you've made for yourself.

Even now, your molecules couldn't care less about what you say or do.

The values and principles of the Third Reich were to exterminate Jews for the greater good. Does that make their actions morally good for their society?

Circumcision is a law of the Mosaic Covenant. Not applicable today. It also took place eight days after birth. A good time for such a procedure.

I can't help you with your blindness to the data regarding Yeshua, Jesus. Even atheist scholars acknowledge his existence. No illusions.

Now, stop wiggling and present how your molecules find meaning in their bonding.

 

[Davian]

Messianic or Orthodox?

In any case, feelings are secondary and not to be trusted.

But they consider your ranting in this forum to be lies, correct?

If they find you so unconvincing (and they already believe in a god), why are you wasting your time here? Go convince them, and then get back to me.

 

[Tinker Grey]

I'm reminded of this xkcd comic:

Hover text: Why can't you have normal existential angst like all the other boys?

 

[brinny]

If you knew that I had seen a child being raped, and had the ability to interfere, yet I simply stood by, allowed it to happen, and said nothing to anyone about it, would you categorize this as "good" or "evil"?

Evil.

(By the way, does the child have a specific age? Are you also including other kinds of violence/violations against a child?)

 

[MennoSota]

But they consider your ranting in this forum to be lies, correct?

If they find you so unconvincing (and they already believe in a god), why are you wasting your time here? Go convince them, and then get back to me.

Who cares whether someone feels my comments are lies? Feelings are fickle and irrelevant. God's word is truth. What does God's word say?

I don't care whether I convince anyone. I only care that truth is told.

There is no one, but Yeshua, Jesus, who is good.

 

[FireDragon76]

If you knew that I had seen a child being raped, and had the ability to interfere, yet I simply stood by, allowed it to happen, and said nothing to anyone about it, would you categorize this as "good" or "evil"?

That would be evil... but I have come to realize that's not a fair comparison to what God is like. God isn't indifferent in the face of evil, nor is he silent. But, you have to be willing to shift your perspective to see that.

 

[ToddNotTodd]

I don't care whether I convince anyone.

Ok, just as long as you realize that you're accomplishing the same thing as digging a hole and filling it back in over and over...

But definitely keep posting. I need the material.

 

[Davian]

LOL, you desperately wiggle to get out of the net you've made for yourself.

Even now, your molecules couldn't care less about what you say or do.

I never said they did.

The values and principles of the Third Reich were to exterminate Jews for the greater good. Does that make their actions morally good for their society?

Not that I am aware of. I note that you have moved the goalposts from "morally" to "morally good".

Circumcision is a law of the Mosaic Covenant. Not applicable today. It also took place eight days after birth. A good time for such a procedure.

A good time for genital mutilation. But they did it for adults as well, did they not? Why does your god have such a fascination with foreskins?

I can't help you with your blindness to the data regarding Yeshua, Jesus. Even atheist scholars acknowledge his existence.

The historical Jesus, perhaps, but they would also acknowledge that he has been dead for 2000 years.

No illusions.

To be clear, you cannot show this belief you have in this alleged "creator" of yours to be anything by illusory? Correct?

Does this question make you uncomfortable? Is that why you are so evasive?

Now, stop wiggling and present how your molecules find meaning in their bonding.

Where did I make that claim? Do you have me confused with someone else?

 

[Davian]

I'm reminded of this xkcd comic:

Hover text: Why can't you have normal existential angst like all the other boys?

Thank you. I'd forgotten about this one.

 

[MennoSota]

Ok, just as long as you realize that you're accomplishing the same thing as digging a hole and filling it back in over and over...

But definitely keep posting. I need the material.

Glad to be of service.

"All day long I have stretched out my hand to a disobedient and obstinate people."

 

[Davian]

Evil.

(By the way, does the child have a specific age? Are you also including other kinds of violence/violations against a child?)

No, act in question for that scenario is the intervention (or lack thereof) of the observer.

If the act is evil when I am the observer, is it evil when God conducts himself in the same manner?

 

[brinny]

No, act in question for that scenario is the intervention (or lack thereof) of the observer.

If the act is evil when I am the observer, is it evil when God conducts himself in the same manner?

Please elaborate.

i will then follow with another question.

Thank you kindly.

 

[FireDragon76]

How so?

God is very much involved in the most intimate way. While he permits horrible things to happen, and sustains the life of the wicked, he doesn't sit there idly without casting judgement on them. He gives common grace to everyone, and to some, the sense to try to set things right, to seek justice and to do good.

 

[Davian]

Please elaborate.

i will then follow with another question.

Thank you kindly.

I did so in this thread.

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/euthyphros-dilemma.7949483/

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Can you be good without God?

There is no life outside of God, so there are no people "without God". He has created, and He sustains all life. The tongues that curse God were made by Him and are living because if Him.

You can do nothing without God, and the genesis of all sin is the desire to make that statement untrue.

 

[Davian]

Who cares whether someone feels my comments are lies? Feelings are fickle and irrelevant. God's word is truth. What does God's word say?

I don't care whether I convince anyone. I only care that truth is told.

There is no one, but Yeshua, Jesus, who is good.

All I have is your opinion vs theirs. Why should I believe you?

Particularly when neither of you can present evidence for your beliefs being anything but illusory.

 

[ToddNotTodd]

Can you be good without God?

There is no life outside of God, so there are no people "without God". He has created, and He sustains all life. The tongues that curse God were made by Him and are living because if Him.

You can do nothing without God, and the genesis of all sin is the desire to make that statement untrue.

Or not...

 

[Davian]

God is very much involved in the most intimate way. While he permits horrible things to happen, and sustains the life of the wicked, he doesn't sit there idly without casting judgement on them. He gives common grace to everyone, and to some, the sense to try to set things right, to seek justice and to do good.

From the observer's perspective, can this be differentiated from self-deception, confirmation bias, and wishful thinking? As in, no actual gods required?

 

[brinny]

I did so in this thread.

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/euthyphros-dilemma.7949483/

Hmmmmm....where exactly did you respond to my query, on that thread?

Thanks.

 

[bhsmte]

Can you be good without God?

There is no life outside of God, so there are no people "without God". He has created, and He sustains all life. The tongues that curse God were made by Him and are living because if Him.

You can do nothing without God, and the genesis of all sin is the desire to make that statement untrue.

Opinion.