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Evidence from Sola Scriptura - right from the Bible itself

Erose

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What faith tradition? Is the letter to the Ephesians my church tradition? Is it not God's word?
Your Calvinist faith tradition. Why are so many Protestants blind of the fact that they adhere to their own faith traditions.

Ps no where in Scripture does it teach Sola Scriptura, no where. That is a man made doctrine and tradition,
 
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MennoSota

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Your Calvinist faith tradition. Why are so many Protestants blind of the fact that they adhere to their own faith traditions.

Ps no where in Scripture does it teach Sola Scriptura, no where. That is a man made doctrine and tradition,

My faith came from reading the Scriptures. Later on I read some stuff about Calvin and recognized he had read God's word as well. Funny how the Bible does that.
Erose, you need the "faith tradition" narrative in order to cling to church heresy. Stop it. Read God's word. Let it speak. Let God's word measure the truth of your traditions. Toss out those that are biblically unsupported (infant baptism saves) and continue those that have biblical support (elders and deacons).

Revelation warns us not to add or subtract from the letter. It is good to apply that to the Scriptures. When men and women of other era's start adding and subtracting, it leads to heresy (infant baptism saves). God spoke. It is sufficient for us. Let the Sovereign King speak and rule. Let all others follow.
 
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Erose

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Revelation warns us not to add or subtract from the letter. It is good to apply that to the Scriptures.
THE Book of Revelation says that not to add or subtract to/from it. A perfect example of poor interpretation.

When men and women of other era's start adding and subtracting, it leads to heresy.
Yes it does. Anything novel in theology isn't a good thing. Sola Fide and Sola Scriptura are two perfect examples.

God spoke. It is sufficient for us. Let the Sovereign King speak and rule. Let all others follow.
Amen. Wished Calvin would have believed that.
 
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MennoSota

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THE Book of Revelation says that not to add or subtract to/from it. A perfect example of poor interpretation.

Yes it does. Anything novel in theology isn't a good thing. Sola Fide and Sola Scriptura are two perfect examples.

Amen. Wished Calvin would have believed that.

You and I agree on the book of Revelation, but the application can/should be made to all the books in God's word. We don't add or subtract. Infant baptism for salvation is clearly adding to the Scripture something that is not there.

Again, we agree. Novel ideas from any Era that are not biblical must be tossed out. (infant baptism for salvation is a perfect example.)

Sola Scriptura is an example by which novel heresy is disallowed.
You should fully support God's word as the sole measurement against the heresies of men.
 
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Root of Jesse

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Sola Scriptura
Anything that contradicts God's word is anathema. Infant baptism is unsupported in God's word. You are desperately pulling figment out of your imagination and calling them truth.
But you cannot provide any Catholic doctrine that contradicts God's Word. Show me somewhere where it says that children are not to be baptized.
God teaches us how we are saved...in the Scriptures. He tells us in Ephesians 1 and 2. Yet, you boldly ignore God's word in order to cling to a figment of some church leaders imagination as being more authoritative than God's teaching. Stop it.
I will bet you hundreds of dollars that I read and hear more Scripture on any given day of the week than you do. Meaning I don't, and my Church doesn't, ignore Scripture at all. By the way, we don't have any leaders who think they're more authoritative than God's teaching.
Keep it up, Donald Jr.
 
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Root of Jesse

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I was being somewhat sarcastic. The Orthodox Church is probably the least ecumenical of any Christian group. When the Ecumenical Patriarch met with the Pope, he drew great criticism from certain monastics on Mt. Athos.

Given what I have read of the thread, I suspect you also harbor some animosity against the Orthodox Church, but I think it is worth commenting that we find an instance of infant baptism in the Acts of the Apostles. Perhaps this was already brought up and rebutted. I did not read that deeply in the thread.
It was.
 
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Root of Jesse

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It's not animosity. It's an expectation of excellence to God's word. All humans are by nature flawed, which is why all traditions must be measured by God's word.
What the problem is...is that you have a different understanding of what constitutes "God's Word". We believe that God gifted men with the Holy Spirit to guide them into all truth.
When a tradition is in contradiction of God's word, it must be abandoned...regardless of which church denomination is promoting it. My frustration comes when humans place their faith in church traditions above God's word. This should never be.
You haven't shown any tradition which is in contradiction of God's Word.
 
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MennoSota

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But you cannot provide any Catholic doctrine that contradicts God's Word. Show me somewhere where it says that children are not to be baptized.
I will bet you hundreds of dollars that I read and hear more Scripture on any given day of the week than you do. Meaning I don't, and my Church doesn't, ignore Scripture at all. By the way, we don't have any leaders who think they're more authoritative than God's teaching.
Keep it up, Donald Jr.
LOL

Infant baptism for salvation - You can't find anything on the subject. That's the point.

Purgatory - nowhere in the Bible.

Indulgences - people buying other folks salvation.

Merits of the Saints - Grace points from the good works clan.

The Roman church is chalk full of non-biblical teachings that must be tossed out as heresy.

Quit clinging to such non-biblical heresies.
 
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MennoSota

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What the problem is...is that you have a different understanding of what constitutes "God's Word". We believe that God gifted men with the Holy Spirit to guide them into all truth. You haven't shown any tradition which is in contradiction of God's Word.
You add extra teachings to the Bible. You give undo credence to false teachers because you refuse to have the Bible be the standard of measurement against the heresies in your church.

You have zero ability to discern truth when you add teachings from fallible sources and call them inspired by God. You set yourself up to follow a cult of personality.
 
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Root of Jesse

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You and I agree on the book of Revelation, but the application can/should be made to all the books in God's word. We don't add or subtract.
But applying your understanding of Revelation is adding to God's word, no?
Infant baptism for salvation is clearly adding to the Scripture something that is not there.
No, it's interpreting God's Word correctly. Families include children. Households include children. It is true that not all families or households have children, but to say that none of them did is error.
Again, we agree. Novel ideas from any Era that are not biblical must be tossed out. (infant baptism for salvation is a perfect example.)

Sola Scriptura is an example by which novel heresy is disallowed.
You should fully support God's word as the sole measurement against the heresies of men.
LOL

Infant baptism for salvation - You can't find anything on the subject. That's the point.
We find baptism for salvation, and whole households being baptized. Households include children, more often than not. Case closed.
Purgatory - nowhere in the Bible.
Paul speaks of it in 1 Corinthians, and Maccabees as well.
Indulgences - people buying other folks salvation.
Never a teaching of the Church, though it was used that way by some individual Catholics. I think it's poignant to note that most people who criticize the Catholic Church criticize them for not adhering to the Catholic faith.
Merits of the Saints - Grace points from the good works clan.
We don't believe that good works save you.
The Roman church is chalk full of non-biblical teachings that must be tossed out as heresy.
To prove this you will need to go to the Catechism and pull quotes directly from that. I don't care how some priests or faithful carry out their faith.
Quit clinging to such non-biblical heresies.
I don't cling to any anti-biblical practices. Non-Biblical are not prohibited. Just because something is non-Biblical doesn't make it a heresy, FYI.
 
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Root of Jesse

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You add extra teachings to the Bible.
So what? We burn candles. Shrug.
You give undo credence to false teachers because you refuse to have the Bible be the standard of measurement against the heresies in your church.
A completely incorrect statement. I think you know better, which would make it a lie.
You have zero ability to discern truth when you add teachings from fallible sources and call them inspired by God. You set yourself up to follow a cult of personality.
We don't "add teachings from fallible sources and call them inspired by God." We allow the Holy Spirit to teach us, even to this day. As for cult of personality, I don't pick and choose who I follow. The Holy Spirit does it for me. I TRUST the Holy Spirit, and I trust Jesus in what he says.
 
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MennoSota

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So what? We burn candles. Shrug. A completely incorrect statement. I think you know better, which would make it a lie.
We don't "add teachings from fallible sources and call them inspired by God." We allow the Holy Spirit to teach us, even to this day. As for cult of personality, I don't pick and choose who I follow. The Holy Spirit does it for me. I TRUST the Holy Spirit, and I trust Jesus in what he says.
You prove my point. Thank you.
 
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Root of Jesse

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You and I agree on the book of Revelation, but the application can/should be made to all the books in God's word. We don't add or subtract.
But applying your understanding of Revelation is adding to God's word, no?
Infant baptism for salvation is clearly adding to the Scripture something that is not there.
No, it's interpreting God's Word correctly. Families include children. Households include children. It is true that not all families or households have children, but to say that none of them did is error.
Again, we agree. Novel ideas from any Era that are not biblical must be tossed out. (infant baptism for salvation is a perfect example.)

Sola Scriptura is an example by which novel heresy is disallowed.
You should fully support God's word as the sole measurement against the heresies of men.
 
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Erose

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You and I agree on the book of Revelation, but the application can/should be made to all the books in God's word. We don't add or subtract. Infant baptism for salvation is clearly adding to the Scripture something that is not there.
So why do you follow the adding and subtracting then? You really are getting confusing here.


Again, we agree. Novel ideas from any Era that are not biblical must be tossed out. (infant baptism for salvation is a perfect example.)
Concerning Baptism, what do you think it is? What does Baptism do in your opinion?

Sola Scriptura is an example by which novel heresy is disallowed.
You should fully support God's word as the sole measurement against the heresies of men.
Considering Sola Scriptura is a novel heresy, and what you are espousing is not taught in Scripture, stop it!
 
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MennoSota

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So why do you follow the adding and subtracting then? You really are getting confusing here.



Concerning Baptism, what do you think it is? What does Baptism do in your opinion?


Considering Sola Scriptura is a novel heresy, and what you are espousing is not taught in Scripture, stop it!
Jesus spoke Scripture when people questioned him. He didn't revert to the traditions of the priesthood, Pharisee's and Saducee's as his source. He didn't declare that tradition had equality with Scripture. He spoke by quoting His Father's words in Scripture.
Why do you pine for the teachings of the Pharisee's and Saducee's rather than God's word?

Stop giving authority to heretical teachings from your church leaders.
 
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Erose

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Jesus spoke Scripture when people questioned him. He didn't revert to the traditions of the priesthood, Pharisee's and Saducee's as his source. He didn't declare that tradition had equality with Scripture. He spoke by quoting His Father's words in Scripture.
Why do you pine for the teachings of the Pharisee's and Saducee's rather than God's word?

Stop giving authority to heretical teachings from your church leaders.
I see. You want me to follow your man-made warping of Scripture. No thanks. Why should I bind myself to your non-Biblical ideas? That makes no sense. Stop it!
 
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NonTheologian

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It's not animosity. It's an expectation of excellence to God's word. All humans are by nature flawed, which is why all traditions must be measured by God's word. When a tradition is in contradiction of God's word, it must be abandoned...regardless of which church denomination is promoting it. My frustration comes when humans place their faith in church traditions above God's word. This should never be.

Understood.

Speaking as an (Eastern) Orthodox Christian, I would state that it is the Church that Christ left to us and not "the Bible" (τὰ βιβλία - a term coined, I believe, by Archbishop John Chrysostom in the 4th century) and that the New Testament (and arguably, to some extent, even the Old) came out of the Church and not vice versa. Would you disagree with this view?

This does not mean, however, that the Church's practices and beliefs should be contrary to what has been witnessed to by the Church previously in Holy Scripture. Scripture is a rule of sorts in this regard (the Greek word used would be "canon"). I think you are arguing that Scripture clearly states that infant baptism is not "Biblical" (or, if you will, "canonical"). What in Scripture, to your mind, makes this clear?

Thank you in advance for your reading my response.
 
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MennoSota

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Understood.

Speaking as an (Eastern) Orthodox Christian, I would state that it is the Church that Christ left to us and not "the Bible" (τὰ βιβλία - a term coined, I believe, by Archbishop John Chrysostom in the 4th century) and that the New Testament (and arguably, to some extent, even the Old) came out of the Church and not vice versa. Would you disagree with this view?

This does not mean, however, that the Church's practices and beliefs should be contrary to what has been witnessed to by the Church previously in Holy Scripture. Scripture is a rule of sorts in this regard (the Greek word used would be "canon"). I think you are arguing that Scripture clearly states that infant baptism is not "Biblical" (or, if you will, "canonical"). What in Scripture, to your mind, makes this clear?

Thank you in advance for your reading my response.

The Bible did not come out of the Church.
God's word came out of God's mouth and was imparted to humanity and to his church.
God sovereignly directed and anointed his chosen to write down his word. He sovereignly kept his word available to us throughout the centuries.
I am stating that infant baptism as a means of salvation is never taught in God's word. God shares that He makes us alive and gives us faith. He extends grace to his chosen, adopted, children. God gives salvation to whom He wills. Salvation comes by God baptizing us with his Holy Spirit. Read Ephesians 2:1-10.
 
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