Water baptism

[Frogster]

No, one could be water baptized or not.
That is why Lutherans say Baptism is necessary, but not absolutely necessary.
One could freely be saved without water baptism.

Please everyone form a line to be converted to Lutheranism. Take a number. ... FIVE!

Lutherans are cool in my book.

 

[Edial]

Hahah..that was really cute, i got a good laugh out of it. I am going to post in in the catholic section in a few minutes, thanks Ed.

... I did not show this to you to cause problems!

 

[Frogster]

... I did not show this to you to cause problems!

Well...the forg knows better than to post it there...but the idea was most exhilarating!

 

[Edial]

Well...the forg knows better than to post it there...but the idea was most exhilarating!

... wait till I catch you one day

 

[Frogster]

... wait till I catch you one day

just look at those jumping frogs in my sig, the ones you just love, you can't catch them, too fast!

 

[EdwinWillers]

but if you bind all of that to water, you mandate water, that is a no no..you ignore the mystical union, that takes no water.

I'm trying to understand where you're coming from here.

In numerous posts now you basically admit everything that baptism is and does - with the one exception being - water; what is it about water that is so abhorrent for you?

What is it about all that you acknowledge happens in baptism, happening in water?

How is it that mere water somehow dampens God's ability to bring us into this "mystical union" with His Son?

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Again to sum up my 3 main points:

Water baptism is necessary as priests unto God. (Exodus 29:4; Numbers 8:6-7). Jesus said his baptism fulfilled all righteousness and I believe he was referring to the Exodus passage where God told all high priests they had to be washed before serving. We, as priests under our high priest, must also be washed with water before we can serve.

Water baptism is necessary to become a disciple of Christ. In Matthew 28:19-20 Jesus said, As you go, make disciples... he then tells us how we are to make disciples. We are to baptize in the name of Jesus and then teach them the Lord's commands.

Water baptism is also necessary to receive the circumcision of Christ (Colossians 2:11-13). In v13 we are told we were dead while uncircumcised. That means no life can be had until we received this circumcision referred to in v11, the circumcision of Christ, the removal of the body of flesh. V12 says this happens when we are baptized in Christ.

As I stated previously, the NT is always really specific about what baptisms it refers to. Baptism into Christ is always within the context of water baptism. Matthew 28:19-20, Acts 2:38. In no place in the New Testament scriptures is baptism in Jesus referred to as a mystical thing. Rather to baptize into Jesus was a command given to real people to be done in real water to those who have real faith in Jesus. So when you see the statement "baptism" (or its various forms) followed by "in (or into) Christ" the scriptures are speaking of water baptism.

 

[Frogster]

I'm trying to understand where you're coming from here.

In numerous posts now you basically admit everything that baptism is and does - with the one exception being - water; what is it about water that is so abhorrent for you?

What is it about all that you acknowledge happens in baptism, happening in water?

How is it that mere water somehow dampens God's ability to bring us into this "mystical union" with His Son?

red above...bro. please note that my lilly pad is surrounded by water, and little tadpoles swim by each day to greet the frog, I am actually aquatic by nature. thanks

 

[EdwinWillers]

I'm trying to understand where you're coming from here.

In numerous posts now you basically admit everything that baptism is and does - with the one exception being - water; what is it about water that is so abhorrent for you?

What is it about all that you acknowledge happens in baptism, happening in water?

How is it that mere water somehow dampens God's ability to bring us into this "mystical union" with His Son?

red above...bro. please note that my lilly pad is surrounded by water, and little tadpoles swim by each day to greet the frog, I am actually aquatic by nature. thanks

Well, I was briefly tempted to inject a little levity along those lines (it sort of does beg comparison, doesn't it?) - but since I genuinely want to know the answers to those questions, and since it appeared you sincerely believed in your position, I felt levity wouldn't be constructive - or appropriate.

Apparently... I was wrong.

That, or who knows - perhaps the source of your beliefs on this topic are those little tadpoles that swim by your lily pad each day?? /levity?

Either way, given you don't seem to take your beliefs on this topic seriously....

....it is pretty apparent no one else needs to either.

 

[Edial]

Well, I was briefly tempted to inject a little levity along those lines (it sort of does beg comparison, doesn't it?) - but since I genuinely want to know the answers to those questions, and since it appeared you sincerely believed in your position, I felt levity wouldn't be constructive - or appropriate.

Apparently... I was wrong.

That, or who knows - perhaps the source of your beliefs on this topic are those little tadpoles that swim by your lily pad each day?? /levity?

Either way, given you don't seem to take your beliefs on this topic seriously....

....it is pretty apparent no one else needs to either.

What he is saying is this ... since Romans 6 gives some really, really heavy ammo to water baptism, he feels it is Spirit baptism, since water makes it a bit "Lutheran".

Frog is a literal thinker, and Romans 6 bothers him to no end because he sees that IF he accepts literal water, water baptism in itself loses it's symbolism.

Thanks,
Ed

 

[Frogster]

What he is saying is this ... since Romans 6 gives some really, really heavy ammo to water baptism, he feels it is Spirit baptism, since water makes it a bit "Lutheran".

Frog is a literal thinker, and Romans 6 bothers him to no end because he sees that IF he accepts literal water, water baptism in itself loses it's symbolism.

Thanks,
Ed

Nope, i just think Paul is talking about union, united into Christ, that comes without water, otherwise everyone would have to be water emersed, to participate in Rom 6. 6 can happen without water, as I believe you agreed to on this thread?

However I do appreciate your analysis of the forg's interior parts, even though you are incorrect in your evalutaion of the frog's innermost being.

 

[Frogster]

Well, I was briefly tempted to inject a little levity along those lines (it sort of does beg comparison, doesn't it?) - but since I genuinely want to know the answers to those questions, and since it appeared you sincerely believed in your position, I felt levity wouldn't be constructive - or appropriate.

Apparently... I was wrong.

That, or who knows - perhaps the source of your beliefs on this topic are those little tadpoles that swim by your lily pad each day?? /levity?

Either way, given you don't seem to take your beliefs on this topic seriously....

....it is pretty apparent no one else needs to either.

well gee, on this thread, and the other one I said it alot, I am getting bored!

 

[Edial]

Nope, i just think Paul is talking about union, united into Christ, that comes without water, otherwise everyone would have to be water emersed, to participate in Rom 6. 6 can happen without water, as I believe you agreed to on this thread?

However I do appreciate your analysis of the forg's interior parts, even though you are incorrect in your evalutaion of the frog's innermost being.

I've seen frog's innermost beings once on TV, biology class something.
I am an expert now.

 

[Frogster]

I've seen frog's innermost beings once on TV, biology class something.
I am an expert now.

Disecting a frog?

Why can't they use a less glorious creature for med/biology students?

 

[Edial]

Disecting a frog?

Why can't they use a less glorious creature for med/biology students?

Because there aren't any ...

 

[Frogster]

Because there aren't any ...

(joke) Hey, did you hear the one about the Lutheran who?...oh nevermind..

Well, at least I was born in water, so our baptism friends can rest.

 

[Edial]

(joke) Hey, did you hear the one about the Lutheran who?...oh nevermind..

Well, at least I was born in water, so our baptism friends can rest.

(joke) you might have been born in water, but probably never had a chance to come up except through Long Island Sound ...

 

[bob96]

(joke) Hey, did you hear the one about the Lutheran who?...oh nevermind..

Well, at least I was born in water, so our baptism friends can rest.

I'm not Lutheran. I go to the Churches of Christ - the majority of which take your view of baptism.

Frogster, I know many believers that have been going to their church for years that have never been baptised, and have no intention of being baptised.
Here's a question for you: Are you content that those who choose not to be baptised are saved?

 

[Frogster]

(joke) you might have been born in water, but probably never had a chance to come up except through Long Island Sound ...

Tell you one thing, those horseshoe crabs were really funky creatures.

I used to catch bluefish in the sound, though from polluted water, the small ones were yummy!

Hey, just goes to show, that long island connections with the frog, prove it's worth. Can any thing good come out of the sound? John 1:46.

 

[Frogster]

I'm not Lutheran. I go to the Churches of Christ - the majority of which take your view of baptism.

Frogster, I know many believers that have been going to their church for years that have never been baptised, and have no intention of being baptised.
Here's a question for you: Are you content that those who choose not to be baptised are saved?

yes, I was baptized just for the record. I did not know that was the view of that denomination though, glad to learn more, as the forum is great learning tool.

I mean, hey, baptism is like an outward testimony, and it's fine, but it does not save, and really, I, who have been baptized have no advantage each day, over a non baptized saint.