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Do you agree that Christians should obey all 613 commandments?

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JohnRabbit

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Nope, And I stated why. I think I gave a reasonable and wise answer to your question.

from scratch,

i went back and looked at your post #487, page 49 where you said:


The commandment love thy neighbor as thyself isn't part of the law that is valid - remember it was nailed to the cross as it isn't one of the 10 Cs.

so, i'm simply asking, what part of the law is "valid"? you haven't answered me on that.

and i'm still waiting on you to explain how Jesus could say what He did in matt 5:19, since you say that He never taught the commandments.

oh, thanks for the compliment in the other thread and your post in that thread was spot on!
:thumbsup:
 
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11822

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The idea you present is submitting to a rule list (called law or the law) opposed to following the leading of the Holy Spirit which doesn't lead us to follow a rule list. A Christian doesn't submit to the lusts of the flesh or the law - Gal 5:19-21.




It seems like the apostles think studying and obeying the written word is a good thing.




Joh 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day

Ro 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God

Ac 6:4 But we will give ourselves continually to prayer, and to the ministry of the word.

Lu 11:28 But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it

2Th 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

2Th 3:14 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed.

Mr 4:14 The sower soweth the word

Lu 8:11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God

Lu 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God

Lu 4:32 And they were astonished at his doctrine: for his word was with power.

2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.



I don't hear anything about throwing out the written word.
 
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11822

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2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
 
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11822

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The idea you present is submitting to a rule list (called law or the law) opposed to following the leading of the Holy Spirit which doesn't lead us to follow a rule list. A Christian doesn't submit to the lusts of the flesh or the law - Gal 5:19-21.



We submit to Christ and His law. Fornication being part of it
 
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JohnRabbit

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My challenge remains unanswered...

[c]
10commandments.jpg
[/c]


Again I ask, is there anyone who defends the 10 Commandments for today who will tell me which of the other 603 commandments are still binding on the Church?

Further, if any are indeed binding it seems to me we need to know which are binding and why they are binding while others are now loosed.

Also, if any are indeed now loosed it seems to me we need to know which are now loosed and why they are now loosed while others remain binding.

Avoiding to answer this most important question seems to me to undermine the very thesis that the 10 Commandments are not loosed and are still bound up upon the yoke of the disciple of the Lord.

As I posted before, I affirm that now they are all loosed, all 613. What is now binding is the Law of Christ, and anything taught by the incarnate Word.

hi SummaScriptura,

i am one who subscribes to the fact that the ten commandments are still binding.

i am probably known as a "law pusher", but i'm not.

what i have maintained is that the ten commandments define sin (1jn 3:7).God gave us His laws for a reason not in vain, for He doesn't operate like that (ezek 6:10). His reason was given in exodus:


Exodus 16:4(NKJV)
4Then the Lord said to Moses, “Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you. And the people shall go out and gather a certain quota every day, that I may test them, whether they will walk in My law or not.

and deut:

Deuteronomy 8:6(NKJV)
6“Therefore you shall keep the commandments of the Lord your God, to walk in His ways and to fear Him.

His laws express his ways and the way in which we should walk!:
let's go to the "video tape":

enoch walked with God (gen 5:22,24).

noah walked with God (gen 6:9).

abraham and isaac walked with God (gen 48:15). and to walk with God means to keep his

commandment, statutes, and judgments, just like abraham did (gen 26:5)!


(see also ex 18:20, lev 18:4-5, lev 26:3, deut 5:33, deut 10:12, deut 11:22, deut 13:4,5, iking 2:4, 1king 3:14, 1king 6:12, 2king 10:31, 2king 21:22, 2chron 6:16, 2chron 6:31, neh 10:29, ps 78:10, ps 81:13, ps 86:11, ps 89:30, ps 119:1,3,35,45, prov 2:20, isa 42:24, jer 7:23, jer 26:4, ezek 11:19-20, ezek 20:13,16,19-21, dan 9:10, hosea 14:9, micah 4:2,5 zech 3:7, jn 8:12, jn12:35, rom 4:12, rom 6:4, rom 8:1, gal 5:16,25, eph 2:10, eph 4:1, phil 3:17, col 1:10, col 2:6, ithess 2:12, 1thess 4:1, 1jn 1:7, 1jn 2:6).

i have said before that the laws of God aren't just a bunch of do's and don'ts for an ancient people. they express His ways (deut 8:6).

when God led the COI out of the land of egypt, the first thing He was concerned with is whether or not they would walk in His laws (ex 16:4)! for the patriachs of old walked in His laws because He said so (gen 26:5).

so, God made a different covenant with the COI, that if they obey Him and walked in His law that He would be the God for them. in that way, His ways would be revealed to the rest of the world through the COI. but, we know how that turned out.

the COI was already kicking and screaming before they got to sinai! nevertheless, God gave them His laws. even before the COI reached sinai they were keeping holy days (ex 12, 16) and they were keeping His commandment, statutes, and laws (ex 15-18)!

so, God entered into a covenant, (it was a marriage covenant), with the the COI and they were to become a nation of kings and priests (ex 19:5-6).He gave them His law to keep and He would fulfill His end by blessing them and protecting them, and in that way, the other nations of the earth would see them prospering and realize that it was because they were living the way of the Lord. the conditions of the covenant are spelled out in ex 19-24.

He wrote the first ten Himself, the ten commandments (ex 20). He also gave them the statutes and judgments (ex 21-23).

the ten commandments define sin (1jn 3:4). break one of them and you deserve death (rom 6:23). it is also a spiritual law (rom 7:14), meaning that it takes no physical effort to perform.

the statutes were concerned with certain religious practices, ethical and humanitarian standards, excessive debt, and judicial impartiality.

the judgments were given to help in making decisions based on the ten commandments, to expound the ten for everyday living. so, the statutes and judgments are like our civil laws today.

with the law, the COI had the laws they needed to govern their nation. this is not the first time the law was made known or given, for the patriarchs of old walked in God's laws. and we

have to remember that moses was making God's laws known (ex 18:16) to the COI before they reached sinai , which was three months after they left egypt.

God wrote the ten commandments on two tablets of stone and mosese wrote the statutes and jugments in what is called the "Book of the Law". the book of the law also contained the ministration of death (e.g.ex 21:12). this book of the law or book of the covenant became known as the law of moses, not that it was his law, rather, because he wrote it. this book of the covenant was written on stone too, when the COI reached mt. ebal (deut 27:1-8).

the covenant was agreed to by the COI and ratified with blood (ex 24:8). the sacrificial laws were not part of the original terms and agreement. the sacrificial laws were added later (ex 40:2,17, gal 3:19):


Galatians 3:19(NKJV)
19What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator.

this law of ceremony was added later and apparently appointed through angels. this is no where stated in ex 19-24. they had law and law was added because of transgressions. however, this law was only temporary, pointing to things to come, i.e., Jesus and the Holy Spirit. it served as a tutor to keep the COI in the habit of obedience, with the washings and sacrifices etc. paul also referred to the ceremonial law as the "works of law" in the book of galatians, because it takes physical labor to accomplish them. they were tough and grueling to carry out.

now when the COI broke the covenant (jer 31:32), God decreed that He would make a new covenant. God allowed israel to be captured and carried away out of His sight even, that they would be ruled by other nations. so, what was nailed to the cross was the law that served a temporary purpose - the law of ceremony concerning the priesthood.

jesus came to magnify the law:


Isaiah 42:21(NKJV)
21 The Lord is well pleased for His righteousness’ sake; He will exalt the law and make it honorable.

Isaiah 42:21(KJV)
21The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness’ sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable. (i think the kjv gives a better expression of the hebrew word "gaw-dal" by translating it as "magnify" (strong's h1431).

and Jesus did just that (matt 5:17-48). jesus said He didn't come to destroy the law or the prophets, but to fulfill verse 17. He, in the form of a human, flesh even, fulfilled the law of God. He didn't break God's law on any point. He did it by relying on God, and with God's help, He was able to keep God's law. Jesus even magnified the statutes (matt 5).

with this magnification of the law, Jesus was showing that we should walk in the spirit of the law or to it's spiritual intent and not to the letter of the law.


Romans 7:6(NKJV)
6But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.

so:

Romans 8:4(NKJV)
4that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

now, for a man it is impossible to keep God's law (matt 19:26), however, we can accomplish this with the help of the Christ (gal 2:20).

and even into the millennium:


Isaiah 2:3(NKJV)
3 Many people shall come and say, “Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, To the house of the God of Jacob; He will teach us His ways, And we shall walk in His paths.” For out of Zion shall go forth the law, And the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

it's not about a bunch of do's and don'ts or building up works of oneself to obtain justification, rather, it's the way God wants us to live our lives - His Way.

and finally:


1 Corinthians 7:19(NKJV)
19Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

so, i say don't go for the "lie". the law is not our problem it's sin that's our problem (rom 6:23, rom 7:7-8). the law is our friend (rom 7:12,14).

this is my answer to your challenge, take it easy on me.
 
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11822

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My challenge remains unanswered...

[c]
10commandments.jpg
[/c]


Again I ask, is there anyone who defends the 10 Commandments for today who will tell me which of the other 603 commandments are still binding on the Church?

Further, if any are indeed binding it seems to me we need to know which are binding and why they are binding while others are now loosed.

Also, if any are indeed now loosed it seems to me we need to know which are now loosed and why they are now loosed while others remain binding.

Avoiding to answer this most important question seems to me to undermine the very thesis that the 10 Commandments are not loosed and are still bound up upon the yoke of the disciple of the Lord.

As I posted before, I affirm that now they are all loosed, all 613. What is now binding is the Law of Christ, and anything taught by the incarnate Word.

"Now about eight days after these sayings he took with him Peter and John and James and went up on the mountain to pray. And as he was praying, the appearance of his face was altered, and his clothing became dazzling white. And behold, two men were talking with him, Moses and Elijah, who appeared in glory and spoke of his departure, which he was about to accomplish at Jerusalem. Now Peter and those who were with him were heavy with sleep, but when they became fully awake they saw his glory and the two men who stood with him. And as the men were parting from him, Peter said to Jesus, "Master, it is good that we are here. Let us make three tents, one for you and one for Moses and one for Elijah"— not knowing what he said. As he was saying these things, a cloud came and overshadowed them, and they were afraid as they entered the cloud. And a voice came out of the cloud, saying, 'This is my Son, my Chosen One; listen to him!' And when the voice had spoken, Jesus was found alone. And they kept silent and told no one in those days anything of what they had seen" (Luke 9:28-36 ESV)

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Carl_Heinrich_Bloch_The_Transfiguration.jpg
[/c]
[c]
5041250493_5e6e137391.jpg


Check out this list:

Descriptions of the Mosaic Law in the New Testament[/c]





Any law that is an act of love or Holiness is good. Paul argues that the law brings death to them that hope in it for salvation, but He doesn't end it there. He goes on to say there is another reason to obey law such as love and holiness. This is why Paul Quotes from the 10 and why he teaches about obeying other laws, not for righteousness but because they are laws governing the works of the flesh, which Paul teaches us to flee from.
 
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Lysimachus

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Good post....however, I disagree with you about "spiritual Jews". There is no such a thing as a "spiritual Jew". Romans 2:28-29 is speaking of the physical descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob...not Gentiles. Basically, what it says is that a Jew (physical descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob) is just as guilty before a Holy God as a Gentile...however, a Jew who truly believes in God is the one who is clothed in the righteousness of Christ. IOW, those Jews are born again. Gentiles don't become "spiritual Jews" when they trust Christ for salvation. You won't find that term in Scripture.

You can disagree, but the Bible is very clear that there are Spiritual Jews. I have given you sufficient Biblical evidence to back this up in the past, but sadly you ignored all my posts.

The New Covenant is ONLY made to the House of Israel. Therefore, if you are a New Testament Christian, and living under the New Covenant, you have to be a Spiritual Jew, otherwise you are doomed. You can't go to heaven!

The New Covenant was NEVER made to "gentiles". Therefore, any Gentile that is saved must be grafted "into the house of Israel". They become part of the "same spiritual family", of Israel. This is Biblical.

This is Biblical.

"Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews." (John 4:22)

If salvation is of the Jews, then one must become a Jew in order to inherit salvation. Presto!

"And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive; I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan." (Revelation 2:8,9)

Do you know what this text is saying?

John is saying that in the Church, there are those who say they are Jews, but are really not, and are of the synagogue of Satan.

What is this saying?

It is saying "I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Christians, and are not, but are of the synagogue of Satan.".

Once again, PRESTO!

The letter is being addressed TO THE CHURCH OF SMYRNA.

The book of Revelation is a symbolic book, and John is symbolically employing the word "Jew" to those who are true Christians.

Why? John KNEW what Paul meant in Romans 2:28,29. You may not sheina...you may know what Paul meant in Romans 2:28,29. But John did!
 
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Lysimachus

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hi SummaScriptura,

i am one who subscribes to the fact that the ten commandments are still binding.

i am probably known as a "law pusher", but i'm not.

what i have maintained is that the ten commandments define sin (1jn 3:7).God gave us His laws for a reason not in vain, for He doesn't operate like that (ezek 6:10). His reason was given in exodus:


Exodus 16:4(NKJV)
4Then the Lord said to Moses, “Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you. And the people shall go out and gather a certain quota every day, that I may test them, whether they will walk in My law or not.

and deut:

Deuteronomy 8:6(NKJV)
6“Therefore you shall keep the commandments of the Lord your God, to walk in His ways and to fear Him.

His laws express his ways and the way in which we should walk!:
let's go to the "video tape":

enoch walked with God (gen 5:22,24).

noah walked with God (gen 6:9).

abraham and isaac walked with God (gen 48:15). and to walk with God means to keep his

commandment, statutes, and judgments, just like abraham did (gen 26:5)!


(see also ex 18:20, lev 18:4-5, lev 26:3, deut 5:33, deut 10:12, deut 11:22, deut 13:4,5, iking 2:4, 1king 3:14, 1king 6:12, 2king 10:31, 2king 21:22, 2chron 6:16, 2chron 6:31, neh 10:29, ps 78:10, ps 81:13, ps 86:11, ps 89:30, ps 119:1,3,35,45, prov 2:20, isa 42:24, jer 7:23, jer 26:4, ezek 11:19-20, ezek 20:13,16,19-21, dan 9:10, hosea 14:9, micah 4:2,5 zech 3:7, jn 8:12, jn12:35, rom 4:12, rom 6:4, rom 8:1, gal 5:16,25, eph 2:10, eph 4:1, phil 3:17, col 1:10, col 2:6, ithess 2:12, 1thess 4:1, 1jn 1:7, 1jn 2:6).

i have said before that the laws of God aren't just a bunch of do's and don'ts for an ancient people. they express His ways (deut 8:6).

when God led the COI out of the land of egypt, the first thing He was concerned with is whether or not they would walk in His laws (ex 16:4)! for the patriachs of old walked in His laws because He said so (gen 26:5).

so, God made a different covenant with the COI, that if they obey Him and walked in His law that He would be the God for them. in that way, His ways would be revealed to the rest of the world through the COI. but, we know how that turned out.

the COI was already kicking and screaming before they got to sinai! nevertheless, God gave them His laws. even before the COI reached sinai they were keeping holy days (ex 12, 16) and they were keeping His commandment, statutes, and laws (ex 15-18)!

so, God entered into a covenant, (it was a marriage covenant), with the the COI and they were to become a nation of kings and priests (ex 19:5-6).He gave them His law to keep and He would fulfill His end by blessing them and protecting them, and in that way, the other nations of the earth would see them prospering and realize that it was because they were living the way of the Lord. the conditions of the covenant are spelled out in ex 19-24.

He wrote the first ten Himself, the ten commandments (ex 20). He also gave them the statutes and judgments (ex 21-23).

the ten commandments define sin (1jn 3:4). break one of them and you deserve death (rom 6:23). it is also a spiritual law (rom 7:14), meaning that it takes no physical effort to perform.

the statutes were concerned with certain religious practices, ethical and humanitarian standards, excessive debt, and judicial impartiality.

the judgments were given to help in making decisions based on the ten commandments, to expound the ten for everyday living. so, the statutes and judgments are like our civil laws today.

with the law, the COI had the laws they needed to govern their nation. this is not the first time the law was made known or given, for the patriarchs of old walked in God's laws. and we

have to remember that moses was making God's laws known (ex 18:16) to the COI before they reached sinai , which was three months after they left egypt.

God wrote the ten commandments on two tablets of stone and mosese wrote the statutes and jugments in what is called the "Book of the Law". the book of the law also contained the ministration of death (e.g.ex 21:12). this book of the law or book of the covenant became known as the law of moses, not that it was his law, rather, because he wrote it. this book of the covenant was written on stone too, when the COI reached mt. ebal (deut 27:1-8).

the covenant was agreed to by the COI and ratified with blood (ex 24:8). the sacrificial laws were not part of the original terms and agreement. the sacrificial laws were added later (ex 40:2,17, gal 3:19):


Galatians 3:19(NKJV)
19What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator.

this law of ceremony was added later and apparently appointed through angels. this is no where stated in ex 19-24. they had law and law was added because of transgressions. however, this law was only temporary, pointing to things to come, i.e., Jesus and the Holy Spirit. it served as a tutor to keep the COI in the habit of obedience, with the washings and sacrifices etc. paul also referred to the ceremonial law as the "works of law" in the book of galatians, because it takes physical labor to accomplish them. they were tough and grueling to carry out.

now when the COI broke the covenant (jer 31:32), God decreed that He would make a new covenant. God allowed israel to be captured and carried away out of His sight even, that they would be ruled by other nations. so, what was nailed to the cross was the law that served a temporary purpose - the law of ceremony concerning the priesthood.

jesus came to magnify the law:


Isaiah 42:21(NKJV)
21 The Lord is well pleased for His righteousness’ sake; He will exalt the law and make it honorable.

Isaiah 42:21(KJV)
21The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness’ sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable. (i think the kjv gives a better expression of the hebrew word "gaw-dal" by translating it as "magnify" (strong's h1431).

and Jesus did just that (matt 5:17-48). jesus said He didn't come to destroy the law or the prophets, but to fulfill verse 17. He, in the form of a human, flesh even, fulfilled the law of God. He didn't break God's law on any point. He did it by relying on God, and with God's help, He was able to keep God's law. Jesus even magnified the statutes (matt 5).

with this magnification of the law, Jesus was showing that we should walk in the spirit of the law or to it's spiritual intent and not to the letter of the law.


Romans 7:6(NKJV)
6But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.

so:

Romans 8:4(NKJV)
4that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

now, for a man it is impossible to keep God's law (matt 19:26), however, we can accomplish this with the help of the Christ (gal 2:20).

and even into the millennium:


Isaiah 2:3(NKJV)
3 Many people shall come and say, “Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, To the house of the God of Jacob; He will teach us His ways, And we shall walk in His paths.” For out of Zion shall go forth the law, And the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

it's not about a bunch of do's and don'ts or building up works of oneself to obtain justification, rather, it's the way God wants us to live our lives - His Way.

and finally:


1 Corinthians 7:19(NKJV)
19Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

so, i say don't go for the "lie". the law is not our problem it's sin that's our problem (rom 6:23, rom 7:7-8). the law is our friend (rom 7:12,14).

this is my answer to your challenge, take it easy on me.

Excellent post JohnRabbit! Very well said...a lot of good arguments I had not heard! :)

Just one small suggestion: You think it is possible for you to capitalize the beginning of your sentences? Please do not think I am upset about this. It's just easier on my eyes. ;) I'm very picky when it comes to English. :p It is very difficult for me to concentrate on what is being said when there are grammar issues, especially sentences or paragraphs that don't begin with capital letters.

Also, what does COI mean? I'm assuming "Covenant of Israel"?

[EDIT: Okay, I think I just figured it out: COI = Children of Israel. Right?]
 
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sheina

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You can disagree, but the Bible is very clear that there are Spiritual Jews. I have given you sufficient Biblical evidence to back this up in the past, but sadly you ignored all my posts.
Where is that term used in the Bible. I am a physical descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and I have yet to see a Gentile who is a "spiritual Jew". When and from whom did those "spiritual Jew/Gentiles" receive a blood transfusion to change them into Jews?

The terms “Jew” and “Jews” are used in the Bible hundreds of times and these terms always refer to ethnic Jews (Israelites, in contrast to Gentiles). The term "Jews" never refers to Gentiles. It can refer to saved Jews who are members of the church (Romans 2:29) but it never refers to the church as a whole." It never refers to saved Gentiles of this present age. Unless a Gentile can rightly claim to be descended from Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, he has no right to call himself a Jew.

The New Testament makes is very clear that our present world is divided into three categories: “Give no offense, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God” (1 Cor. 10:32).

1) Jews=unsaved Jews
2) Gentiles=unsaved Gentiles
3) Church of God=saved Jews and saved Gentiles
The New Covenant is ONLY made to the House of Israel. Therefore, if you are a New Testament Christian, and living under the New Covenant, you have to be a Spiritual Jew, otherwise you are doomed. You can't go to heaven!
Wrong!

Jeremiah 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
The New Covenant was NEVER made to "gentiles". Therefore, any Gentile that is saved must be grafted "into the house of Israel". They become part of the "same spiritual family", of Israel. This is Biblical.

This is Biblical
You are correct..the New Covenant was not made to the Gentiles. Believing Gentiles, who are members of the Body of Christ/the Church are "partakers" of the BLESSINGS of the New Covenant through Christ

NO Gentile is "grafted into the house of Israel".

Romans 11:17

God must have branches in keeping with the root. Unbelieving Jews bear no resemblance to father Abraham who "believed God" (Gen. 15:6). The natural branches refer to Israel. The wild branches refer to the Gentiles. The cultivated olive tree refers to the place of God’s blessing. The wild olive tree is not the place of blessing (cf. Eph. 2:11-13) but branches from the wild olive tree are grafted into the cultivated olive tree and are then able to partake of the root and fatness of the olive tree (Rom. 11:17). Some of the natural branches were "broken off," and verse 20 gives the reason why ("because of unbelief"). Wild branches were "grafted in among them" because of faith in Christ--compare Rom. 9:30-32--and thus are in the place of blessing. Believing Gentiles are able to enjoy God’s salvation and God's righteousness and God's Spirit--see Gal. 3:14--that the blessings of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ, that we might receive the Spirit through faith.

Romans Chapter 11
"Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews." (John 4:22)

If salvation is of the Jews, then one must become a Jew in order to inherit salvation. Presto!
Sorry, but that is not how it works sir. Unless you are a PHYSICAL descendant of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, you are NOT a Jew...spiritual or otherwise!

One must trust in the finished work of Christ on the cross of Calvary in order to inherit eternal salvation....Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life...no man cometh to the Father but by Jesus Christ! (John 14:6) Jew or Gentile...God is no respecter of persons...the ground is level at the foot of the Cross. The gospel is power of God unto salvation to every one who believeth...to the Jew first and also to the Greek/Gentile (Romans 1:16). There is NO scripture that states one must become a "Jew" in order to inherit eternal salvation.
"And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive; I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan." (Revelation 2:8,9)

Do you know what this text is saying?

John is saying that in the Church, there are those who say they are Jews, but are really not, and are of the synagogue of Satan.

What is this saying?

It is saying "I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Christians, and are not, but are of the synagogue of Satan.".

Once again, PRESTO!
You can PRESTO till the cows come home, but that will not change the fact that you are incorrect.
 
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