Truth and Science

[AV1611VET]

diablos, aka SATAN

That's correct.

do you know that that doesn't convince me the slightest?

That's obvious.

because you're making reality fit with the bible, not the bible with reality.

Which came first? God, or reality?

 

[AV1611VET]

There are a few possibilities that you could determine from that; that you are right, or all other religions are originated from one, or just random luck they have similar themes.

I always like the doosey: "How did Egypt survive the Flood?"

The first Egyptian, according to the Table of Nations (Genesis 10) was Mizraim, Noah's grandson.

Another doosey is: "The account of the Flood in the Bible is a plagiarization of the Epic of Gilgamesh."

The Epic of Gilgamesh comes from Sumeria, which was built by Nimrod, Noah's great grandson.

They even use Chinese accounts, when the Chinese also came from Noah's great grandson.

 

[Hespera]

great grandson[/I].

doozey wise, that one can hardly be beat.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Which came first? God, or reality?

Reality, of course.

Unless you're claiming that God is not part of reality = and Atheists have been saying that all along.

 

[Nathan Poe]

I always like the doosey: "How did Egypt survive the Flood?"

The first Egyptian, according to the Table of Nations (Genesis 10) was Mizraim, Noah's grandson.

Proving the Table wrong.

Another doosey is: "The account of the Flood in the Bible is a plagiarization of the Epic of Gilgamesh."

The Epic of Gilgamesh comes from Sumeria, which was built by Nimrod, Noah's great grandson.

Proving The Bible wrong again -- Nimrod did not "build" Sumer.

They even use Chinese accounts, when the Chinese also came from Noah's great grandson.

Comedy gold.

 

[random325nicaea]

I have evidence so it is not pure speculation.

Its just that when you view the same evidence, you do not interpret it as I do.

it "might" be interstign to note, that this is a response much used by creationists. and as such i am skeptical of people using it. even if they aren't creationists.

HOW then do you interpret your "evidence" and why is it better then out interpretation?

a conclusion stands on it's constancy and rational merit, not on whether it pleases your predetermined outcome.

 

[random325nicaea]

Which came first? God, or reality?

that's not the way it works.
first we have to establish wether whatever version of god you believe exists, ACTUALLY exists. THEN you can contemplate what came first.

and your (apparently) only piece of evidence is the bible, because it makes a claim as beign the inspired word of god and thus infallable.

ofcourse we should be able to test such a textual claim to reality....

and we all know how that ends....
the earth has no corners, man undeniably related to other animals, the earth is more then 6000 years old, miracles MUST be taken on faith, the bible contains internal inconsistancies, both withing one version and between other versions, the bible was written, censored AND compiled (with an agenda i might add) by men, there are many other religious books that claim the same level of "truth" and humans could not physically become 900 years old, 5000 years ago.

should i go on?

 

[AV1611VET]

that's not the way it works.

Yes, that is how it works.

first we have to establish wether whatever version of god you believe exists, ACTUALLY exists. THEN you can contemplate what came first.

What was Australia before it was called Australia?

 

[Hespera]

Yes, that is how it works.What was Australia before it was called Australia?

It is way more complex than that. What is it called in German? In Urdu?
What did Captain Cook call it? What is it going to be called in the future?

 

[random325nicaea]

I always like the doosey: "How did Egypt survive the Flood?"

The first Egyptian, according to the Table of Nations (Genesis 10) was Mizraim, Noah's grandson.

Another doosey is: "The account of the Flood in the Bible is a plagiarization of the Epic of Gilgamesh."

The Epic of Gilgamesh comes from Sumeria, which was built by Nimrod, Noah's great grandson.

They even use Chinese accounts, when the Chinese also came from Noah's great grandson.

1) so you got an answer for the egyptians ay? how about the natives of the america's ? or the aboriginals?

not only that, egyptian civilization dates back to 3000BC, that's soem time before the supposed flood

epic of gilgamesh was first recorded around 2000BC that's about 600 years BEFORE the OT was written.

600 years is a lot of generations for the alteration of oral traditions....

"They even use Chinese accounts, when the Chinese also came from Noah's great grandson."

OH? link plz.
oh and you do realize what you are asking of the genomes of noahs grandchildren...

not to mention you're forgettign we haven't found evidence of a mass exstinction of chinamen 4800 years ago, in fact we see a quite a few cultures well underway during the supposed flood.

wiki/List_of_Neolithic_cultures_of_China

 

[AV1611VET]

It is way more complex than that. What is it called in German? In Urdu?
What did Captain Cook call it? What is it going to be called in the future?

I said what was it before it was called Australia?

It's a joke, Hespera, and it goes like this:

• Q: What was Australia before it was called Australia?
• A: Australia.

 

[random325nicaea]

Yes, that is how it works.

no. it's not.

you can't claim existence without evidence (well you can, but don't expect to convince anyone). and you can't start a discussion of "what came first" if you presume the existence of something and the other doesn't.

What was Australia before it was called Australia?

you tell me.

 

[AV1611VET]

1) so you got an answer for the egyptians ay? how about the natives of the america's ? or the aboriginals?

not only that, egyptian civilization dates back to 3000BC, that's soem time before the supposed flood

epic of gilgamesh was first recorded around 2000BC that's about 600 years BEFORE the OT was written.

600 years is a lot of generations for the alteration of oral traditions....

"They even use Chinese accounts, when the Chinese also came from Noah's great grandson."

OH? link plz.
oh and you do realize what you are asking of the genomes of noahs grandchildren...

not to mention you're forgettign we haven't found evidence of a mass exstinction of chinamen 4800 years ago, in fact we see a quite a few cultures well underway during the supposed flood.

wiki/List_of_Neolithic_cultures_of_China

You can spare me your 20,000 year this, and 3000 year that, etc.

Evolution and scientific history have their decimal places in the wrong spot.

 

[AV1611VET]

you tell me.

Australia.

 

[random325nicaea]

I said what was it before it was called Australia?

It's a joke, Hespera, and it goes like this:

• Q: What was Australia before it was called Australia?
• A: Australia.

nooo, thats actually a legitimate question.
what was it called before europeans named it?
what would i have been called in the bible? what would it have been called by the aboriginals?

 

[random325nicaea]

Australia.

EEEEEEEEEER!

wrong.
try again.

 

[Nathan Poe]

You can spare me your 20,000 year this, and 3000 year that, etc.

Evolution and scientific history have their decimal places in the wrong spot.

And you don't? Why should anyone rewrite evolution and/or scientific history to placate your presuppositions?

 

[random325nicaea]

You can spare me your 20,000 year this, and 3000 year that, etc.

Evolution and scientific history have their decimal places in the wrong spot.

lul WHAT?

ToE says NOTHING about dates. the geological record and recorded history say that.

probably the only thing ToE has to do with chronology is that we should be finding complexer life forms in younger layers of rock then their simpler predecessors....which is what we do.

 

[Hespera]

You can spare me your 20,000 year this, and 3000 year that, etc.

Evolution and scientific history have their decimal places in the wrong spot.

Be nice if we could set a 20,000 yr age-denier to counting annual layers in a greenland ice core. You can find about 200,000 of them.

That would keep a person busy for quite a while.. 1 2 3 4 5 6 etc.

They will want to watch intently for the one that represents the "flood". Then keep counting back..
And the one that marks the beginning of the earth, and show us how it so distinct from the previous ones, the ones with age "embedded" in them.



I wonder how many times a person would have to be hit on the head with the obvious before they would finally notice it.

BTW surpising to see you using the decimal place argument, considering what a loser it is for the bible. You know, 10.000000 cubits and all.

 

[AV1611VET]

nooo, thats actually a legitimate question.
what was it called before europeans named it?
what would i have been called in the bible? what would it have been called by the aboriginals?

I don't know.

What would it have been called before the Europeans named it?

That's not the question though.

The question goes: What was it, before it was called Australia?

Q. What was Pl... skip that one.

Q. What was Mars before it was called Mars?

A. Mars.