There is no Hell!

[DarkNLovely]

Yes it has, a number of times. So what do you think about my post on Jude?

I haven't read all that yet. What's wrong with believing in hell anyway?

 

[GuardianShua]

I haven't read all that yet. What's wrong with believing in hell anyway?

What's wrong with believing in hell? well, my complaint is that the words like grave and pit were replaced with the word hell. Hell is apart of the Pagans religion. Im more interrested in your opinion on my post called: I would like your opinion, good or bad.

 

[Nadiine]

The concept of Hell is part of the Pagan religion. In the K.J.V. of the Old Testament the Hebrew word sheol means "grave." Also other words are not translated, but the interpretation "Hell" is given. Thats why in the N.I.V. you dont see the word Hell in the Old testament. The reason you see the word Hell in the new testament, is because it was introduced into scripture by the Catholic Church. However, there is death of the body and spirit. Our bodies are mortal, and our spirits are mortal. And if God never called us back into being, we would never live again. And where Jesus said: have you not heared, you are gods:/// That is based upon the promise of believing that Jesus is the way to the truth and life: By the way, it is hidden in scripture that God is Truth and Life. Also we must keep Gods commandments because they were not done away with. It was Moses laws that were written in stone by Joshua that were done away with. Dont forget the bible uses many parables.

Going back to the OP -
The LAWS we're under today are all God's MORAL laws from the OT. Those haven't changed.

Gentiles were never under their various civil laws and Christ fulfilled the ceremonial/sacrifical laws in Himself thru His death. (cancelling the death penalty of the law for us)...
So yes, we're under God's moral laws & they're all reiterated into the NT.

As far as hell - if there isn't one, then where are all the souls that reject God going to go??
& Luke 16:19- is very clear that the soul that WAS in hell (the rich man) was in torment and fully coherant.
Parable or not, Jesus is giving a clear picture of the fate of people who aren't entering heaven.
Parables relay the similar story & meaning, Luke 16 is pretty clear about what goes on after death (in vivid detail).

 

[DarkNLovely]

What's wrong with believing in hell? well, my complaint is that the words like grave and pit were replaced with the word hell. Hell is apart of the Pagans religion. Im more interrested in your opinion on my post called: I would like your opinion, good or bad.

A lot of what we do is pagan! Christmas, Halloween, lot's of stuff! I understand being concerned about when that ties into doctrine, but I don't think certain things that we have that originate from pagan origin is all that bad. But that's still not an answer to your question, is it? Hold on.......

 

[DarkNLovely]

Jude

1. Jude, a servant of Yahshua the Messiah, and brother of James, and to them that are sanctified by Yahwah the Father, also called and saved by Yahshua the Messiah.
2. May mercy, peace, and devotion, be multiplied to you.
3. Loved, I was eager to write to you about the salvation we share, it was nessesary for me to write to you, and encourage you to earnestly contend for the faith that was given to the saints.
4. Because you are unaware that certain men have sneeked in, who are of a ancient order to their condemnation, these ungodly men turn the grace of our God into immorality, and deny that the only God is Yahwah, or that our lord Yahshua is the Messiah.
5. I will remined you although you once knew this, how Yahwah, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that did not believe.
6. Those messengers did not keep their first estate, and they were removed from their place, and He has reserved for them everlasting chains of darkness for that great day of judgment. This sample is how it would read if the oldest scripture was used and the words correctly translated. So what is your opinion?

*shrugs*Sounds like hell to me! What's your point?

 

[DarkNLovely]

You are also aware that in the NT there are 4 different words for hell, yes?

 

[Nadiine]

You are also aware that in the NT there are 4 different words for hell, yes?

Yep - one of them is Tartaroo/Tartarus - I forget 2 of the other ones...

I should make a thread that says 'HELL EXISTS!' then force people to prove Hell DOESN'T exist! Put the burden on them for a change.

 

[DarkNLovely]

Ghehenna- place of punnishment; eternal place of judgment.
"The place of departed spirits"

Tartarus or Tartaroo-abyss; deep pit.

Hades- grave; place of the dead; totally hot god on "Hercules: The Legendary Journies" RIP!

Sheol- grave. (Hebrew!)

The most significant to me is Gheheena because it implies a place where the psyche is concious. *shivers*

 

[Zecryphon]

Yep - one of them is Tartaroo/Tartarus - I forget 2 of the other ones...

I should make a thread that says 'HELL EXISTS!' then force people to prove Hell DOESN'T exist! Put the burden on them for a change.

It's a good idea, but anyone who has spent any amount of time talking to an atheist knows that a very popular cop out to this is "you can't prove a negative statement." But they still make them all the time, don't they? LOL

 

[NavyGuy7]

The concept of Hell is part of the Pagan religion. In the K.J.V. of the Old Testament the Hebrew word sheol means "grave." Also other words are not translated, but the interpretation "Hell" is given. Thats why in the N.I.V. you dont see the word Hell in the Old testament. The reason you see the word Hell in the new testament, is because it was introduced into scripture by the Catholic Church. However, there is death of the body and spirit. Our bodies are mortal, and our spirits are mortal. And if God never called us back into being, we would never live again. And where Jesus said: have you not heared, you are gods:/// That is based upon the promise of believing that Jesus is the way to the truth and life: By the way, it is hidden in scripture that God is Truth and Life. Also we must keep Gods commandments because they were not done away with. It was Moses laws that were written in stone by Joshua that were done away with. Dont forget the bible uses many parables.

As if not disturbing enough... you go on to say this in your statement here...

Jesus said: have you not heared, you are gods

That's an absolute lie! Tell me, from which "book" did you get this from? I don't believe Jesus said this... not truly. The only thing I can think of that might come close would be....... the Book of Mormon.... but I don't know, that's my guess. i still have yet to hear where it was found... from the person who posted this thread, preferably.

 

[Nadiine]

As if not disturbing enough... you go on to say this in your statement here...

That's an absolute lie! Tell me, from which "book" did you get this from? I don't believe Jesus said this... not truly. The only thing I can think of that might come close would be....... the Book of Mormon.... but I don't know, that's my guess. i still have yet to hear where it was found... from the person who posted this thread, preferably.

If I can step in to clarify Jesus' statement - First off, you're right, Mormons do use this to claim that we're all "little gods"...
Jesus DID say this (this is actually a quote from Psalms 82), but the problem is that people are failing to properly define the Hebrew language in it's context.

god's there doesn't mean literal gods, it's speaking of "judges". Human judges who have the authority (from God) to sentence & carry out punishment and death penalties for violations to the Law.

Unfortunately, people (esp. cults) run with stuff like this instead of proper study within the context. There's plenty of other scriptures that come out & say that no other gods exist.

 

[GuardianShua]

As if not disturbing enough... you go on to say this in your statement here...

That's an absolute lie! Tell me, from which "book" did you get this from? I don't believe Jesus said this... not truly. The only thing I can think of that might come close would be....... the Book of Mormon.... but I don't know, that's my guess. i still have yet to hear where it was found... from the person who posted this thread, preferably.

Read Psalms 82:6. and then read John 10:34-35. I sure wish more Christians would study out of a Exhastive Concordance. Then perhaps you would not think I was from another planet.

 

[Nadiine]

Read Psalms 82:6. and then read John 10:34-35. I sure wish more Christians would study out of a Exhastive Concordance. Then perhaps you would not think I was from another planet.

I agree it's there - the problem is, it isn't saying people are literal "gods" (as in some non-human or PRE-human godlike form)...
Hebrew has several meanings in Psalms 82, and within it's context, it's referring to human judges with God's authority to judge and sentence people [even to their deaths].
The whole of scripture has to be taken into account when we interpret verses, and we aren't "gods" in any sense of that word.

 

[GuardianShua]

I agree it's there - the problem is, it isn't saying people are literal "gods" (as in some non-human or PRE-human godlike form)...
Hebrew has several meanings in Psalms 82, and within it's context, it's referring to human judges with God's authority to judge and sentence people [even to their deaths].
The whole of scripture has to be taken into account when we interpret verses, and we aren't "gods" in any sense of that word.

I agree that we are not gods; that is why I said those statements are based on a promise, that we will have life eternal. Also I am preparing an answer for the other words used for "hell."

 

[GuardianShua]

Ghehenna- place of punnishment; eternal place of judgment.
"The place of departed spirits"

Tartarus or Tartaroo-abyss; deep pit.

Hades- grave; place of the dead; totally hot god on "Hercules: The Legendary Journies" RIP!

Sheol- grave. (Hebrew!)

The most significant to me is Gheheena because it implies a place where the psyche is concious. *shivers*

Hades was the Greek god of the underworld: Gehenna is the Greek word derived from the Hebrew words ge hinnom meaning, "vally of Hinnom." It was a place on the South side of Jerusalem used to worship pagan gods of the underworld: Tartaroo is the Greek word for the place or underworld of the dead. Like I said, the Catholic Church introduced the Pagan religion of hell into Christianity. And the word hell is used to replace the words grave or pit. Now I ask you, would God approve of Paganism being added to His truth; The bible; the word of God spoken and written by the prophets?

 

[GuardianShua]

Yep - one of them is Tartaroo/Tartarus - I forget 2 of the other ones...

I should make a thread that says 'HELL EXISTS!' then force people to prove Hell DOESN'T exist! Put the burden on them for a change.

Hades was the Greek god of the underworld: Gehenna is the Greek word derived from the Hebrew words ge hinnom meaning, "vally of Hinnom." It was a place on the South side of Jerusalem used to worship pagan gods of the underworld: Tartaroo is the Greek word for the place or underworld of the dead. Like I said, the Catholic Church introduced the Pagan religion of hell into Christianity. And the word hell is used to replace the words grave or pit. Now I ask you, would God approve of Paganism being added to His truth; The bible; the word of God spoken and written by the prophets?

 

[DarkNLovely]

Hades was the Greek god of the underworld: Gehenna is the Greek word derived from the Hebrew words ge hinnom meaning, "vally of Hinnom." It was a place on the South side of Jerusalem used to worship pagan gods of the underworld: Tartaroo is the Greek word for the place or underworld of the dead. Like I said, the Catholic Church introduced the Pagan religion of hell into Christianity. And the word hell is used to replace the words grave or pit. Now I ask you, would God approve of Paganism being added to His truth; The bible; the word of God spoken and written by the prophets?

You haven't proved your point, and there are cases of paganism in the Bible. I don't think God approved, so much as he had to put up with a lot. He is gracious. Do you know that Trinity, hyper-static union, omnipresence of God, original sin, and a whole bucnh of our other doctrines aren't mentioned specifically as we understand them either? Nor any of our holidays, or marriages as we have them today! I'm assuming you wouldn't ware a wedding ring and or attend a Christian wedding or any of these other pagan practices we Christians have adapted. Oh yeah, and no Christmas parties or Easter dinners, right? We also see divination and other "witchcraft" practices being approved of. Heck, even incest! I feel sorry for God sometimes. We mess up and He gets blamed for it. That being said, we should not throw out common sense for poor word studies. Look at the consept being presented-not just the word. Don't get stuck on that. As far hell, the idea that we have of hell is absolutely present in scripture(yes, even in Jude!) and I absolutley believed that it was understood the way we uderstand it. I ask what you think outer darkness is? I dare you to ask a Greek or Orthodox Christian about those words and tell them they don't mean "hell"! As a matter of fact, don't bother because you would be out of your league. I also see no where in the Bible where it says that we should have screen names on forums in honor of Archangels. That could be seen as deifying them and is thus blasphemy! WWhat is so wrng with hell anyway?

 

[Nadiine]

You haven't proved your point, and there are cases of paganism in the Bible. I don't think God approved, so much as he had to put up with a lot. He is gracious. Do you know that Trinity, hyper-static union, omnipresence of God, original sin, and a whole bucnh of our other doctrines aren't mentioned specifically as we understand them either? Nor any of our holidays, or marriages as we have them today! I'm assuming you wouldn't ware a wedding ring and or attend a Christian wedding or any of these other pagan practices we Christians have adapted. Oh yeah, and no Christmas parties or Easter dinners, right? We also see divination and other "witchcraft" practices being approved of. Heck, even incest!
I feel sorry for God sometimes. We mess up and He gets blamed for it. That being said, we should not throw out common sense for poor word studies.

Look at the consept being presented-not just the word. Don't get stuck on that. As far hell, the idea that we have of hell is absolutely present in scripture(yes, even in Jude!) and I absolutley believed that it was understood the way we uderstand it. I ask what you think outer darkness is? I dare you to ask a Greek or Orthodox Christian about those words and tell them they don't mean "hell"!
As a matter of fact, don't bother because you would be out of your league. I also see know where in the Bible where it says that we should have screen names on forums in honor of Archangels. That could be seen as deifying them and is thus blasphemy! WWhat is so wrng with hell anyway?

One thing that caught my eye (among a few others) is about HOW GOD PUTS UP WITH US, & feeling sorry for God in how we blame Him for our own error.

I see this ALL the time; alot of it is from people who claim to be His.
Don't we all tend to think we're SO lovable & special & right?
Too many are setting themselves up as SCHOLARS when we're just regular old laypeople with a Lexicon.
Until we are fluent in Greek & HEbrew, we should rely on scholars works who know the languages and grammatical rules & history before we decide on creating new doctrine that contradicts mainstream Christianity.

 

[GuardianShua]

You haven't proved your point, and there are cases of paganism in the Bible. I don't think God approved, so much as he had to put up with a lot. He is gracious. Do you know that Trinity, hyper-static union, omnipresence of God, original sin, and a whole bucnh of our other doctrines aren't mentioned specifically as we understand them either? Nor any of our holidays, or marriages as we have them today! I'm assuming you wouldn't ware a wedding ring and or attend a Christian wedding or any of these other pagan practices we Christians have adapted. Oh yeah, and no Christmas parties or Easter dinners, right? We also see divination and other "witchcraft" practices being approved of. Heck, even incest! I feel sorry for God sometimes. We mess up and He gets blamed for it. That being said, we should not throw out common sense for poor word studies. Look at the consept being presented-not just the word. Don't get stuck on that. As far hell, the idea that we have of hell is absolutely present in scripture(yes, even in Jude!) and I absolutley believed that it was understood the way we uderstand it. I ask what you think outer darkness is? I dare you to ask a Greek or Orthodox Christian about those words and tell them they don't mean "hell"! As a matter of fact, don't bother because you would be out of your league. I also see no where in the Bible where it says that we should have screen names on forums in honor of Archangels. That could be seen as deifying them and is thus blasphemy! WWhat is so wrng with hell anyway?

The information I provided you is from the Holman bible dictionary. Those scholars and our scripture is the resource used. You are thinking that Im pulling rabbits out of the hat, when that is not the case at all. Now if you believe that it's OK to take part in paganism while being a Christian, then that is between you and God.

 

[DarkNLovely]

The information I provided you is from the Holman bible dictionary. Those scholars and our scripture is the resource used. You are thinking that Im pulling rabbits out of the hat, when that is not the case at all. Now if you believe that it's OK to take part in paganism while being a Christian, then that is between you and God.

Do you take part in any of the other paganism I described?