Utah issues same-sex marriage licenses.

[gurneyhalleck1]

I agree, brother Tapi. Violence has not been the Orthodox way and it rarely produces much fruit. We remember Martin Luther King, Jr. in a much better light than, say, Malcolm X.

But I'm surprised that so many folks have come to worship at the Cult of Nelson Mandela since the guy was a violent terrorist in many ways and supported communism and aggressive tactics for years.

The world is headed into a dark place. The cable networks, internet, newspapers, magazines, music industry, television industry, movies, and even sports franchises are all overwhelmingly pro-gay and at the mercy of the LGBT lobby. They are just hoping traditional morality folks will do something stupid so they can exploit it.

At this sad point in history all we can do is pray, stick together in our Orthodox faith, and witness individually as best we can under persecution....

Suggesting violence as a solution to any moral problem is not at all compatible with the teachings of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ or the Orthodox faith.

One rarely if ever sees those who have advanced far in their spiritual struggle, take part of, or advocate violent attacks or threats with the goal of improving the morality of other people.

Here's Archmandrite Tryphon's, who's the abbot of the All Merciful Saviour Monastery (ROCOR), take on the riots in Georgia in May, where even some Orthodox clergy took part in the mob attack. I have to say I agree 100% with him.

"The recent attack on a homosexual rite demonstration is an example of the ultimate failure in reaching out the saving message of the Gospel"

http://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/morningoffering/he_who_is_without_sin

 

[buzuxi02]

I have no problem what the Abbot says, even though I disagree with a few things in his epistle. Civil disobedience has always had a history in Orthodox nations. We in the west may try to deny that but its the historical fact.

Right to Protest is even a democratic ideal and the right to civil disobedience is a Christian principle as well. Where the Abbot errs is in his naivete. He believes Christians can reverse the tide by sitting on their hands when in reality Christians are the people that have allowed this to happen. So called Christians are the ones who support the aberrations, Christian politician's elected by Christians are implementing these changes. A Substantial percentage of the laity in the pews have been brainwashed to accept them. So called ,"archbishops" like the one in Canada supports the deviant behavior as compatible with orthodox Christianity.

My family has been Orthodox for over 1300 years, they have struggled against the adversary meaning they have used violence when necessary, which is why they don't speak Turkush and attend mosque today.

 

[kellhus]

I have no problem what the Abbot says, even though I disagree with a few things in his epistle. Civil disobedience has always had a history in Orthodox nations. We in the west may try to deny that but its the historical fact. Right to Protest is even a democratic ideal and the right to civil disobedience is a Christian principle as well. Where the Abbot errs is in his naivete. He believes Christians can reverse the tide by sitting on their hands when in reality Christians are the people that have allowed this to happen. So called Christians are the ones who support the aberrations, Christian politician's elected by Christians are implementing these changes. A Substantial percentage of the laity in the pews have been brainwashed to accept them. So called ,"archbishops" like the one in Canada supports the deviant behavior as compatible with orthodox Christianity. My family has been Orthodox for over 1300 years, they have struggled against the adversary meaning they have used violence when necessary, which is why they don't speak Turkush and attend mosque today.

Um, but you haven't been describing civil disobedience. Civil disobedience is like Rosa Parks refusing to give up a bus seat. You've been talking about serious felonies such as arson, threatening government officials, and murdering government officials.

 

[buzuxi02]

Yes I guess we have a different definition then. For me what Rosa Parks did was soft rebellion the way a teenager rebels against his parents. Obviously there's nothing we can boycott to make the powers that be reverse their demonic course, we can't vote with our wallets, and even the ballot box has been proven useless.

An angry crowd throwing Molotov cocktails and clashibg with police in order to storm government offices will do the trick quickly. I know plenty of high school kids willing to take part, there sick and tired of being told to be effeminate.

 

[InnerPhyre]

Hurting or killing people is not how Christians accomplish good or fulfill the Gospel of Jesus Christ. This is what Judas wanted from Christ.

 

[buzuxi02]

Inner then how do we? Perhaps we forgot, afterall this aberration has originated by people professing to be Christians. It certainly has not originate in the Orient, nor from the Middle East nor from animist believing africans. Its not coming from Putin who atleast is more Orthodox in his belief than a certain OCA "archbishop". Why is no one calling for his ouster? I guarantee you in Greece and in Russia they would be burning his writings and calling for his excommunication.

 

[kellhus]

Inner then how do we? Perhaps we forgot, afterall this aberration has originated by people professing to be Christians. It certainly has not originate in the Orient, nor from the Middle East nor from animist believing africans. Its not coming from Putin who atleast is more Orthodox in his belief than a certain OCA "archbishop". Why is no one calling for his ouster? I guarantee you in Greece and in Russia they would be burning his writings and calling for his excommunication.

Are you talking about Archbishop Lazar in Canada? Last I checked the OCA synod page, he was listed as a retired archbishop. Why do you keep putting his title in quotation marks as if it is in question?

 

[SeventhValley]

ike mushrooms in a field, death and suffering
have emerged in different parts of the world,
reflecting the effects of ethnic, racial, religious
and economic conflicts of inequitable
distribution of power and resources. The
growing awareness of the ambivalence of
religion in situations of conflict has led the
churches on a quest to retrieve those elements
of their belief system and traditions that
contribute toward the advancement of peace
with justice. In that context, they repudiate
the use of religious symbols and language to
legitimize violence.

From: Violence and the Christian Theology — Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America

 

[InnerPhyre]

Inner then how do we? Perhaps we forgot, afterall this aberration has originated by people professing to be Christians. It certainly has not originate in the Orient, nor from the Middle East nor from animist believing africans. Its not coming from Putin who atleast is more Orthodox in his belief than a certain OCA "archbishop". Why is no one calling for his ouster? I guarantee you in Greece and in Russia they would be burning his writings and calling for his excommunication.

Calling for someone's excommunication is not the same as attacking police officers and setting buildings and people on fire. The purpose of the gospel is not to accomplish political goals and force our will on others. It is to offer to the world a path to holiness if they choose to take it. If not, shake the dust off and offer it to someone else.

 

[ArmyMatt]

If we weren't so passive and went out in the streets waving sticks making It clear that if judges, politicians and media personalities don't do the will of the majority, their heads will be impaled on those sticks, they will cower like beaten dogs. If the ballot box doesn't work, the ammo box will.

um, while I get that we need to not be fence sitting, let's not hint that going all Vlad the Impaler would be the best thing to do.

 

[SeventhValley]

This Orthodox site says what I posted....

The Orthodox Church therefore is not
pacifistic, although it in practices encourages
governments always to pursue the
“preferential option for peace.” Nonetheless,
the Church recognizes that this world is fallen
and is not yet equivalent to the kingdom of
God. For this reason, governments in general
cannot be held to the strict requirements of
the gospel. Although under God’s authority,
they belong to the fallen world. At times
statesmanship fails, and Christians are called
by their governments to defend their
commonwealth by means of war, for to fail to
do so would result in an increase in the
measure of evil in the world.
This does not mean that war can be “just.” It
may serve a just cause, but war itself is unjust
by nature. The Orthodox Church therefore has
never elaborated a theory of “just war.” For
Orthodox Christians, “just war” is a
contradiction in terms.

Peace & War in the Eastern Orthodox Church - St. George Orthodox Christian Cathedral - Wichita, Kansas

 

[rusmeister]

Perhaps the way things are done where I visited rubbed off on me. But I think civil disobedience now is better than civil unrest later. This is all the work of the political establishment and the media from what I see. If we weren't so passive and went out in the streets waving sticks making It clear that if judges, politicians and media personalities don't do the will of the majority, their heads will be impaled on those sticks, they will cower like beaten dogs. If the ballot box doesn't work, the ammo box will.

Politicians have forgotten that their chosen profession is a risky one and the people need to remind them of that.

I agree, with an emphasis on action now in order to avoid persecution or violence later. I do think confrontation now, before the schools and media have re-formed 90% of the population against us, to be smart. Better peaceful revolt now than more fearful alternatives later. We need to say loudly that we will not obey immoral laws or commands, or support governments that do.

It is terrible to contemplate how few politicians are hanged.

GKC

 

[dogs4thewin]

indeed. the whole thing with GLAAD and Phil Robertson......they actually said that Phil was not being Christian when he quoted the Bible. sad times are ahead.

While I am NOT saying that this is the case with Phil one can quote the Bible and not be Christian.

 

[ArmyMatt]

While I am NOT saying that this is the case with Phil one can quote the Bible and not be Christian.

I think we all know that Phil IS a Christian. this is not Ozzy Osborne throwing out a Bible verse

 

[SeventhValley]

A Greek Orthodox Chaplain I know said war is a cross that we must bear in tension with Christs teachings since we live in a sinful world.

 

[SeventhValley]

I would like to say that I appreciate the Greek people stopping the Ottomans from occupying Europe. That was valid self defense. To me that is much different from self inflicted national wounds which require healing

 

[buzuxi02]

I think we all know that Phil IS a Christian. this is not Ozzy Osborne throwing out a Bible verse

When I came back a few days ago I thought it was another controversy by Pat Robertson. I think we all knew it was (and is) a matter of time before the popularity of southern based reality shows will be squashed. The media built them up only to tear them down.

Granted I was convinced it would have been an animal rights group that would be the 'offended party'. Heck I even thought the wacky old uncle was meant to be the closet homosexual of the show. But the entire event proves my point, a Christian minister speaks the truth outside of the show, a truth 99% of the population accepted just 25 years ago, but today the supposed nominal Christians are throwing him to the lions, white people better get control of their insatiable appetite for homosexuality because civil disobedience will be childs play compared to Sodom and gomorah.

 

[buzuxi02]

Are you talking about Archbishop Lazar in Canada? Last I checked the OCA synod page, he was listed as a retired archbishop. Why do you keep putting his title in quotation marks as if it is in question?

Last I checked he was still listed as well. So when will the OCA excommunicate him? Perhaps Abbot Tryphon should address why his fellow monk hasn't been healed since joining the THE church? Why am I the only one that wants action against his espousal of a soul condemning doctrine in his semi official capacity?

 

[RileyG]

Lord, have mercy!

 

[kellhus]

No one to recruit, its simmering among the young people

That's surprising. Every study and survey shows that the most supportive demographic for LGBT rights, feminism, etc., is the young. The exact opposite of what you are claiming. Could you provide a source, please?