Your Thoughts?

[Dorothea]

I posted this in another message board the other day. Please share your opinions of this:

I wanted to bring up an interesting topic about people who have near death experiences. Like dying a couple minutes on the operating table and seeing a light or something, you know?

Anyway, I turned on Fox News last night, and Hannity's America was on, and I was just catching the last few minutes of this guy, Don Piper, who had been in a car accident, and said he'd gone to heaven for 90 minutes. Apparently he has a book out called 90 minutes in Heaven. These types of stories, I am not totally accepting of it, and I don't totally dismiss it. I'm in the middle some where. So, I caught some of what this guy was saying about what he supposedly saw. He said he saw the "pearly" gates and a path that went into Heaven that looked like it was gold. He said that there were also structures or something around there were marble or alabaster. He said he heard flapping of wings, and then music. He said lots of music, like so many songs in one, but not chaotic. He said he also noticed a sweet smell, something he hadn't smelled before. I thought about this. After a minute, it sounded like he was describing my church. LOL Our church is supposed to be modeled after Isaiah's visions/dreams of Heaven. We go to church and we are worshipping with the angels, God, and the Saints, etc. Anyway, he said he realized Heaven was about all the senses: sight, smell, hearing, etc. So, I thought about it, but I'm still not sure I believed what the guy said.

We are warned to be careful of our dreams and such. Anyway, what do you all think about this man's experience. He came back after this, obviously. He said he didn't want to come back when he woke up. Of course not. lol So, any thoughts?

 

[Kolya]

I think fatheralexander.org has an Orthodox NDE story. So I would not dismiss the stories out of hand.
I also bought a book from Amazom called 'Ordered to return' which leaves me wondering too. The author is a Christian, though not Orthodox. Given good discernment one should be able to tell the true from the false. I think there are a few doubtful stories one should be careful of too.

 

[hiImEric]

Part of me really feels like it could just be a guy looking to make some easy pay. I'm interested to see where this goes though.

 

[Soha]

I don't entirely dismiss these types of stories...though I am still quite skeptical.
However, my grandfather said that when my grandmother passed, he immediately smelled flowers, and there weren't any flowers in the room. Obviously I believe him

 

[Dorothea]

Interesting! Thanks for everyone's responses!

 

[rusmeister]

My thoughts...
1)

I turned on Fox News last night

Turning on the television itself can be hazardous to your faith, and especially to your children. Both the content and simply the video-game speed of news presentation (or of action on TV in general), which trains us to accept whatever is said and disables our critical thinking skills, are harmful.

2) Most of these 'experiences' are well outside of the Church. Are you aware of the possibility of 'prelest', deceit by demons?

It is wise to be skeptical of such stories. We do not even universally accept the account of St Theodora (on the Tollhouses). Why should we pay much attention to the stories of those far from sainthood? If they have had an experience from God, good and well. But it will do nothing to help our spiritual life. If of the devil, then Lord have mercy!

 

[Kolya]

My thoughts...
1)
Turning on the television itself can be hazardous to your faith, and especially to your children. Both the content and simply the video-game speed of news presentation (or of action on TV in general), which trains us to accept whatever is said and disables our critical thinking skills, are harmful.

2) Most of these 'experiences' are well outside of the Church. Are you aware of the possibility of 'prelest', deceit by demons?

It is wise to be skeptical of such stories. We do not even universally accept the account of St Theodora (on the Tollhouses). Why should we pay much attention to the stories of those far from sainthood? If they have had an experience from God, good and well. But it will do nothing to help our spiritual life. If of the devil, then Lord have mercy!

Excellent post![thumbsup]

 

[Chocolatesa]

Reminds me of that book called 20 Minutes in Hell, or something like that. My mom bought it and liked it, and offered to lend it to me but I don't want to read it yet, I'm a bit skeptical.

 

[Dorothea]

My thoughts...
1)
Turning on the television itself can be hazardous to your faith, and especially to your children. Both the content and simply the video-game speed of news presentation (or of action on TV in general), which trains us to accept whatever is said and disables our critical thinking skills, are harmful.

2) Most of these 'experiences' are well outside of the Church. Are you aware of the possibility of 'prelest', deceit by demons?

It is wise to be skeptical of such stories. We do not even universally accept the account of St Theodora (on the Tollhouses). Why should we pay much attention to the stories of those far from sainthood? If they have had an experience from God, good and well. But it will do nothing to help our spiritual life. If of the devil, then Lord have mercy!

Yes, I'm aware. That's why I said we are warned to believe in our dreams or NDE's. I was skeptical when I first saw it. I asked my priest in our class last night, and he said the same thing,....we must be careful in believing such things. Now, does that mean that nobody's NDE's could be true? No, he didn't think so. One of the priests was sick last fall and died (for a few minutes) several times before he was stabilized, and he saw nothing but darkness, but he did hear the voices of many people praying for him.

 

[jckstraw72]

Fr. Seraphim's Soul After Death deals muchly with NDE's -- he shows how some are complete bunk and some actually reinforce the Orthodox understanding of the afterlife.

 

[Dorothea]

Thanks for that info, Jack.

 

[rusmeister]

Yes, I'm aware. That's why I said we are warned to believe in our dreams or NDE's. I was skeptical when I first saw it. I asked my priest in our class last night, and he said the same thing,....we must be careful in believing such things. Now, does that mean that nobody's NDE's could be true? No, he didn't think so. One of the priests was sick last fall and died (for a few minutes) several times before he was stabilized, and he saw nothing but darkness, but he did hear the voices of many people praying for him.

Understood, but I would say that
a)anyone can be subject to prelest
and
b) the stories of devout Orthodox people would seem to have slightly greater weight than others. For many people, their experiences are modeled on what they already believe - or want to believe, which to me suggests prelest. St Theodora's story is yucky enough and detailed enough to not want to believe it, although it is not inconsistent with the Faith.

Guess I'm just saying it's unwise to be curious enough about after-death to seriously consider non-Orthodox sources.

 

[Dorothea]

Understand, rus.