YES or NO: Do The 10 Commandments Still Apply To Us Today? (2)

[squint]

Don't you find that strange? We are set free from bondage and sin, by being Born-Again of the Spirit and set free.

Not at all. God never intended us to be bound into our current wet pile O' dust.

This does not mean however that sin, evil and death that we are currently planted into has passed away, and THE LAW is written against those things which are "undeniably" in our flesh and THAT is why THE LAW still stands and STANDS against those things of "lawlessness."

You claim freedom while at the same time your open acknowledgment of UTTER FAILURE to perform ANY requirement of The Law, which as stated numerous times IS sin. Transgression of THE LAW is SIN.

Praise Jesus and His Sacrifice for us. But because of OUR fleshly desires and carnal imperfections, we LET the Law DRAG us back into sin?

Exactly the point, reiterated by your own truthful acknowledgement of failure under the Law which "proves" the presence of SIN indwelling.

My point between you and I as "believers" is that WE are not under the Law pertaining to that lawlessness, but that lawlessness, that SIN INDWELLING that is "NO LONGER I" is and remains UNDER the Law and condemned by that same Law unto condemnation, judgment and eventual eradication. That is a portion of our HOPE and our Promise from our Lord.

Is this Truth? Or can it be, that we can indeed, come out of her, and overcome? Why would the Gospels keep telling us to do something, that is impossible to do? Or in fact, are we are being deceived?

We "come out" by the understanding of our DIVISION from those things that are not "us" but are in our flesh and we "overcome" by His Love to us and to ALL mankind. Anyone who does not bear the MARK of loving ones neighbors and NOT counting sins against them and denying that the Law is and remains against that sin indwelling or denies they "have" sin remains enslaved and deceived no matter what comes out of their mouths.

Love fulfills "every" requirement of The Law.

Do you all think this is still referring to the Anti-Christ later in time, with an earthly temple, with a earthly throne? Hmm, read that REAL REAL slow, and pray that the Spirit of Truth may guide you.....

I do not look to the fleshly world to perceive "anti-Christ" events. That working went completely without notice until Jesus revealed THEM openly IN mankind but are NOT mankind. Jesus openly pointed to the captivity of Israel WITHIN. It is no different with Gentile "christians."

enjoy!

squint

 

[HisbyAdoption]

Which nomos is Paul dead too?

The nomos of sin and death?

The nomos of God?

Marc

He is dead to the whole law and nothing but the law. For it is all one. He is now married to Christ who was risen from the dead.. A person mind you.. Through the Holy Spirit all in unity with God the Father.. For where the law was weak Christ was not.

 

[HisbyAdoption]

Really?
Duet 24:16
The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

1st John 2:1
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

Well, this smacks in the face of what you are implying. John says that children of God shouldn't sin, but you say it doesn't matter, you are BORN with it.
Moses wrote that children weren't to be put to death for the sins of their fathers, but you say that we are already, by original sin doctrines.

The only reason we die in the Flesh according to God, is that Adam was driven from the Garden. Hense, he couldn't eat from the tree of LIFE any longer. This is where we dwell in these vessels now. Driven out. Does this mean we sinned from birth? No. It means the reconciliation couldn't take place until Jesus, the second Adam, redeemed us and conquered death. He did this by OBEDIENCE to the Father's Law. Perfection, and a sacrificed death. We are now victorious in Christ. Yes the vessels die, but our spirit lives on. The bridge is restored, and now Eden is attainable once again. Jesus is that tree of Life, and by His Word, we live, according to the promises made to Abraham.

What must I believe? Babies sin, or the Word of God? Show me in doctrine, where Babies sin. This is a man made doctrine which DROVE me to confessional when I was but a boy who didn't know sin, and didn't even realize what I was saying or doing. Man, was I messed up, until I came OUT of HER.

Jesus came to save us from our sin. He became Sin so that we could become the righteousness of Him.. All humans are born into sin. Except Christ for He alone was sinless.. He alone was not born of a Human father..This is why Christ could come and die for the Sins of His people. We may not be held accountable for what our Father did such as murder someone.. But we sure are responsible for the sins that we commit because we are all born slaves to Sin.. We sin because we are born sinners. We do not become sinners because we sin..

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

Actually, it is;
For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me.

The law of Moses is the law of sin and death - in another place, Paul specifically calls the ten commandments the ministry of death. See for yourself. The commandment is the power of sin. When the commandment came, sin sprang to life. Apart from the law, sin is dead.

Sure. I have never been under the mosaic law though. I'm not an Israelite. I'm not even alive.

For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me.

For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me.

Notice that it says we are "dead to the law." Notice that it does NOT say the law is dead to us. There is a huge difference. If we are dead to the law then we have fulfilled the requirement that the law demands, our death. The law demands that we die because at some point in our life we have broken that law. When we receive Yeshua we become "dead to the law" because we are "crucified with Messiah." But we also "live to God."(For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.)

Paul now realizes that his new life in the Spirit is a life to be lived without the fear of being condemned as a sinner by the
very Law he previously thought he was upholding

Marc

 

[holo]

For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me.

For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me.

Notice that it says we are "dead to the law." Notice that it does NOT say the law is dead to us. There is a huge difference. If we are dead to the law then we have fulfilled the requirement that the law demands, our death. The law demands that we die because at some point in our life we have broken that law. When we receive Yeshua we become "dead to the law" because we are "crucified with Messiah." But we also "live to God."(For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.)

Paul now realizes that his new life in the Spirit is a life to be lived without the fear of being condemned as a sinner by the
very Law he previously thought he was upholding

Marc

That's the weakest theolgy I've seen in a while. No offense, but come on! As if "you're dead to the law" actually means that you're alive to it. He who is dead is RELEASED from the law. No longer bound by it. The law doesn't even address dead people.

That, combined with the fact that I've never been a jew under the old covenant, the fact that I'm a heir to Abraham, not Moses, the fact that I'm a new creation, not a wicked and ungodly sinner, the fact that Jesus IS my righteousness, the fact that I can't think of even one single good thing the law could possibly do for me, the fact that the law is the ministry of death and the power of sin, the fact that we are called to live according to the Spirit and NOT according to the letter and the fact that the law wasn't given to make us righteous, but guilty... pretty much means that no, I'm not under the law in any way shape or form. And thank God for that!

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

That's the weakest theolgy I've seen in a while. No offense, but come on! As if "you're dead to the law" actually means that you're alive to it. He who is dead is RELEASED from the law. No longer bound by it. The law doesn't even address dead people.

That, combined with the fact that I've never been a jew under the old covenant, the fact that I'm a heir to Abraham, not Moses, the fact that I'm a new creation, not a wicked and ungodly sinner, the fact that Jesus IS my righteousness, the fact that I can't think of even one single good thing the law could possibly do for me, the fact that the law is the ministry of death and the power of sin, the fact that we are called to live according to the Spirit and NOT according to the letter and the fact that the law wasn't given to make us righteous, but guilty... pretty much means that no, I'm not under the law in any way shape or form. And thank God for that!

He is dead to the law is released from the penalty.

Look at Romans 7:1-3. This scripture shows that how a woman is released from the law and bound by the law. If the woman marries while her husband still lives she's an adulteress which is death. If she marries when her husband dies then she is released from the law of her husband and she is released from the death.

holo why are you jumping from 'under the law' to 'dead to the law'? Unless you don't know what they mean.

So are you dead to the Greatest commandment love God and the second greatest love neighbor? Or does that only apply to Jews under the old covenant and not you?



Marc

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

pretty much means that no, I'm not under the law in any way shape or form. And thank God for that!

So you are free to NOT love God and NOT love neighbor.

Marc

 

[Tkjjc]

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Not at all. God never intended us to be bound into our current wet pile O' dust.

No He just wanted our unending Love, as a Father would want from their children.

This does not mean however that sin, evil and death that we are currently planted into has passed away, and THE LAW is written against those things which are "undeniably" in our flesh and THAT is why THE LAW still stands and STANDS against those things of "lawlessness."

But what you in turn say is that we are evil? I am not evil, nor do I pretend to be.

You claim freedom while at the same time your open acknowledgment of UTTER FAILURE to perform ANY requirement of The Law, which as stated numerous times IS sin. Transgression of THE LAW is SIN.

I am not trying to "perform" the requirements of the Law. If I was, I would be Jewish. So does this mean I sin, because I don't "perform" ANY requirements?

Exactly the point, reiterated by your own truthful acknowledgement of failure under the Law which "proves" the presence of SIN indwelling.

But this is what I DO NOT wish any longer. This is why I, with Father's Help, will overcome this flesh. And bit by bit, those trees are being thrown down, and burned. If I truly ACCEPT the LOVE Father has for His children, then I will TRUST, that I can perfectly HONOR Him, and not be a sinner of the flesh, nor even have the desire to FALL once more. How can Christians claim to be hopeless sinners, while at the same time claim to be saved, without purification or sanctification of their flesh? Why wait?

My point between you and I as "believers" is that WE are not under the Law pertaining to that lawlessness, but that lawlessness, that SIN INDWELLING that is "NO LONGER I" is and remains UNDER the Law and condemned by that same Law unto condemnation, judgment and eventual eradication. That is a portion of our HOPE and our Promise from our Lord.

So, let me get this straight, if I am reading this correct. You are saying that I am not "under the Law pertaining to that lawlessness", but that sin indwelling in me, is actually under the Law?

So we are basically 2 people right? Flesh and Spirit?

​

We "come out" by the understanding of our DIVISION from those things that are not "us" but are in our flesh and we "overcome" by His Love to us and to ALL mankind.

So we are basically 2 people right? Flesh and Spirit?

Anyone who does not bear the MARK of loving ones neighbors and NOT counting sins against them and denying that the Law is and remains against that sin indwelling or denies they "have" sin remains enslaved and deceived no matter what comes out of their mouths.

So we are basically 2 people right? Flesh and Spirit? And not matter what the flesh is doomed, right, because it sins? Is this what I am reading?

Love fulfills "every" requirement of The Law.

No, Love fulfills EVERYTHING because God IS LOVE.

He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

blue in your quote is mine as I didn't want to cut and paste. I spend too much time doing that.

 

[HisbyAdoption]

So you are free to NOT love God and NOT love neighbor.

Marc

Not by the Law but because He first loved us.. How many times do you have to be told Marc before is finally is settled in your mind. We love Him because He first loved us.. For freely we have been given the Love of God so freely we are to give.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Hi guys. Would you please read this and give me your thoughts. Did i mention that i would like you to please read this. If not well olease read this.

There were two main laws that the bible speaks about. The 10 commandments written by God and the book of the law written by Moses. The book of the law was written by Moses in Deut 31.

Deu 31:24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
Deu 31:25 That Moses commanded the Levites, which bore the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying,
Deu 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

This book of the law was placed on the side of the ark to be a witness against the people. God’s 10 commandments were placed inside the ark (Deut 10: 1–5). The bible therefore shows a difference between the book of the law and God’s 10 commandments. Remember that no man was supposed to touch the ark of the covenant so the 10 commandments remained untouched. The book of the law was took and read before the people when sacrifices were done.

Jos 8:34 And afterward he read all the words of the law, the blessings and cursings, according to all that is written in the book of the la

2Ki 22:8 And Hilkiah the high priest said unto Shaphan the scribe, I have found the book of the law in the house of the LORD. And Hilkiah gave the book to Shaphan, and he read it.

Heb 9:19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,

The 10 commandments could not be removed because they were in the ark. I can’t tell you every single thing that is written in the book of the law but we can see that it included things pertaining to sacrifices. The book of the Law also called Moses Law because he wrote it, it included what a man had to do when he sinned, what type of sacrifices he had to make and what ordinances he had to keep. That Law was what men looked upon for justification from their sins. That law was not a law of love but a law of justification or righteousness. When one sacrifices it is because he wants forgiveness for his sins. The Jews were still following this after Jesus came and Paul was telling them to seek forgiveness through God instead of through the law of Moses.

Act 13:37 But he, whom God raised again, saw no corruption.
Act 13:38 Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins:
Act 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.


The fact is that the law of Moses did not justify anyone but it was God all the way but to the people justification came by doing the deeds of that law. The Jews did not have faith in Jesus and they therefore continued in their offering of sacrifices. This law then is against faith in Jesus because it points to Christ.

Gal 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
Gal 3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
Gal 3:12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Isn’t this book of the law a direct reference to the book of the law that Moses wrote. This does not refer to God’s 10 commandments but the book of the law placed on the side of the ark.
Having faith in Jesus releases us from doing the deeds in the book of the law. That law offered sacrifices and a man who believes that Jesus is his ultimate sacrifice will not be offering sacrifices. Let us say that faith is against God’s commandments then there will be problems.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
1Jo 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
1Jo 2:4 He that saith, I know him (have faith in him), and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

James says that faith without works is dead. On the contrary we see that faith accompanies those who keep the commandments. If you believe in Jesus you will carry out his wishes.


To show that the book of the law was different from the 10 commandments look at this text.

Jos 24:25 So Joshua made a covenant with the people that day, and set them a statute and an ordinance in Shechem.
Jos 24:26 And Joshua wrote these words in the book of the law of God, and took a great stone, and set it up there under an oak, that was by the sanctuary of the LORD.

This was a special book. This book could have contained many things, Moses could have even referenced the commandments in this book. What I am trying to show is that this book of the law was what was nailed to the cross because in it the whole sacrificial system was outlined.

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a show of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of a holy day, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Heb 10:1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
Heb 10:2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshipers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
Heb 10:6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.
Heb 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
Heb 10:8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;

Heb 9:19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,

This law was read from a book before sprinkling blood on the people. The bible clearly states that the book of the law was read from, for no man could touch the 10 commandments in the ark.
Handwriting of ordinances, a witness against us, pointed to sacrifices, isn’t this the book of the Law or Moses law as can be also called.

Lets just examine this scripture.

Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
Rom 10:5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.

Was there a law that was looked upon to make a man righteous? Yes, it was Moses Law, the book of the law contained what a man had to do after he sinned to make him righteous once more. Since Jesus dies on the cross his blood cleanses us from all unrighteousness when we sin so we need not to do any work to make us righteous.

This is getting long so I will end here.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

What are the saints keeping in Revelation 14:12 against taking the mark of the beast? What is one of the characteristics of the remnant of God's true church in Revelation 12:17? What did John say about those who claim to know Jesus in 1 John 2:3,4?

If we do not have love for God or for our neighbours then how can we expect to be saved?

Matthew 7:23
(KJVR) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

(LITV) And then I will declare to them, I never knew you; "depart from Me, those working lawlessness!" Psa. 6:8

(MKJV) And then I will say to them I never knew you! Depart from Me, those working lawlessness!

(RV) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Go ahead and teach people to be lawless. God is calling us to to come to him for cleansing whenever we sin.

1Jo 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jo 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

Jesus dying for our sins does not mean that we can sin and automatically be righteous but it means that his blood will atone for us as long as we come to him and confess. Jesus taught the disciples to pray and included a request for forgiveness in the prayer. When we are in the spirit we are dead to sin. Does that mean that we can never sin. As long as one will keep God's spirit in him and always walk in the spirit then the spirit will not have us to sin. Let us say we are tempted and we yield to that temptation then the devil takes over. You cannot have the spirit of God in you and lift a gun and kill another human being. You cannot have the spirit of God in you and be making images and worshiping them in place of God. That is why when one is in the spirit he is dead to sin. The spirit will not have any man break God's commandments. When one has the spirit he exhibits the fruits of the spirit. A fruit of the spirit is love. When a man has love he will carry out the law because love is the fulfilling of the law. The bible says so.

 

[Cribstyl]

Hi guys. Would you please read this and give me your thoughts. Did i mention that i would like you to please read this. If not well olease read this.

There were two main laws that the bible speaks about. The 10 commandments written by God and the book of the law written by Moses. The book of the law was written by Moses in Deut 31.

Deu 31:24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
Deu 31:25 That Moses commanded the Levites, which bore the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying,
Deu 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

This book of the law was placed on the side of the ark to be a witness against the people. God’s 10 commandments were placed inside the ark (Deut 10: 1–5). The bible therefore shows a difference between the book of the law and God’s 10 commandments. Remember that no man was supposed to touch the ark of the covenant so the 10 commandments remained untouched. The book of the law was took and read before the people when sacrifices were done.

Jos 8:34 And afterward he read all the words of the law, the blessings and cursings, according to all that is written in the book of the la

2Ki 22:8 And Hilkiah the high priest said unto Shaphan the scribe, I have found the book of the law in the house of the LORD. And Hilkiah gave the book to Shaphan, and he read it.

Heb 9:19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,

The 10 commandments could not be removed because they were in the ark. I can’t tell you every single thing that is written in the book of the law but we can see that it included things pertaining to sacrifices. The book of the Law also called Moses Law because he wrote it, it included what a man had to do when he sinned, what type of sacrifices he had to make and what ordinances he had to keep. That Law was what men looked upon for justification from their sins. That law was not a law of love but a law of justification or righteousness. When one sacrifices it is because he wants forgiveness for his sins. The Jews were still following this after Jesus came and Paul was telling them to seek forgiveness through God instead of through the law of Moses.

Act 13:37 But he, whom God raised again, saw no corruption.
Act 13:38 Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins:
Act 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.


The fact is that the law of Moses did not justify anyone but it was God all the way but to the people justification came by doing the deeds of that law. The Jews did not have faith in Jesus and they therefore continued in their offering of sacrifices. This law then is against faith in Jesus because it points to Christ.

Gal 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
Gal 3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
Gal 3:12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Isn’t this book of the law a direct reference to the book of the law that Moses wrote. This does not refer to God’s 10 commandments but the book of the law placed on the side of the ark.
Having faith in Jesus releases us from doing the deeds in the book of the law. That law offered sacrifices and a man who believes that Jesus is his ultimate sacrifice will not be offering sacrifices. Let us say that faith is against God’s commandments then there will be problems.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
1Jo 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
1Jo 2:4 He that saith, I know him (have faith in him), and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

James says that faith without works is dead. On the contrary we see that faith accompanies those who keep the commandments. If you believe in Jesus you will carry out his wishes.


To show that the book of the law was different from the 10 commandments look at this text.

Jos 24:25 So Joshua made a covenant with the people that day, and set them a statute and an ordinance in Shechem.
Jos 24:26 And Joshua wrote these words in the book of the law of God, and took a great stone, and set it up there under an oak, that was by the sanctuary of the LORD.

This was a special book. This book could have contained many things, Moses could have even referenced the commandments in this book. What I am trying to show is that this book of the law was what was nailed to the cross because in it the whole sacrificial system was outlined.

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a show of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of a holy day, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Heb 10:1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
Heb 10:2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshipers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
Heb 10:6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.
Heb 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
Heb 10:8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;

Heb 9:19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,

This law was read from a book before sprinkling blood on the people. The bible clearly states that the book of the law was read from, for no man could touch the 10 commandments in the ark.
Handwriting of ordinances, a witness against us, pointed to sacrifices, isn’t this the book of the Law or Moses law as can be also called.

Lets just examine this scripture.

Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
Rom 10:5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.

Was there a law that was looked upon to make a man righteous? Yes, it was Moses Law, the book of the law contained what a man had to do after he sinned to make him righteous once more. Since Jesus dies on the cross his blood cleanses us from all unrighteousness when we sin so we need not to do any work to make us righteous.

This is getting long so I will end here.

Yea, your post is too long and on many disputable arguments. I wonder why?

The book of the Law contains the ten commandment.

CRIB

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

Not by the Law but because He first loved us.. How many times do you have to be told Marc before is finally is settled in your mind. We love Him because He first loved us.. For freely we have been given the Love of God so freely we are to give.

It's not settled in your mind.

I love Him because He loved me first.

But just because He loved you first doesn't mean that one has to love Him back. All have a choice which is what you fail to understand.

That's why Yeshua said the Greatest commandment is 'love God.' Many people know that God loves them but do they love Him back.

Marc

 

[squint]

He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

blue in your quote is mine as I didn't want to cut and paste. I spend too much time doing that.

The measure of "fulfillment" of the law does not include commiting our fellow man to eternal conscious torment in fire.

If you do not hold to that presentation, then you have done well.

It's all to easy for us "believers" to take all the good and perfect things that Christ has done for "us" whilst simultaneously "withholding" those same things from other people based on various doctrines.

What I struggled with after coming to the realization that Jesus actually IS The Saviour of the world, meaning "all mankind" was the purpose of The Law and the intent of the eternal torment scriptures.

In that I have come to realize that the Law is unto the lawless, THE DEVIL AND HIS MESSENGERS who are clearly shown to be WITH mankind in "our" flesh...

AND

those will receive the penalty of eternal torment.

enjoy!

squint

 

[fritz300]

Mat 5:17 "Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.
Mat 5:18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

Hmm...

Rev 21:1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea.


Quite frankly, chronologically, we are not at nor has Revelation 21:1 been fulfilled...


Therefore, if you are a follower of a Yeshua HaMashiach, the Jewish Messiah that came in the flesh and died for us and rose again, YOUR responsibility is to believe the Word of YHVH from cover to cover... and THIS IS WHAT IT SAYS! END OF STORY!

Are you really going to hold onto your false doctrines and commandments of man over the commandments and true Word of God?!

Unfortunately, this is true for many... but over you I loose and break the blindness, deafness, and chains that hold you. Be free in the name of Yeshua!!!!


1Jn 3:4 Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness.


The Hebraic Word for 'know' is 'YADAH'... which means to know INTIMATELY... as a husband knows his wife... just as we are to know our Lord... He is our bridegroom, and we are supposed to know Him intimately... yadah...


1Jn 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.
1Jn 2:4 He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.


Mat 7:23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'


Mat 25:11 "Afterward the other virgins came also, saying, 'Lord, Lord, open to us!'
Mat 25:12 But he answered and said, 'Assuredly, I say to you, I do not know you.'


COME COME, it is an open invitation to all, come and YADAH the Lamb that was slain before the foundation of the Earth... come and know Him... He is the Torah, come and gaze into His beauty, let Him romance you through the beautiful Torah... understand the marriage covenant we have with our creators!....

Come COME ALL..

Col 2:8 Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ.

Mat 15:3 He answered and said to them, "Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition?

Isa 55:3 Incline your ear, and come to Me. Hear, and your soul shall live; And I will make an everlasting covenant with you— The sure mercies of David.


Regards,
fritz

 

[Tkjjc]

The measure of "fulfillment" of the law does not include commiting our fellow man to eternal conscious torment in fire.

If you do not hold to that presentation, then you have done well.

It's all to easy for us "believers" to take all the good and perfect things that Christ has done for "us" whilst simultaneously "withholding" those same things from other people based on various doctrines.

What I struggled with after coming to the realization that Jesus actually IS The Saviour of the world, meaning "all mankind" was the purpose of The Law and the intent of the eternal torment scriptures.

In that I have come to realize that the Law is unto the lawless, THE DEVIL AND HIS MESSENGERS who are clearly shown to be WITH mankind in "our" flesh...

AND

those will receive the penalty of eternal torment.

enjoy!

squint

Yes, I too hold the opinion of ALL will be saved, except for those who place Anti-Christ above Christ after receiving the Truth. I can surely see this happening today, as they are everywhere.

But, how about my question. Do you believe that we are in fact 2 bodies within one? Flesh, and spirit?

 

[Tkjjc]

doubled

 

[Tkjjc]

COME COME, it is an open invitation to all, come and YADAH the Lamb that was slain before the foundation of the Earth... come and know Him... He is the Torah, come and gaze into His beauty, let Him romance you through the beautiful Torah... understand the marriage covenant we have with our creators!....

Come COME ALL..

Col 2:8 Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ.

Mat 15:3 He answered and said to them, "Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition?


Regards,
fritz

And you keep them? ALL of them? The whole Torah?

 

[Tkjjc]

Jesus came to save us from our sin. He became Sin so that we could become the righteousness of Him.. All humans are born into sin. Except Christ for He alone was sinless.. He alone was not born of a Human father..This is why Christ could come and die for the Sins of His people. We may not be held accountable for what our Father did such as murder someone.. But we sure are responsible for the sins that we commit because we are all born slaves to Sin.. We sin because we are born sinners. We do not become sinners because we sin..

He became Sin so that we could become the righteousness of Him.

Huh? That sounded so not even funny. Jesus became sin? Where anywhere does it say that?

All humans are born into sin. We sin because we are born sinners.

Show me doctrines to support this please

We do not become sinners because we sin..

Actually this makes the most sense and you dismiss it as fact.

 

[holo]

I can't believe I have to answer the same question over and over and over and over...

So are you dead to the Greatest commandment love God and the second greatest love neighbor? Or does that only apply to Jews under the old covenant and not you?

Yes. Ja. Da. Si. Positive. Correct.

Did you by any chance possibly get my answer this time?

I, holo, hereby solemnly declare, once again and once and for all, that NO, I am NOT under the law. I am not under neither the greatest nor the least commandment in the mosaic law.

This is the last time I'm answering this question.

He is dead to the law is released from the penalty.

Look at Romans 7:1-3. This scripture shows that how a woman is released from the law and bound by the law. If the woman marries while her husband still lives she's an adulteress which is death. If she marries when her husband dies then she is released from the law of her husband and she is released from the death.

And what relationship does she have with her husband when he's dead? Is she released from the "penalty" or is she released from the entire marriage and all it entails? How is she still "under" her dead husband?