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Is that what you think the message of the Cross is ?
So it seems that I don't understand what the message of the Cross is, oh my! ... I can just go by what "Christians" tell me it is.
So how about you tell me what you think it is, pretty please?
What do I, personally, think the "message of the cross" is? You are asking me that, an atheist? Really??What do you think it is ?
I find it interesting that on a Christian site, a Christian is unwilling or unable to answer a direct question regarding the Christian message.I find it interesting that a Christian site uses Atheist personas for post count building. Such a shame.
....I will ask for a last time: what do you think this message is, that, if I understood it correctly (which I obviously haven't, because you, the one who does understand it correctly won't tell me) would make me think it is "offensive",.
And here is the thing that really really offends me: the sacrimonious, self-righteous stance of (some) Christians.Whether you understand the message, or not, your behaviour proves that the message is offensive, to you.
The offence of the Cross is self evident to you, it seems.
What do you think it is ?
I find it interesting that a Christian site uses Atheist personas for post count building. Such a shame.
I am getting tired of reading the "people with other religions" arguments. Of course they are, but we have to understand people. Yes, we all believe in God, Jews, Christians, Muslims or Dharma followers, but we believe in Him in different manners. This is because we are sinners and we get lost, we follow the wrong paths, when people get lost they find their own way, but there is only one exit: God! People trying to look for God is something very good, it is bad if they don't look for Him, every studied path or religion has it's own truth but blessed be the man who finds the fullness of the truth.
Atheists often argue with believers: "If you have so many faiths (even in Christianity) then it means there is no God because everyone sees Him in His own manner".
But they don't consider the fact that people looking for something always take different paths, they get to the right path only when they feel the proximity of That Whom they look for, if we feel God as we should then we will be on the right faith. I am very blessed of being an Estern Orthodox.
Every faith in this world show that we are trying to find an exit, a way out, that we are trying to find God, the fountain of life. Only the lack of faith, the atheism fails into trying to find the exit, the way out, because the lack of faith, atheism is a failure. A failure that means sorrow. Atheists don't understand that sin is the supreme sadness and they die within this sin. They try to find the way out, the exit but not from sin, but from secundary things: poverty, physical suffering, etc... Only because someone got away from poverty, for example, it doesn't mean they are happy, just look at most of the "superstars" today, they are lost in drugs, sex, alcohol, lust and poor behaviour, what kind of happiness is this? No kind, this is eternal death, the true happiness is only at God.
Countless people are living happily without religion, so this statement appears to be false on the face of it. Religion is not a prerequisite to happiness.
Atheists often argue with believers: "If you have so many faiths (even in Christianity) then it means there is no God because everyone sees Him in His own manner".
Every faith in this world show that we are trying to find an exit, a way out, that we are trying to find God, the fountain of life. Only the lack of faith, the atheism fails into trying to find the exit, the way out, because the lack of faith, atheism is a failure.
Atheists don't understand that sin is the supreme sadness and they die within this sin.
They try to find the way out, the exit but not from sin, but from secundary things: poverty, physical suffering, etc...
Only because someone got away from poverty, for example, it doesn't mean they are happy, just look at most of the "superstars" today, they are lost in drugs, sex, alcohol, lust and poor behaviour, what kind of happiness is this?
No kind, this is eternal death, the true happiness is only at God.
I am getting tired of reading the "people with other religions" arguments.
This is because we are sinners and we get lost, we follow the wrong paths
People trying to look for God is something very good, it is bad if they don't look for Him
every studied path or religion has it's own truth but blessed be the man who finds the fullness of the truth.
Atheists often argue with believers
"If you have so many faiths (even in Christianity) then it means there is no God because everyone sees Him in His own manner"
Every faith in this world show that we are trying to find an exit, a way out, that we are trying to find God, the fountain of life.
the atheism fails into trying to find the exit
atheism is a failure
A failure that means sorrow.
Atheists don't understand that sin is the supreme sadness and they die within this sin.
They try to find the way out, the exit but not from sin, but from secundary things: poverty, physical suffering, etc.
nly because someone got away from poverty, for example, it doesn't mean they are happy, just look at most of the "superstars" today, they are lost in drugs, sex, alcohol, lust and poor behaviour, what kind of happiness is this?
No kind, this is eternal death, the true happiness is only at God.
...
I stated how this message - in whatever form - is often used to shame, browbeat and diminish unbelievers. I said, several times, that this was what I consider "offensive"....
And thus the blinders go up again, not being able to understand other persons, the Christians retreat into "I know exactly what you think" position again.
Would you rather only have professed Christians on this site? You do know, there are Christian only parts of this site, where atheists can not post?
This may be true, but you won't have found me in the vicious theology debates, for a specific reason. In saying this Bhsmte it has come time for me to move on, and redeem the time in other matters. I've appreciated our contact and discussions and wish you well in whatever your time brings.And by the way, some of the most vicious debates on this site, are between Christians debating theology, not between non believers and Christians.
My own opinion.It's good that you're offended by the Message of the Cross, whichever form it takes to you.
I don't know what you think the message of the Cross is, because you haven't told me.
What about that is not religion?Fair question Davian, but if I may I'd like to clarify the analogy and it's elements as I intend them, first.
1. Yes life is the boat.
2. The lifeboat is Yahweh ( not my religion or anyone else's ), and the Blood of Christ guarantees its safe passage.
You are trying to sell me this lifeboat, and I have to take your hand-waving assurances that it even exists? What is it made of? Where was it made? Is it powered by perpetual motion machines, so that it never needs refuelling, repair, or maintenance? Does it have that high-tech paint that makes it invisible but plainly seen?The resurrection and judgement is future, and this naturarlly implies that we can't test nor see it, until it happens aside from the Biblical accounts of Jesus' death and resurrection. Jesus resurrection also doesn't clearly show us the judgement, but simply Yahweh's ability to raise the dead.
Or, an exercise in self-deception. That would correlate with all of the evidence at hand.To accept that the resurrection is true you will need to believe God exists and search for Him, then He will help you find Him and He will reveal to you the ceratinty of His lifeboat ( any many other things ). You will come to trust Him and His methods of revelation because your own experiences will be congruent and be validated by both personal experiences and revelation and scripture if necessary. This becomes experential faith.
Indeed, like how gullible I am, or not.Also you will find some surprising things about yourself, that you likely do not currently know.
My own opinion.
What I get from Christians.
What I am offended about in regard the Christians 'spreading' the 'message of the cross' (though in your case, it is rather hiding it)
What I am offended about right now in regard to... you
It takes quite a lot of effort to get so many things wrong in the two short statements you made. So much effort that I do not think this was an accident.
You know what people are called who deliberately tell untruths about others. You know what your own religion says about this behaviour.
You should reconsider your approach.
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