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Would you prefer it if “Christian universalism” were true?

Cormack

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Yes and Yes, and I think I just maybe told you guys the correct one maybe, etc...

Excuse me if I’ve missed it, but do you believe in a literal fire that burns people up without consuming them, and that happens forever?
 
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Cormack

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Thank you. I’m meaning to ask about your views though, @Neogaia777. Not your views as seen through a set of verses but rather your views in plain English. For the sake of conversation and clarity.

Do you believe the fires are literal and that they consume people forever?
 
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Neogaia777

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Excuse me if I’ve missed it, but do you believe in a literal fire that burns people up without consuming them, and that happens forever?
No, no literal fire, etc...

Not in our still as of yet right now still limited conceptualizations of what is "literally literal" right now currently anyway, etc...

Because Heaven might have a different take or view, etc...

We might all be "walking burning bushes" to them right now maybe, etc, from they're perspective or view from "up there", to "down here" maybe, etc...

God Bless!
 
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Neogaia777

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See above post.

God Bless!
 
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Cormack

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Because Heaven might have a different take or view, etc...

Doesn’t that proviso make it very hard to have a proper orthodox understanding of hell? Your view on the subject seems to paint hell as being a feeling of loss, or upset or self inflicted torment.

Has that been the majority view on hell throughout the ages?
 
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Neogaia777

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Doesn’t that proviso make it very hard to have a proper orthodox understanding of hell?

I care very little about that, etc...

Your view on the subject seems to paint hell as being a feeling of loss, or upset or self inflicted torment.

"Separation" (and in this case "eternal separation forever maybe") and it's "results" maybe...

It is my belief that a lot of people in this world, and who belong to the world, are very very much more miserable in this world than they maybe fully right now know, or maybe fully realize yet, etc, and it goes way, way beyond just simple feelings of just simple loss, or just mild depression/loneliness or upset, etc...

And not really "self-inflicted", or self chosen/determined, but "predestined", or already predetermined maybe, etc...

Has that been the majority view on hell throughout the ages?

As far as I know, this is not a majority view at all yet, because I don't even know if anyone else has even proposed it yet, etc...

God Bless!
 
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zoidar

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You're a good guy. I like you and appreciate your openness to at least discuss it. Thanks.

And my grandfather was from Sweden. So you get extra credit for being Swedish. - lol

Maybe we are relatives.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Don't want to see the Eastern Othodox view of salvation eh? UR doesn't say there isn't hell. It just says it isn't what they consider to be a pointless everlasting torture chamber with billions of souls screaming in agony forever.

It’s my understanding that apocatastasis isn’t an official doctrine and the church is somewhat divided on this particular topic. So are you going to hold one side’s perspective over another’s?
 
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ozso

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It’s my understanding that apocatastasis isn’t an official doctrine and the church is somewhat divided on this particular topic. So are you going to hold one side’s perspective over another’s?

I was talking about this:


Now the Orthodox view of salvation in chairs isn't UR per se, but it was introduced to me by a UR proponent who greatly appreciated it.
 
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Clare73

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All that stuff gets argued about on CF because of different interpretations, doctrine and dogmas. Many are quite certain that their interpretation and dogma is the only absolutely correct one. Perfectly adheres to scripture and so on.
Non-responsive. . .
 
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Clare73

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That pales considerably in comparison to the doctrine of eternal torment.
And?
That's not his characterization of God, it's the characterization of God he perceives coming from damnationists, and he objects to it.
As I object to his characterization.
 
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BNR32FAN

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I was talking about this:


Now the Orthodox view of salvation in chairs isn't UR per se, but it was introduced to me by a UR proponent who greatly appreciated it.

This priests theory is irrelevant. I wish the video allowed comments so I could ask him how this would not contradict Matthew 7:21-23. As I said before the EOC doesn’t have an official doctrine on the subject because it is not clearly defined in the scriptures.
 
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BNR32FAN

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That's ridiculous. I trust God just fine.
And I understand him well enough to know that the standard view is wrong.



Right here you are saying that if God’s plan is eternal punishment in the lake of fire you disapprove of this plan. What I’m saying is that if that is in fact God’s plan then I have to trust by knowing His character that He has a reason for this that I do not understand. That’s what I mean by trusting in God.
 
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ozso

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I doubt he and Fr. Carbo would be calling it the Orthodox view of salvation, if it wasn't so. And likewise I doubt Brad Jersak who did the first version posted, would be on such good terms with Archbishop Lazar if the chairs presentation misrepresented Orthodoxy.
 
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ozso

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I'm pretty sure Steve feels quite certain that isn't God's plan. No ifs about it.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Im sorry but what your adding to Matthew 7:21 directly contradicts what Jesus said so I can’t accept that as a possibility. As for Matthew 21:31 I don’t see that as meaning that the Pharisees will enter Heaven after tax collectors and prostitutes. If I said I would let ISIS into my house before I let you into my house that doesn’t mean that I’m going to let ISIS or you into my house at any point in time. What it means is that you are worse than these people who I would not let into my house. And as for Philippians 2:10-11 this is irrelevant according to Matthew 7:21.
 
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