Witches, wizards and the occult

BookofMatt

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The underlying idea of Harry Potter? Seriously? Did you even read Harry Potter? Hmmm...
:confused: I'm going to say no, you did not. Not with any attentiveness or in a meaningful way, at least.

Now, in all fairness, Goodbook is speaking purely out of the best of intentions. She believes in what she feels is right in the eyes of the Lord. Yes, quite frequently she says rather questionable things of dubious veracity and can make for rather frustrating one-sided conversation, but her opinions aren't hurting anyone. She's not even the worst of the "Harry Potter promotes witchcraft" crowd: at least she's not burning books or anything.

I say this only because I don't want this thread devolving into a fight, having just read her C. S. Lewis thread which had a few people brazenly insulting her. Hopefully I didn't cross a line of condescension myself expressing my confusion towards a few of her statements on the first page, but this post is starting to sound a little aggressive, even if Cearbhall didn't intend it that way. Really, the best (and ultimately only) course of action is to just accept that you won't be able to change her mind, because she's nothing if not ideologically tenacious.
 
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Ada Lovelace

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Why?
Did he cast a spell on you or something?
I wouldn't ask my teacher to marry me lol. That would just be...weird.

Of course I wouldn't actually ask my teacher to marry me, especially after attending his wedding to his lovely bride. :) It was merely a figure of speech to express how charmed I was that he had butterbeer at his reception as a subtle way of incorporating his appreciation of Harry Potter into his special day. For him the books have given him both personal joy as a reader and professional delight because he's witnessed how it encouraged so many kids over the years to become readers and stimulated their creativity. It also helped to form social bonds because it was something kids could share their enthusiasm for with one another.
 
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Goodbook

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Oh ok. Charm...is deceitful...

I dunno I just saw a lot of damage that kind of thing does and it starts young with the witchcraft I mean, not the reading. Reading im all for...if you go on to read better things, not spend your life absorbed in witchcraft, fiction and that kind of thing.

People do say. Well at least people are reading but its like, with junk food at least kids are eating, but they arent eating food that is good for them...
 
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MehGuy

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im disturbed by the fascination that christians seem to have with the occult on this forum.
I'm sorry but I dont want anything to do with it.

I know the fad for harry potter etc is over, but I do not get why many ppl would want to read or watch or play games associated with the occcult and listen to witches and wizards. Jesus does not want us in bondage and darkness.

He brought me out of that snare.

Perhaps because it provides a wider spectrum of spiritual experiences?

Other than the lack of evidence, I think the rising level of the irreligious is because mainstream religions are so boring and uninspired.
 
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Goodbook

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I wouldnt call witchcraft 'creative' i would say its actually dangerous because it encourages people to live a lie.

But you know...people think just cos its a story and made up that its great. But actually truth can tell you so much more than fiction.

I just spent so much time with fiction addicted ppl at the library that by the end of it I was throughly sick of it. But thats just me. Dont get me started on those horrible vampire novels.
 
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MehGuy

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I wouldnt call witchcraft 'creative' i would say its actually dangerous because it encourages people to live a lie.

But you know...people think just cos its a story and made up that its great. But actually truth can tell you so much more than fiction.

I just spent so much time with fiction addicted ppl at the library that by the end of it I was throughly sick of it. But thats just me. Dont get me started on those horrible vampire novels.

I think it inspires spiritual people with the notion that there are other ways..
 
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MehGuy

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As far as witchcraft and Harry Potter is concerned they were forbidden.

I even felt too guilty to watch them at friend's houses.

Although now as an adult I consider myself an extreme liberal.. so see how well that upbringing turned out. Lol.
 
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Ada Lovelace

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Oh ok. Charm...is deceitful...

I dunno I just saw a lot of damage that kind of thing does and it starts young with the witchcraft I mean, not the reading. Reading im all for...if you go on to read better things, not spend your life absorbed in witchcraft, fiction and that kind of thing.

People do say. Well at least people are reading but its like, with junk food at least kids are eating, but they arent eating food that is good for them...

Charm can be deceitful, but it can also be delightful. In that context it was the latter rather than the former. I was joyed. My former teacher has gratitude for Harry Potter because of his 15+ years of teaching middle schoolers and seeing the benefit it's had for so many of his students. He teaches at a school for gifted kids, many of whom have challenges socializing with their peers. Year after year Harry Potter formed a social bridge helping his students to make connections because reading it was a shared hobby. He would disagree with your sentiments about the series being analogous to junk food or any other way detrimental. Most of the kids who love Harry Potter are not obsessed with it and have healthy balance in their life.

What fictional books were enjoyable and beneficial for you as a preteen, Goodbook? What substitutes would you suggest for a series like Harry Potter?
 
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Cearbhall

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like, ppl get so excited over stuff like Lord of the Rings, Star wars, game of thrones etc but I think...meh. Jesus is my Lord and Saviour, so why bother with other stuff that ppl have made up out of their own imaginations and follow after other gods?
Reading im all for...if you go on to read better things, not spend your life absorbed in witchcraft, fiction and that kind of thing.
Am I understanding correctly that you have a problem with fiction in general?
 
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Noxot

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stories have been part of humanity for a long time.

as for occultism... well science is using it pretty significantly and no one complains that they have AC or can microwave their food or blend up foods into smoothies. to me occultism seems to in part be understanding obscure* things about reality such as psychology or how to make different kinds of steels. all I know is that there is no end to the annoyance of people confusing christian mysticism with occultism. occultism seeks power and compared to Gods love, the desire for power is pathetic and empty. or occultism might understand a little bit deeper about the nature of reality but everyday we participate in reality regardless of how aware we are of all the things going on with it.

fiction can be good or bad. reading the bible can be good or bad. going to school can be good or bad. ect. it depends a lot on the condition of the person and other factors.
 
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Noxot

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you can't escape from the occult because it is part of reality. if you really wanna be concerned over the occult then be concerned over all the terrible music being played in the world. everything affects us more than we might think it would. spirits are just a natural part of reality. there are good ones and there are bad ones. the angels work for the building up of human beings, one would not call them evil!

i choose to not give the devil so much power because I know his power is 'to lie'. I understand that there are risk in reality. if I am evil then I will reap what i sow. I think that most people are concerned over evil spirits so much because they don't have enough confidence in God. I mean that I would rather be concerned with God than to concern myself with the devil.

well they are all here in our world to tempt us. when you wanna hate someone, that is a demon. or think wrong things about someone, that is a demon. there is certainly a concern we must have but we must not exalt the evil as something great and powerful. the nature of being is goodness and evil is a falling away from such. evil is sloth, is boredom, is unfulfillment. it's not worth having and that is why God does not approve of us being it.
 
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Miss Spaulding

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Am I understanding correctly that you have a problem with fiction in general?

Right. I think discussion needs to not revolve so much around 'Harry Potter' but in general sense, around writings/films or any sort of entertainment that involves magic, fantasy, the occult, ect. Because the issue GB has with this subject clearly goes beyond HP.

 
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ViaCrucis

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Oh ok. Charm...is deceitful...

I dunno I just saw a lot of damage that kind of thing does and it starts young with the witchcraft I mean, not the reading. Reading im all for...if you go on to read better things, not spend your life absorbed in witchcraft, fiction and that kind of thing.

People do say. Well at least people are reading but its like, with junk food at least kids are eating, but they arent eating food that is good for them...

Here's the thing the "magic" in works of fantasy fiction is just that--fantasy. It doesn't exist in the real world. Wiccans, Neo-Pagans, and people involved in "the occult" don't have magical powers where they can fling fireballs or shoot beams of lightning from sticks.

So treating fantasy magic as though it can get people "into the occult" is just a little bizarre. If someone has a healthy ability to differentiate between fantasy and reality then there's no problem. And if someone does have a problem differentiating between fantasy and reality then the problem isn't the "magic" in fantasy, that's symptomatic of a much deeper psychological problem that needs to be addressed.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Citanul

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Plus J. K. Rowling, herself a practicing Anglican, said it best: "I believe in God, not in magic". She's pretty much made a secondary career out of having to address this topic in interviews.

Ah, but don't you know? Because she writes about magic, she can't be a True Christian (TM).
 
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Gnarwhal

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People enjoy the fantasy genre because it often draws discernible parallels to the spiritual realities of the world we live in. I had an aversion to Harry Potter for years because a "pastor" tried to illustrate a difference between HP and LOTR, citing that the former sought power while the latter's characters knew they weren't meant to wield that kind of power and tried to rid themselves of it.

I absolutely love LOTR, it remains the greatest body of literature this side of Dante or Shakespeare in my opinion. I always think that at least in the context of the 21st century, Harry Potter is well-written, extremely well-developed and wonderfully engrossing.

My final point is though, that aside from little kids pretending they're wizards the same way they pretend they're cops or cowboys or superman, nobody is going from reading/watching Harry Potter to actively (or passively for that matter) participating in the occult. Nobody takes the Harry Potter narrative and thinks, "hey that's not so bad, I can go ahead and practice witchcraft with no risk to myself." It's a work of fiction. We all recognize it as such and can therefore handle it safely.

Really, aside from plain disinterest, a work of literature or cinematic art should only be avoided if it's poorly made. My sister is the most avid reader I know and she gives everything a shot, back when the Twilight frenzy was at it's peak she tried to read the first book but had to give up because it was a linguistic and grammatical abortion. That's an example of fiction to avoid on principle.
 
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Goodbook

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Im just interested in what God thinks and He does say to stay away from that stuff. He doesnt like it and its unnecessary.

That people are fascinated shows what a spell enchanters and diviners and witches and wizards cast over people, its actually seducing spirits behind it all.
I dont think Gods mind has changed about that and when people invite them in by opening doorways to the occult then wonder why their life isnt turning out right, that could be the reason.

In the book of acts they burned occult books. Also Peter I think it was cast demons out of a girl who was into divination.
 
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