Wicca - Good or Evil

[light-bringer]

Not really hard to believe that you can communicate with animals. It seems interesting.

 

[SquareC]

Oh my. It's no wonder you believe in Paganism if you can believe this kind of nonsense...

It is a PROVEN FACT that in it's absorption of the followers of other religions, Christianity adopted many of the spiritual figures of the religion in question as Saints. St. Brigid comes to mind right off the top of my head, I would have to go look up specifics to list more.

 

[bt_st_At]

It is a PROVEN FACT that in it's absorption of the followers of other religions, Christianity adopted many of the spiritual figures of the religion in question as Saints. St. Brigid comes to mind right off the top of my head, I would have to go look up specifics to list more.

Not only that but so much more. Christians have adopted most of the Pagan Sabbats if not all of them.

And most things in magick are becoming more understood as science advances in fact some of the things we have taught from generation to generation; such as all things being in one place all the time (which explains manifestation) is being proved via Quatum Mechanics. And Einsten proved our belief that time is not Lateral it is all at once (the past is now, now is now, and the future is now) What do the Christians have that can be explained by more then a book and faith?....Not much that's for sure. Not only do I have faith in my religion that it works and that I'm going the right way I have proof that it works and that I am going the right way...If you notice most Pagans aren't stuck up, grotchy, rude, or as uninformed as Christians are, why is that? All I know is I'm happy and the majority are happy.

I would have to say Christians have said enough. They have brought sin to every corner of the world. They have destroyed entire cultures. And still they believe they are the only truth. Open your eyes...Next thing you know they'll be thinking we are alone in the universe just to show us how closeminded they are.

 

[Starcrystal]

You know I've been reading some prophecies by a Christian friend of mine and it seems the "pagans" will probably recognize Jesus when he returns more than the institutional church people. Pagans are open to spiritual phenomenon and visions, can communicate with the spirit world, and can recognize a spirit manifestation without question. Too many "christians" claim to know it all and expect Jesus to be either this or that. The Bible says Jesus will come in a way unexpected, like a theif in the night. It says most in the church wont recognize him, but other people you wouldn't expect to would know who he is.

God chose the most unlikely people in Jesus day: a prophet dressed in camel skins to introduce the messiah ~ He was wearing the skins of an animal that was considered "unclean" by the jewish religion. Jesus also chose a woman who had 5 husbands and was with a dude who wasn't her husband (John 4) In that day she had 2 things against her: she was a woman in a patriarchal society, and she was considered an adulteress.... yet thats who God decided to choose. I could go on and on.

I beleive pagans, including Wiccans will recognize Jesus at his return, while most in the churches will think he's a "demon" or some alien or false prophet. The pagans will enter the kingdom of God before the so called "righteous" church people, simply because pagans KNOW things of the spirit, while churchy people know only tradition and head knowledge, which does not begin to equal true experience.

For these reasons and more I do not judge pagans nor do I try to slam scriptures down your throats about hell. I'm afraid those who do such things might need to apply such a judgement to themselves.

Blessed be & amen!

 

[Lifesaver]

It is a PROVEN FACT that in it's absorption of the followers of other religions, Christianity adopted many of the spiritual figures of the religion in question as Saints. St. Brigid comes to mind right off the top of my head, I would have to go look up specifics to list more.

St. Brigid? Let's go to specifics about her.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02784b.htm

Doesn't seem like a Pagan goddess to me...

 

[Lifesaver]

You know I've been reading some prophecies by a Christian friend of mine and it seems the "pagans" will probably recognize Jesus when he returns more than the institutional church people. Pagans are open to spiritual phenomenon and visions, can communicate with the spirit world, and can recognize a spirit manifestation without question.

The spirit world?
Do you think the soul of the dead are roaming around? I hope not.

You should know that the only kind of spiritual creatures is angels. They can be good or evil (we call them demons, then).

If the spiritual being does not reveal himself as an angel, servant of God, it's a demon.

And people who communicate with demons will more promptly recognize Jesus when He comes? Perhaps you are right...

 

[SquareC]

St. Brigid? Let's go to specifics about her.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02784b.htm

Doesn't seem like a Pagan goddess to me...

Really? http://www.sxws.com/charis/brigit.htm

The base site is Christian: http://www.sxws.com/charis/

From the words of the Catholic Encyclopedia:

"We need not shrink from admitting that candles, like incense and lustral water, were commonly employed in pagan worship and in the rites paid to the dead. But the Church from a very early period took them into her service, just as she adopted many other things indifferent in themselves, which seemed proper to enhance the splendour of religious ceremonial" (Catholic Encyclopedia, copyright © 1913 by the Encyclopedia Press, Inc. Electronic version copyright © 1996 by New Advent, Inc.)

I don't go to biased websites to find MY data. It would have been easy to go to a Pagan-biased site and find it, just like you went to a Christian-biased site for yours. I'd rather get objective sources or even Christian sources for my proof...

 

[Heathen Dawn]

You should know that the only kind of spiritual creatures is angels. They can be good or evil (we call them demons, then).

To demonstrate that your ecclesiastical authorities are just as ignorant of spiritual things as they are of material ones. There are many kinds of spiritual creatures: people who have passed away, angels, elemental spirits (sylphs, salamanders, undines and gnomes) and others.

If the spiritual being does not reveal himself as an angel, servant of God, it's a demon.

What good would revealing itself do, since your scriptures say Satan can disguise himself as an angel of light? That, by the way, means the Christian can never have assurance that his own experiences are not satanic deceptions. Talk about falling in the pit you’ve dug yourselves!

 

[Crispie]

Actually there is other spiritual beings, in revelations it talks about strange beasts that go around torturing people and so forth. And an angel can reviel himself as anything, but that wont change anything.

 

[Crispie]

Oh and Light-Bringer, that piglet avatar is adorable

 

[God_of_Mercy]

cute lil piglet

so adorable

 

[Lifesaver]

Really? http://www.sxws.com/charis/brigit.htm

"Roman Church"?
Lady of Guadalupe an Aztec Goddess (has this guy ever even seen her?)
St. Michael Archangel (of whom we are told in the Bible) a German god (post-biblical)?

That site is very ignorant, and the fact that he cites NO sources comes as no surprise...

*reads a little further*

Ah, the site, conveniently called Lazyboy's (and he has indeed been lazy, both in research and in covering up his true intentions) is an anti-Catholic site pretending to be a Catholic site (using Catholic art and Medieval theme).

The more like the Catholic Church a group is, the more Christian they are. This site employs deceit (a practice condemned by the Church) and hates Her, spreading lies as the ones quoted above. Therefore...

Your "Christian" source, SquareC, provides no sources at all and is called Lazyboy's. Is that what you have to show?

From the words of the Catholic Encyclopedia

Yes, liturgical elements. Of course they had a Pagan origin.
As for saints, it seems you'll just have to admit you were wrong.

I don't go to biased websites to find MY data. It would have been easy to go to a Pagan-biased site and find it, just like you went to a Christian-biased site for yours. I'd rather get objective sources or even Christian sources for my proof...

A shameful piece of protestant anti-Catholic propaganda, with absolutely NO sources. While mine presents a detailed and honest account, being so honest as to inform us, as you read with your own eyes, that some liturgical elements have Pagan origins.
And yet you accuse me of bias... Please!

By all means, go to Pagan sites if you think they'll have something true. But if they are as pitiful as the "Christian" site you went, you needn't bother sharing their information with us.

 

[CaDan]

The spirit world?
Do you think the soul of the dead are roaming around? I hope not.

/me looks all around

You go away dead people! This ice cream ain't for you! This ice cream is for real live people! You go back to heaven or wherever and get your own ice cream!

Dead people! Always after the ice cream, but I make sure they don't get none!

 

[Lifesaver]

To demonstrate that your ecclesiastical authorities are just as ignorant of spiritual things as they are of material ones. There are many kinds of spiritual creatures: people who have passed away, angels, elemental spirits (sylphs, salamanders, undines and gnomes) and others.

And I was sure salamanders were small amphibians.

As for the other three, they are creations of fairy tales, not a part of reality.

...Gnomes?! Come on!

What good would revealing itself do, since your scriptures say Satan can disguise himself as an angel of light? That, by the way, means the Christian can never have assurance that his own experiences are not satanic deceptions. Talk about falling in the pit you’ve dug yourselves!

That is why the Church is so important. Indeed, for someone who has no respect for ecclesiastical authorities, it is completely impossible to tell one from the other. That is why so many people end up serial killing "in the name of God" nowadays (those who didn't do it for schizophrenia or other mental disorder, of course): people have no respect for the authorities, and think their "personal interpretation" is the truth.

 

[Crispie]

Lifesaver, settle down, take a gander at that piggylet

 

[light-bringer]

Oh and Light-Bringer, that piglet avatar is adorable

Thank you


Blessings.

 

[bt_st_At]

And I was sure salamanders were small amphibians.

As for the other three, they are creations of fairy tales, not a part of reality.

...Gnomes?! Come on!


That is why the Church is so important. Indeed, for someone who has no respect for ecclesiastical authorities, it is completely impossible to tell one from the other. That is why so many people end up serial killing "in the name of God" nowadays (those who didn't do it for schizophrenia or other mental disorder, of course): people have no respect for the authorities, and think their "personal interpretation" is the truth.

And whats to say that your god and angels are not from fairy tales as all the other Gods, Goddesses and mythical beings that have roamed are world since the beginning of time? How do we know that Christianity is not some fashion that will go out of style in a couple of hundred years to be filled by a new relgion as was the case with the Pagans, the Greeks, the Indians, the Celts?

Stop acting like you know everything; closing your eyes and ears, like a fool and not taking in the changing world around you.

As for your bit on authorities they are as hopeless as you are if they are anything like you. Ignorant and cold to anyone who might try to help them be more tolerant of others.

Blessed Be

 

[Heathen Dawn]

And I was sure salamanders were small amphibians.

The small amphibians are named after the fire spirits.

As for the other three, they are creations of fairy tales, not a part of reality.

You sound like an atheist when you say that.

...Gnomes?! Come on!

Not your elf-like garden gnomes, nor even the bald creatures in Harry Potter.

Sylphs: air spirits.
Salamanders: fire spirits.
Undines: water spirits.
Gnomes: earth spirits.

That is why the Church is so important. Indeed, for someone who has no respect for ecclesiastical authorities, it is completely impossible to tell one from the other.

I don’t need the Church to tell good from evil, I know it when I see it. I see a religion promising eternal hell for all those outside its pale, I know it’s evil. I see a religion inducing people to fly planes into office buildings, I know it’s evil.

That is why so many people end up serial killing "in the name of God" nowadays (those who didn't do it for schizophrenia or other mental disorder, of course): people have no respect for the authorities, and think their "personal interpretation" is the truth.

Killing in the name of God happens when man becomes machine, obeying God blindly as a computer executes its programs. It is this, hyperrespect for the authorities, which underlies genocides, crusades, inquisitions and other atrocities. Remember Abraham, how he was ready to slaughter his son? That was obedience overcoming morality. It was not Adam and Eve that fell but Abraham that fell.

 

[Lifesaver]

God a product of fairy tales? It doesn't seem probable, as His existence is demonstrable.
http://www.newadvent.org/summa/100203.htm

By the way, do you think we should be "tolerant" of others? Tolerate their errors?
Jesus Christ certainly disagreed, since He called pharisees of "vipers", rebuked people and expelled the tradesmen from the temple.
It seems the modernist legion of tolerance, when asked who they want to free, would choose the tolerant Barrabas over the intolerant Jesus Christ.

 

[Lifesaver]

The small amphibians are named after the fire spirits.

Fire spirits, is it? Fascinating...

You sound like an atheist when you say that.

I deplore the fact that the use of reason has been hijacked by atheists...

Sylphs: air spirits.
Salamanders: fire spirits.
Undines: water spirits.
Gnomes: earth spirits.

I see. And what about Smurves, the flower spirits? Don't they exist as well?

I don’t need the Church to tell good from evil, I know it when I see it. I see a religion promising eternal hell for all those outside its pale, I know it’s evil. I see a religion inducing people to fly planes into office buildings, I know it’s evil.

If one dislikes good, if one dislikes truth, they'll be forever separated from them, with all that that carries with it.
God would be evil if He did not give us the option of separation, for Heaven is totally unbearable for the soul that hates God.

Killing in the name of God happens when man becomes machine, obeying God blindly as a computer executes its programs. It is this, hyperrespect for the authorities, which underlies genocides, crusades, inquisitions and other atrocities. Remember Abraham, how he was ready to slaughter his son? That was obedience overcoming morality. It was not Adam and Eve that fell but Abraham that fell.

If one puts the earthly life of their relatives above God, do they really love Him the way they ought to?

And it is no wonder that Neo-Pagans admire Adam; afterall, pride, rebellion, independence and revolt are all upheld by modernists.