Why would satan crucify Jesus?

[Aseyesee]

But God didn't create Satan... he created Lucifer... Satan was never meant to be at all.

So you believe God could not see the end result of his own actions?

Don't you think Jesus knew why he chose Judas, or that it was a strange thing he was put in charge of the money bag?

Now you must question why he would plant a tree you could not eat of knowing very well that you would.

 

[zoidar]

God could see it, but didn't choose it.

Jesus didn't choose Judas so he could betray him, but he knew he would.

The tree, giving us the choice, free will. Knowing is not choosing.

You make it sound like everything is a big scheme planned by God. It isn't. God knows what's going to happen and take measures accordingly.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

YHWH appointed the one who would betray Y'SHUA MESSIAH.
Perfectly.
With Complete Knowledge and Directing all that happened.

Y'SHUA was CRUCIFIED BEFORE the beginning of the world.
We who are appointed in Him were crucified with Him !
(YHWH accomplished this all)

YHWH and Y'SHUA know everyone TODAY who will betray Jesus.
AND who won't.

 

[zoidar]

Jesus answered them, “Did I Myself not choose you, the twelve, and yet one of you is a devil?” Now He meant Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he, one of the twelve, was going to betray Him. /Joh 6:70

Jesus chose Judas even knowing he was a devil. It was not choosing Judas because he was a devil. There is a big difference there.

God chose all men before the beginning of the world, through dying for all men on the cross. But he knew perectly who will choose to follow him, and those he elected in him. God is not creating evil and is not the author of evil, then he would be evil himself, but I tell you God i very, very good. But his plan to redeem evil goes back to before time.

Yes, God knows who will betray him today, yes, but it's not him planning it or choosing it. It's our choosing and from there God can use it for his purposes.

 

[Neogaia777]

He was so very ticked off with Jesus, he had him in a rage, and was just waiting for the Father to remove the hedge, he wasn't thinking... By what Jesus did, Satan had already lost heaven by the time he killed him, possible that if Jesus had lived he would have lost earth also...

The enemy knows what Jesus did sealed his fate for a future date, but, had he not killed him, he might have lost the earth then... He knew that by killing Jesus he would only elevate him to heaven, and Satan saw that he was already locked out of heaven already, so, he killed him (Jesus) so that he would not completely lose for then anyhow, but knows his fate is sealed, and he's angry about it...

God Bless!

 

[Aseyesee]

God could see it, but didn't choose it.

Jesus didn't choose Judas so he could betray him, but he knew he would.

The tree, giving us the choice, free will. Knowing is not choosing.

You make it sound like everything is a big scheme planned by God. It isn't. God knows what's going to happen and take measures accordingly.

John 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.

The scripture says that Jesus only did what he saw his Father do.

I am not trying to affix blame, but show that there was a reason for God to do what he did, knowing full well the outcome before he did it, if not, he is not God, but one who would be God.

When God talked with Abraham over Sodom and Gomorrah he said, I will go down now, and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come unto me; and if not, I will know.

Do you actually think that God had to see for himself if what he heard was true? Does that even sound right? If it doesn't sound right to you, what is it that we are missing?

John 13:26-27 Jesus answered, He it is, to whom I shall give a sop, when I have dipped it. And when he had dipped the sop, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon. And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

With this last bold'd text Jesus gave permission for Satan/Judas to fulfill the Father's will, or bring him to the end he was born to from the foundation of the world.

 

[Aseyesee]

Jesus answered them, “Did I Myself not choose you, the twelve, and yet one of you is a devil?” Now He meant Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he, one of the twelve, was going to betray Him. /Joh 6:70

Jesus chose Judas even knowing he was a devil. It was not choosing Judas because he was a devil. There is a big difference there.

God chose all men before the beginning of the world, through dying for all men on the cross. But he knew perectly who will choose to follow him, and those he elected in him. God is not creating evil and is not the author of evil, then he would be evil himself, but I tell you God is very, very good. But his plan to redeem evil goes back to before time.

Yes, God knows who will betray him today, yes, but it's not him planning it or choosing it. It's our choosing and from there God can use it for his purposes.

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

It's not about planning or choosing (though God planned this out in such a way that nothing was left to chance, it was an end declared from the beginning), it's about doing it anyway, knowing full well the outcome of your actions to do it.

Judas was a man, not a devil, as some think of a devil, the word accuser or adversary would probably have been more informative, but it follows a pattern that becomes more and more defined throughout scripture.

 

[Aseyesee]

He was so very ticked off with Jesus, he had him in a rage, and was just waiting for the Father to remove the hedge, he wasn't thinking... By what Jesus did, Satan had already lost heaven by the time he killed him, possible that if Jesus had lived he would have lost earth also...

The enemy knows what Jesus did sealed his fate for a future date, but, had he not killed him, he might have lost the earth then... He knew that by killing Jesus he would only elevate him to heaven, and Satan saw that he was already locked out of heaven already, so, he killed him (Jesus) so that he would not completely lose for then anyhow, but knows his fate is sealed, and he's angry about it...

God Bless!

Is there a scripture that says Satan was angry with Jesus? Wroth with a woman, I see.

 

[Neogaia777]

Is there a scripture that says Satan was angry with Jesus? Wroth with a woman, I see.

In revelation somewhere it talks about his great anger, (wrath) knowing his time had been made short (by him) (Jesus)...

Prowls about like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour... Comes to steal, kill, and destroy, that takes anger...

Might be other places too...

God Bless!

 

[zoidar]

John 13:26-27 Jesus answered, He it is, to whom I shall give a sop, when I have dipped it. And when he had dipped the sop, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon. And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

With this last bold'd text Jesus gave permission for Satan/Judas to fulfill the Father's will, or bring him to the end he was born to from the foundation of the world.

Was it Jesus commanding Satan to enter Judas... Nope! Judas had been thinking about this for very long. And at that very moment Jesus gave the sop to Judas, Judas decided to do it, in other words, Satan entered him. I'm sure Satan has entered all of us at one time or another, when we do things that is against God. We turn around and repent, but Judas decided at that moment that he would go through with it and by that choice he let Satan fully into his heart. And it happened at the exact moment he got that bread. Maybe it was because what Jesus did for Judas was the absolute good, and Judas response was the absolute evil, and because of that his heart hardened, and he let Satan in. Jesus knew this would happen. Did Jesus plan it or choose it, nope! Sure Jesus let it happen but it was by Judas own choice of action!

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Do you know that that verse is about opposites? Light/darkness, day/night. What is the opposite of peace? Evil? Nope... it's calamity. It has nothing to with God creating evil, but rather that God can use calamity for his purpose, let it happen or even create calamity among those who turn against him.

I think you have a quite weird and possibly dark picture of God...

 

[Aseyesee]

In revelation somewhere it talks about his great anger, (wrath) knowing his time had been made short (by him) (Jesus)...

Prowls about like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour... Comes to steal, kill, and destroy, that takes anger...

Might be other places too...

God Bless!

Both those incidents are metaphorical in nature. In Revelation he is wroth with a woman.

How and what does Satan kill, steal, and destroy, while walking around like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour, in relationship to your own life?

God also comes as thief, and metaphorically said to be one who reaps where he does not sow.

 

[Neogaia777]

Both those incidents are metaphorical in nature. In Revelation he is wroth with a woman.

How and what does Satan kill, steal, and destroy, while walking around like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour, in relationship to your own life?

God also comes as thief, and metaphorically said to be one who reaps where he does not sow.

Satan feels/felt the same way about Christ, that his children did, the orthodox pharisees who did not like him very much...

The reasons why they hated him and put him to death, is the same as the enemy...

Jesus provoked him very much, akin to someone poking you in the eye, or using an airhorn in your ear...

Satan may have thought he won or was going to win against God during the 400 years of silence, before the NT and Christ... And some punk comes along to disrupt all that, well...

He was very angry, frustrated, and very ticked off at/with Jesus...

The way and reasons are reflected in his children, the Pharisees...

God Bless!

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Did Jesus plan it or choose it, nope! Sure Jesus let it happen but it was by Judas own choice of action!

ooops... sorry. YHWH and Y'SHUA planned it, and chose it before creating the world , and prophesied it would happen, in the book, hundreds of years before it happened.

 

[Aseyesee]

Was it Jesus commanding Satan to enter Judas... Nope! Judas had been thinking about this for very long. And at that very moment Jesus gave the sop to Judas, Judas decided to do it, in other words, Satan entered him. I'm sure Satan has entered all of us at one time or another, when we do things that is against God. We turn around and repent, but Judas decided at that moment that he would go through with it and by that choice he let Satan fully into his heart. And it happened at the exact moment he got that bread. Maybe it was because what Jesus did for Judas was the absolute good, and Judas response was the absolute evil, and because of that his heart hardened, and he let Satan in. Jesus knew this would happen. Did Jesus plan it or choose it, nope! Sure Jesus let it happen but it was by Judas own choice of action!



Do you know that that verse is about opposites? Light/darkness, day/night. What is the opposite of peace? Evil? Nope... it's calamity. It has nothing to with God creating evil, but rather that God can use calamity for his purpose, let it happen or even create calamity among those who turn against him.

I think you have a quite weird and possibly dark picture of God...

If God created nothing, nothing would have happened, good or evil, true or not?

I said he gave him permission, just as God gave Satan permission with Job, as he did when David numbered Israel (there is two accounts of this).

Jesus was of the mind that no one could do anything to him unless the power to do it came from above. I'm of the same mind regarding myself, and it is the way I view it for everybody else.

I am called to his purpose, so for me good or evil are to the same end.

 

[Aseyesee]

Satan feels/felt the same way about Christ, that his children did, the orthodox pharisees who did not like him very much...

The reasons why they hated him and put him to death, is the same as the enemy...

Jesus provoked him very much, akin to someone poking you in the eye, or using an airhorn in your ear...

Satan may have thought he won or was going to win against God during the 400 years of silence, before the NT and Christ... And some punk comes along to disrupt all that, well...

He was very angry, frustrated, and very ticked off at/with Jesus...

The way and reasons are reflected in his children, the Pharisees...

God Bless!

Yep, in the end it was their reasoning that put him to death, and the words that sealed his fate came from above, but out of Caiphas' mouth.

But he may have thought, and the like for me are really mute points.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

If satan is as smart as hes claimed to be, surely he wouldve been aware of the prophecies of the suffering servant and death of the messiah right? Why would he willingly try to fulfill a prophecy that he surely was aware of? Even if he didn't know the prophecies he surely heard Jesus rebuking peter for trying to stop Jesus from being killed. So obviously he knew Jesus wanted to be sacrificed. So why would he give Jesus what he wanted and be happy about it? I find it hard to imagine satan was so stupid as thinking he won because jesus was dead, especially when he heard Jesus saying constantly he would be risen.

Where does the Bible say Satan killed Jesus?

 

[Neogaia777]

Where does the Bible say Satan killed Jesus?

Satan entered Judas, to betray him, and he was already in the Pharisees, that killed him...

 

[zoidar]

ooops... sorry. YHWH and Y'SHUA planned it, and chose it before creating the world , and prophesied it would happen, in the book, hundreds of years before it happened.

God knew it, prophesied it, and used cicumstances to make it happen. But could it have been someone else than Judas? It could, if Judas would have made another decision. But of course God knew it would be Judas, but it was not like God created Judas for this purpose. Judas chose it. Could God have used someone like Simon Peter for the betrayl? He could not because Peter made other decisions. It was not God making Judas do what he was doing, it would be pure evil. But God used Judas evilness for a higher good.

If I have a friend that is a thief, I know if I let my walled out on the table when he is around he will steel money. If I leave it on the table is it then my doing him steeling money? Isn't it still my friend who chooses to do it? I can see God using circumstances in that way.

 

[zoidar]

If God created nothing, nothing would have happened, good or evil, true or not?

True! But if I make a car. Some guy buys it and runs it into a tree. Am I the reason for the accident?

 

[Aseyesee]

True! But if I make a car. Some guy buys it and runs it into a tree. Am I the reason for the accident?

Would it have happened if you never made the car, this is my absolute trust in God, is that he did.

And really it could not have been any different for Judas then what God knew it to be before he ever created anything, or it would mean God can be surprised by the outcome, which opens a can of worms whose lid even He couldn't close.

After giving more thought to this, it would mean Satan could actually change the future that God saw even before he himself was created.

Is their uncertainty in faith? is for the individual to wrestle with.