Why Would "Common Design" Mimic Evolution?

[Loudmouth]

There are even more shades of evolution, if you ask me. I have not said nor do I believe that everything is the way it is in creation because of natural selection alone, which is a passive process and not an active one, and which furthermore does not in itself give glory to God. I believe that God was and is and will be guiding creation with His Spirit, and I also believe that God provides for man in every step of evolution. God is not a cold designer who is sitting somewhere out of reach for man, entirely isolated from us, looking down on creation from afar like the Deists would have it. God is a loving God, who cares for His creation, especially for mankind.

How would those shades of evolution differ with respect to predictions and evidence?

For example, would the type of evolution you are proposing produce a nested hierarchy? Would you see a difference in sequence conservation between genes and junk DNA? What would the order of fossils look like in the geologic column, and how would it differ from a purely naturalistic evolution?

I do not object to natural selection as one out of many concepts to consider in the natural sciences, but I do not think that natural selection has everything it takes for us as human beings to make sense of our place in the universe. The most important thing for us is not to understand ourselves from a purely biological point of view, but it is a spiritual, Christian point of view that we need to appreciate and act on.

That may be important for christians, but I am more curious about the scientific method and how your different shades of evolution can be seen in the scientific evidence, if in fact it does show up in the scientific evidence. More importantly, why would evolution guided by a deity look exactly like evolution without a deity?

 

[Zosimus]

Since I have no vested interest in the "Christian story" I can't think of any good reason "common design" would mimic evolution in any way. What I do think is, *if* life is commonly designed, it almost looks suspiciously like god went out of his way to make things look NOT designed.

Am I the only one who shakes his head at these conversations?

WTH is common design? I didn't know, so I Googled it and found What is COMMON DESIGN? definition of COMMON DESIGN (Black's Law Dictionary) which says: "The intent to commit a crime or to help another in committing a crime."

I'm pretty sure that's not what is meant. Are you, perhaps, referring to intelligent design?

So why does intelligent design mimic evolution? Well, it doesn't. You see, evolution is the theory that the frequency of alleles changes from generation to generation. Intelligent design is the theory that all life was created by a hyper-intelligent being and/or God.

One does not mimic the other.

 

[USincognito]

Why make common design look exactly like evolution when it would have been easier to make it not look like evolution?

The question I've been asking is how do we falsify common design? I can think of dozens of ways to falsify common ancestry, but if common design is ad hoc at it's very core, there is no way to falsify it and it's therefore unscientific.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Many creationists claim that the evidence observed in the field of biology is consistent with a common designer.

My question is simple. Out of all of the multitude of ways that a designer could have designed life, why would this designer make it look like evolution?

For example, it takes a lot of extra effort and attention to make sure that life falls into a nested hierarchy. For this very reason, humans do not force their designs to fall into a nested hierarchy since there is absolutely no design reason why a nested hierarchy is needed. The common designer of bats and birds could have designed a species with flow through lungs and a membrane wing, or feathers and three middle ear bones. So why don't we see numerous and clear violations of a nested hierarchy that would have been simple for such a designer to produce?

Why make common design look exactly like evolution when it would have been easier to make it not look like evolution?

Evolution is man's interpretation of the design process. Design does not mimic evolution because evolution is part of the process that the Designer uses to design.

 

[florida2]

The designer produced nodes and all creation according to His design. If you had the intelligence and understanding which the designer and creator has, you could possibly comprehend His creation. Until then, you're left with nothing but faith-based Godless guesses and suppositions for your creationist view.

I do find it amusing that you are one of those who uses 'creationist' as an insult. Like those who try to call evolution a 'religion'.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Because evolution is a game of connect-the-dots.

Evolutionists draw invisible lines of connectivity between nodes to show a descent pattern that was never there.

More like god likes to troll us. A deity would really have to go out of its way to cover up a 6 day creation so completely.

 

[Linuxgal]

So why does intelligent design mimic evolution? Well, it doesn't. You see, evolution is the theory that the frequency of alleles changes from generation to generation.

Not only from generation to generation, but also within a single generation. I'm not absolutely identical with my sisters due to genetic drift. My momma and poppa reached into a big bowl of genetic M&Ms and came up with a different set of them every time, more brown ones for her, more green ones for me, etc.

 

[AV1611VET]

More like god likes to troll us. A deity would really have to go out of its way to cover up a 6 day creation so completely.

Not hardly.

There's no way evolution can work within the timeframe the Bible gives us.

Thus scientists simply move the decimal point as needed -- then accuse God of being deceptive.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Not hardly.

There's no way evolution can work within the timeframe the Bible gives us.

Thus scientists simply move the decimal point as needed -- then accuse God of being deceptive.

No argument in regards to the timeframe, I agree. However, evidence points to the earth being far older than that. What logical reason would said deity have to make the earth look older than it actually is so completely?

 

[AV1611VET]

What logical reason would said deity have to make the earth look older than it actually is so completely?

We've been over this C times, haven't we?

I've even shown that God can't make raisin bread without being accused of deception.

 

[Linuxgal]

I've even shown that God can't make raisin bread without being accused of deception.

We generally don't accuse non-existent creatures of deception. No one calls Bigfoot a liar.

 

[PsychoSarah]

We've been over this C times, haven't we?

I've even shown that God can't make raisin bread without being accused of deception.

And I say an omnipotent, omniscient being could have managed to do something to indicate how old the earth actually was.

 

[AV1611VET]

We generally don't accuse non-existent creatures of deception.

I wouldn't know.

 

[AV1611VET]

And I say an omnipotent, omniscient being could have managed to do something to indicate how old the earth actually was.

You don't know yet how old the earth actually is?

If so, how did you find out?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

That's right.

The Designer didn't create fossils.

In fact, had the Fall never occurred, there would be no fossils today.

That's what computers are for.

ick,computers.... (taken over the world0o)...

however, good point. the world just totally misses it. since there was no death until after A * F * T * E * R sin.... well..... it's explained elsewhere... (if anyone wants to look for it, i don't know where). just look for where it says "since no life died until after sin transpired, all life on earth has been in the last 2350 years +/- maybe 12 days,
none of the so-called 'dating' methods of any kind any where,
including dating sites, (pagan ones),
have a clue. period.

Yhvh is Perfect.
Yhvh created everything, and called it very good.
That's all ekklesia have believed since it started.
All those who made up stories leaving out the Creator,
or saying anything untrue,
will have to , you know, 'fess up one day soon.

and even their knee's will bow, and every tongue confess,
that blessed is He Who Comes in the Name ADONAI!

ALL Of His Ways Are Perfect, and Just. An Elohim of Truth, without iniquity, all His Ways are Judgment.

 

[PsychoSarah]

You don't know yet how old the earth actually is?

If so, how did you find out?

I meant it from your perspective. If the earth was actually 6 thousand years old, it certainly doesn't match how the earth appears based on various measurements.

 

[Linuxgal]

however, good point. the world just totally misses it. since there was no death until after A * F * T * E * R sin.... well.....

Explain this to me:

If there was no death until after sin, why was there a Tree of Life before sin? An immortal wouldn't need it. Did God want to set himself a challenge to see how fast he could eject Adam and Eve from the Garden before they ate of the Tree of Life?

 

[justlookinla]

Just to clarify, there was sin and death before Adam ate the 'apple' in the garden. Satan had fallen long before Adam's sin.

The 'eating of the apple' introduced death to humankind.

 

[Linuxgal]

Just to clarify, there was sin and death before Adam ate the 'apple' in the garden. Satan had fallen long before Adam's sin.

That accounts for sin, but did Satan die?

 

[Linuxgal]

The 'eating of the apple' introduced death to humankind.

I would say that death preceded the apple, since the other fruit, the tree of life, was already there too, and God didn't forbid them from eating it until after the fall. If there was no death, then it wouldn't be there, unless God likes to create redundant things like the human vermiform appendix...oh, wait.