Why would anyone want to be a Christian?

[razeontherock]

I haven't met god? LOL You really don't have any idea of my background, beliefs, faith or experiences, so I have to laugh when you make such absurd conclusions!

That's not the conclusion I drew, and stated so plainly. Perhaps this explains the following?

I have a long way to go before I am ready to chuck my brain out the window and stop thinking for myself, in addition to accepting whatever interpretation or belief structure that you accept.

But I am very much convinced that their beliefs are solidly rooted in the Bible, not fanciful thinking. Thus, I reject the Bible and Christianity with it.

1) Chucking your brain out the window makes Biblical Christianity impossible

2) Calvinism most certainly IS based on the Bible, and again, they do a good job of explaining some things that are very difficult. I can even allow that some people may be best off within it's organization, and it may have it's place. None of that means it rightly divides the word. What it means is that you reject Calvin, and feel justified in rejecting Christ Himself by association. I simply point out to you this is poor judgment! (Seeing as Christ came first, and all)

 

[Forgiven828]

Why wouldn't someone want to be a Christian?

 

[joey_downunder]

I am unsure what to believe, hence I am agnostic. I don't hate god or gods or God. I simply could not worship the god that Christianity has made.

The God you are referring to - do you mean your understanding of the God of the Old Testament and/or New Testament?

I consider myself like the Athenians who had an altar that was to the UNKNOWN GOD, in Acts. If there is a god, and it is truly the Christian one, then we are all in very deep business. Or perhaps the Christian view of god is actually maleficent and false. No matter what the case may be, I was not able to follow such a being. I tried and became too disillusioned and disgusted by what religion teaches.

It puzzles me how you seem to have developed such a negative view about the Christian God.
*Do you mind telling us what denomination that you used to belong to?
*Did your pastor or minister teach a lot about God's judgement and hardly anything about God's mercy and forgiveness towards sinners?
* Is your family very religious in the negative sense i.e. legalistic, judgemental towards people?

 

[razeontherock]

I was not able to follow such a being. I tried and became too disillusioned and disgusted by what religion teaches.

This is what happens when one follows false teachings, not when one follows the risen Christ.

 

[Merlinius]

When Jesus offers eternal Life in righteousness and peace and joy, who in their right minds would turn it down??

 

[seekingagnostic32]

The God you are referring to - do you mean your understanding of the God of the Old Testament and/or New Testament?

It puzzles me how you seem to have developed such a negative view about the Christian God.
*Do you mind telling us what denomination that you used to belong to?
*Did your pastor or minister teach a lot about God's judgement and hardly anything about God's mercy and forgiveness towards sinners?
* Is your family very religious in the negative sense i.e. legalistic, judgemental towards people?

My hatred for Christianity is mostly rooted in Calvinism and reformed theology. How anyone can worship that demon is far beyond me on that. My family believes god is good. They are not Calvinists nor would they want to be. They rarely read the Bible or go to church.

 

[razeontherock]

They rarely read the Bible or go to church.

I have seen you assert that anyone who maintains that G-d is good, must not be aware of the Bible's contents. You really don't need me to demonstrate how false that idea is; the Orthodox have 3 whole sub-forums devoted to them, one of which is designed for debating. (The only community on CF w/ the gumption to do so, and rightly so; they know their stuff!)

 

[Scott1979]

I was wondering why someone would ever choose to be a Christian, unless you don't believe in choosing and it's all fated.

I don't believe it's all fated. I don't think we would have the ability to choose if it was. Looking back on my post it could have come across as rude and I do apologize for that was not my intention. What I meant was when I said that you are starting an argument that is never going to end is that when you get in to what people believe it turns into a back and forth never ending battle. Your trying to prove your point and there trying to prove there point. When your firmly rooted in your beliefs nothing is going to change them and that is where the problem comes in. I for one believe that people are entitled to believe what they want to and I am not going to try to ram rod my point down there throat and i expect the same. People would choose to be a christian because they choose to believe in a higher power. You choose not to which is fine in your own right. I'm sorry for typing so much but I hope my point is coming across. It all boils down to what people have faith in.

 

[jacks]

I don't believe it's all fated. I don't think we would have the ability to choose if it was. Looking back on my post it could have come across as rude and I do apologize for that was not my intention. What I meant was when I said that you are starting an argument that is never going to end is that when you get in to what people believe it turns into a back and forth never ending battle. Your trying to prove your point and there trying to prove there point. When your firmly rooted in your beliefs nothing is going to change them and that is where the problem comes in. I for one believe that people are entitled to believe what they want to and I am not going to try to ram rod my point down there throat and i expect the same. People would choose to be a christian because they choose to believe in a higher power. You choose not to which is fine in your own right. I'm sorry for typing so much but I hope my point is coming across. It all boils down to what people have faith in.

Well put, we all have faith in something. Our only choice is what we have faith in.

 

[FreeinChrist]

MOD HAT


This thread has undergone a clean up. Please review the guidelines for this particular forum - the ONLY non-Christian allowed to post in the thread is the OP. ONLY Christians can respond to him.

 

[joey_downunder]

My hatred for Christianity is mostly rooted in Calvinism and reformed theology. How anyone can worship that demon is far beyond me on that. My family believes god is good. They are not Calvinists nor would they want to be. They rarely read the Bible or go to church.

So it is Calvin's interpretation of the Bible and his doctrines that has made you reject Christianity overall.

Christians believe that Jesus died on the cross for our sins and rose from the dead, not Calvin. Christians have a relationship with God, not Calvin.

Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

 

[seekingagnostic32]

So it is Calvin's interpretation of the Bible and his doctrines that has made you reject Christianity overall.

Christians believe that Jesus died on the cross for our sins and rose from the dead, not Calvin. Christians have a relationship with God, not Calvin.

So, just make up my own interpretation as pathway to ultimate truth? That seems sensible... (not really)...

 

[Soothfish]

Can someone tell me, please?

What were your reasons for becoming one?

I'll give you just one reason and it should be sufficient:

because in THIS world, millions of innocent children have been tortured, raped, enslaved, and/or murdered over the ages and tossed away like used meat. Almost all have been totally forgotten. They will rot in the ground like garbage unless Christ did indeed rise. If he did, then all those little ones will be resurrected, comforted, and glorified forever at the right hand of their true father. They will be dignified at a level far beyond the natural capacity of humans to perform. Maybe you can imagine some other faith that proposes the same thing but you see the point I'm making?

The real question is: why would anyone in their right mind NOT want to be a Christian?!

 

[razeontherock]

So, just make up my own interpretation as pathway to ultimate truth? That seems sensible... (not really)...

Is that not what Calvin did? Is that not how you wound up where you are now? (Following what he made up, I mean)

 

[GeordieTosh]

The real question is: why would anyone in their right mind NOT want to be a Christian?!

It's not that simple though is it? Of course I'd love to believe that there is some magical deity that will protect me while I'm alive, and when I die, let me live forever in some Happy La La Land for all eternity.

But how do you get from being a rational atheist to being a 'believer'? It may sound simple to you, but it's not easy for me.

 

[Merlinius]

It's not that simple though is it? Of course I'd love to believe that there is some magical deity that will protect me while I'm alive, and when I die, let me live forever in some Happy La La Land for all eternity.

But how do you get from being a rational atheist to being a 'believer'? It may sound simple to you, but it's not easy for me.

Just ask Jesus what is right for you to do Geordie

He is God and He Loves you. Prove Him out in your life. He'll let you know

 

[GeordieTosh]

Just ask Jesus what is right for you to do Geordie

He is God and He Loves you. Prove Him out in your life. He'll let you know

Proving 'Him' out of my life; what does that mean? Jesus could be just a literary device as far as I know.

However, I have quite a sound prayer and meditation practise, and my experience of 'God' isn't Biblical; it's something within. I've recovered from alcoholism using a 12 Step process that is to remove the blockages from God; I've done a thorough and fearless moral inventory, I've 'confessed' it and saw my truth, and I've also made restitution to those I've harmed.

My daily practise consists of watching my behaviour, prayer and meditation, and practising compassion (steps 10, 11, and 12); I've been sober for nearly three years now, so my practise is solid, and I take it seriously and try not to take myself so seriously (Rule 62 ).

I have had what A.A. calls a 'spiritual awakening', however, just because I've had one does not mean that I should automatically assign that to 'Jesus' or an Abrahamic religion.

If I were to do so, that would feel more 'political' (because it's cultural) than spiritual.

I would say I already live life along 'Christian principles' (but these principles will be at the heart of any 'true' religion); such as love, tolerance, helping others; I have a spiritual community (Alcoholics Anonymous); but so far, I've not been convinced by Christianity.

I'm a seeker, so keep an open mind; I'll just continue to read some posts I guess, and ask questions.

 

[Soothfish]

I have news for you: People are naturally inclined to blaspheme or speak ill of a murderous, violent, cruel person, whether or not said being is supposed to be a god or not. If you think that a man should run to the very god who is killing, torturing and abusing them, then what you have just said is that "love" is the same thing as that of an abusive relationship. But then, god does 'wound and bind up' does he not? I think that's in Hosea.

Unfortunately, Calvinism is Christianity. It also bears a striking resemblance to Islam, in that it is entirely deterministic and fatalistic. Que sera sera, whatever will be will be? The future is not ours, you see. Nevertheless, I have never heard an arminian argument that took the Bible as seriously as Calvinism without twisting its context, meaning or ignoring plain parts of the Bible. If you're going to believe something, why pick and choose?

I have tried being the man after god's heart. I have even been called that by spiritual leaders in churches. Now, I reject their idea of god and religion entirely. I find myself more and more disgusted with the Christian god the more time passes. I honestly hate religion.

So is your mind open to other interpretations of the scripture or have you already made up your mind to hate Christianity and to believe that God hates humanity?

If it's the latter then that is quite sad.

 

[Soothfish]

I have a long way to go before I am ready to chuck my brain out the window and stop thinking for myself, in addition to accepting whatever interpretation or belief structure that you accept. I played the Christian game for over 10 years of my life, closer to 15 actually since I got "born again". I'm living proof that man can walk away from the god of religion and live to tell the tale. Calvinists told me you cannot do so, but clearly you can. Another reason their religion is wrong. But I am very much convinced that their beliefs are solidly rooted in the Bible, not fanciful thinking. Thus, I reject the Bible and Christianity with it.

I don't mean to be disrespectful towards you but this doesn't sound like free-thinking to me. It sounds like you have an emotional vendetta against Christianity. If you listen to scholars having a debate, they don't talk like this. Just saying.

 

[Merlinius]

Proving 'Him' out of my life; what does that mean? Jesus could be just a literary device as far as I know.

However, I have quite a sound prayer and meditation practise, and my experience of 'God' isn't Biblical; it's something within. I've recovered from alcoholism using a 12 Step process that is to remove the blockages from God; I've done a thorough and fearless moral inventory, I've 'confessed' it and saw my truth, and I've also made restitution to those I've harmed.

My daily practise consists of watching my behaviour, prayer and meditation, and practising compassion (steps 10, 11, and 12); I've been sober for nearly three years now, so my practise is solid, and I take it seriously and try not to take myself so seriously (Rule 62 ).

I have had what A.A. calls a 'spiritual awakening', however, just because I've had one does not mean that I should automatically assign that to 'Jesus' or an Abrahamic religion.

If I were to do so, that would feel more 'political' (because it's cultural) than spiritual.

I would say I already live life along 'Christian principles' (but these principles will be at the heart of any 'true' religion); such as love, tolerance, helping others; I have a spiritual community (Alcoholics Anonymous); but so far, I've not been convinced by Christianity.

I'm a seeker, so keep an open mind; I'll just continue to read some posts I guess, and ask questions.

Congradulations on overcoming through AA Geordie

That shows YOUR strength of character and integrity. Through the "higher power" of your discipline and with fellowship of help, you have overcome!

This is a beautiful analogy to how Jesus works with us in salvation.

The big differance being that Jesus Himself is our higher power, and He Himself is poised and ready for a man to ask Him to Come into us and BE our Higher Power.
Because I can not "be" anything concerning righteousness and salvation, no matter how hard I might try or be disciplined.
So I let Him sit in the reigns of my heart and rule and reign and make the decisions and choices. I have no intention of trying to do anything. I let Jesus do it all And my life has changed incredibly since I've let Him Live in me instead of "me" living in me.
And I'd never go back to that dark question-filled void of unknowingness and aloneness of my soul.
For in the New Life of Christ in me, all darkness is chased away. There are no more obstacles, nothing but victories. No more sorrow or crying, only joy and praise. No more hopelessness and inevitable death, but instead, total confidence and knowingness and Eternal Life in Glory Forever.

This is the serious dichotomy between our choices. We can choose death or we can choose life. Whatever we "want" God will honor and we shall become accomplished in whatever path we choose. Once we choose that is. Once we are done sitting on the fence and decide one way or the other, then we are off and running chugga chugga choo choo!

My prayers are with you that you would choose Jesus and Life Eternal. If you do, He will hurriedly rush to you and fill you with His Holy Spirit as much as you ask, and will reveal unto you as much as you want. Then HE will do what needs to be done in you and you can REST from attempting things under your own steam anymore

I Promise you this, as one who has gone before you in all this dear brother.

In all His Love,
Merlin