I've read these posts too. I don't believe
@civilwarbuff is condoning living in sin. I believe the divide here is you champion yourself as sinless while still in your decaying body of flesh. Unless I missed something glorified bodies have not been handed out in this life other than the Risen and Glorified Christ.
Perhaps your denial of the full deity of Jesus Christ leads you to believe you can become like Him before being conformed to His Image. Image that is not exactness as that would make you equal to God.
The apostle John says the following:
1 John 1:
5 And this is the message that we have heard from Him, and announce to you, that God is light, and darkness in Him is not at all;
6 if we may say -- `we have fellowship with Him,' and in the darkness may walk -- we lie, and do not the truth;
7 and if in the light we may walk, as He is in the light -- we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son doth cleanse us from every sin;
8 if we may say -- `we have not sin,' ourselves we lead astray, and the truth is not in us;
9 if we may confess our sins, stedfast He is and righteous that He may forgive us the sins, and may cleanse us from every unrighteousness;
10 if we may say -- `we have not sinned,' a liar we make Him, and His word is not in us.
Read this,
One of the major deceptions present in this time is that you can continue sinning and that somehow God will forgive you each time. I hear it time and time again, we are fallen, that's why we sin, and there is grace for that. While there is indeed favor, this is not a license to sin. First and foremost, before jumping into the ability to stop sinning, I must first discuss what the power of the spirit really does. Throughout scripture we see evidence that receiving the spirit is not just some sort of figurative event that occurs, as most perceive it to be, it happens with real physical manifestations and signs of having received it. In one occurence we see written,
And spirit of the LORD shall spring upon you, and you shall prophesy with them, and you shall turn into another man. (1 Samuel 10:6 [ABP])
This scripture was talking about Saul. Notice how the scripture says, and "
you shall turn into another man". It is talking about an inward mental change, a literal change and rewiring of his mind to become someone else. How did this happen? As a consequence of the spirit springing upon him. The mental change is literally a possession of the mind, but not by an evil force, but by the spirit of God. And what also happened? He began prophesying, and this was an outward sign. It was so evident what had just happened that look further at what is written,
And came to pass all the things being made known to him yesterday and the third day before. And behold, he was in the midst of the prophets prophesying. And the people each said to his neighbor, What is this, the thing having happened to the son of Kish? Or is also Saul among the prophets? (1 Samuel 10:11 [ABP])
In a more modern way of translating, they were practically saying, "what happened here, is Saul, the son of Kish, now a prophet?". They were in shock.
In further reading, we have a prophecy in Ezekiel stating how God would cause his people to follow him and keep his commandments,
[26] And I will put in you a new heart, and I will put a new spirit in you, and I will remove the stone heart from your flesh, and I will give to you a heart of flesh. [27] And I will put my spirit in you, and I shall make it that you shall go by my ordiances, and you shall keep my judgments, and you shall observe them.(Ezekiel 36:26-27 [ABP])
The first thing to note here is God putting a new heart in you. Heart is synonymous with the mind, but more specifically where the
desires are. We see another usage here of the word "heart",
May he grant you your heart's desire and fulfill all your plans! (Psalm 20:4)
The heart is also where desires and intentions lie, as is the usage in many other passages. So what does he also do? He puts in a
new spirit in you. And what else? A new heart, meaning,
a new mind and
new desires. This prophecy is also indicating that it will be dispensed differently than it was before, yet even in the way it was dispensed before, we saw indications of how powerful it was to
change the mind of a person. What will this
new spirit cause a man to do? It will cause him to "go by my ordinances and you shall keep my judgments, and you shall observe them." Meaning
you will obey God. Why is it different now than before? Because of the
blood of Jesus Christ has now been shed, and so now this
new spirit operates in the
power of that blood of Jesus Christ,
causing you to change have a different mind and also desires, whereas before it didn't to those that had holy spirit and still sinned, because the blood of the true lamb of God hadn't been shed yet, and the blood of animals was never able to cause a man to stop sinning, yet was only able to atone for sins. This prophecy is now fulfilled in these days by the outpouring of the holy spirit as a result of the shedding of the blood of the true lamb of God.
The new spirit that is given now imparts the ability to sin no more. Why? Because the blood of Jesus has now been poured. His blood, which is higher than the blood of animals, is indeed able to cause a man to stop sinning through the power of holy spirit, whereas before, the blood of animals was never able to change the heart (mind and desires), as it is written,
For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and of he-goats to remove sins. (Hebrews 10:4 [ABP])
This is why it is a
new spirit, since it now
causes you to change your mind and desires, and how it coincides with God saying, "I will give you a new heart of flesh". In this passage we also read, "I will remove the stone heart", what exactly does this mean? It means it will
remove your old fleshly mind which has evil desires (This is where Paul talks about the fleshly nature), which is also the root of sin, and give you a new heart, that desires to obey God and causes you to keep his commandments and
not sin anymore. Receiving holy spirit is in fact so powerful that it causes a man to now stop sinning and change removes evil desires, and thus this is why we read,
Anyone engendered of God, does not commit sin, for his seed abides in him; and he is not able to sin, because he has been engendered by God. (1 John 3:9 [ABP])
Why is he also not able to sin anymore? Because his desires have been changed by being possessed by God. This is one scripture that is ignored or twisted by many, because they don't understand how it is possible to stop sinning. They think they have received holy spirit figuratively, and while they are still aware of their own sinful desires, they cant comprehend how one can stop sinning while having this "figurative" spirit. It is not just a figurative thing, it is literal, and it comes with outward manifestations of it. It is
only possible by receiving this Spirit that you can stop sinning, that possesses you and causes you to follow after God, and changes your inner desires. Being born of God is receiving this Spirit. Going further, Paul also says that it is impossible for us to stop sinning, which is true because we are still in our fallen nature if we don't receive this holy spirit, which is why it is
necessary to receive holy spirit, so that through its power we may then finally be able to stop sinning, but not by our own power, but by the power of the spirit. Its not anything in our own nature, because our minds are fleshly and our desires are evil, but because of God putting his spirit in you and causing you to follow after him that you are then able to walk perfectly before him. If you could indeed keep sinning while having holy spirit, you would be breaking scripture that says that you cannot sin when being born of God. So therefore,
anyone that still sins does not truly have the spirit of God. Jesus even says,
You shall be then yourselves perfect, as your father, the one in the heavens is perfect. (Matthew 5:48 [ABP])
How can anyone be perfect and why would Jesus demand such a seemingly impossible thing? It's because perfection, that is, inward perfection, is imparted by holy spirit, which then makes inner perfection possible. Jesus also told the woman after he forgave her sins,
And she said, No one, O Lord. And Jesus said to her, Nor I condemn you; go and from now sin no more! (John 8:11 [ABP])
In Romans Paul goes on to eloquently explain this fallen nature that is in us before having the Spirit,
[15] For what I manufacture, I do not know; for not what I want to do, this I practice; and what I detest, this I do. [16] But if what I do not want to do, this I do, then I assent to the law that it is good. [17] But now, no longer I manufacture it, but it is the sin living in me. [18] For I know that there does not live in me (that is to say in my flesh) good. For the will is present with me, but the manufacturing the good I do not find. [19] For I do not do the good which I want to do, but the evil which I do not want to do, this I do. [20] But if what I do not want to do, this I do; no longer I manufacture it, but it is sin living in me. [21] I find then the law, in the one wanting in me to do the good, that with me the evil is present. [22] For I delight in the law of God according to the inside man. [23] But I see another law in my members, undertaking an expedition against the law of my mind, and captivating me to the law of the sin, to the one being in my members. [24] O miserable man am I. Who shall rescue me from this body of death? (Romans 7:15-24 [ABP])
We are born in sin even before we commit any sins, this is our fallen nature, that nature of our minds, and nothing that is within us is able to follow after God. As it is even written,
Sinners were separated from the womb; they wander from the belly; they spoke lies. (Psalms 58:3 [ABP])
Notice how they were called sinners even from the womb, before they were even able to commit sins. Its imputed on us already before birth. Paul even says,
for all sinned and lack the glory of God; (Romans 3:23 [ABP])
Even in 1 John we read,
If we should say that we do not have sin, we mislead ourselves, and the truth is not in us. (1 John 1:8 [ABP])
This doesn't mean that we continue to sin, because in the verses before, it said no one that is born of God sins. What it means is that we have all sinned in the past. Only Jesus Christ did not sin, ever. So what does Paul go on to say after explaining this very evil nature that has befallen all of man, including himself, which is why he calls himself "wretched man"? He says,
[1] In nothing then is there now condemnation to the ones in Christ Jesus, not walking according to flesh, but according to spirit. [2] For the law of the spirit of the life in Christ Jesus freed me from the law of the sin and of death.
(Romans 8:1-2 [ABP])
Did you catch that? The ones in Christ Jesus, "not walking according to the flesh, but according to the spirit", or more clearly explained,
not walking according to the flesh anymore, but now presently walking according to the spirit. What this really means is this, at one point I did walk in the flesh, but now I walk in the Spirit. How? By
having the spirit. You can't
both walk in the flesh and in the Spirit at the same time. You can only walk in one or the other. And also meaning,
before I had the fleshly nature, but now that I have the
spirit, I have been
freed from the fleshly nature. Look what Paul then says, "the law of the spirit of the life in Christ Jesus freed me". Paul is in fact affirming that he has now been freed from sin and from his very fleshly nature.
Because of the spirit. He affirms this again,
that the ordinance of the law should be fulfilled in us, to the ones not walking according to flesh, but according to spirit. (Romans 8:4 [ABP])
He is in fact affirming that
he is not walking after the flesh anymore, not now presently only walking after the spirit. Again, Paul makes
another affirmation about this,
But you are not in flesh, but in spirit, if indeed spirit of God lives in you. But if anyone does not have the spirit of Christ, this one is not of him. (Romans 8:9 [ABP])
Again, you are not in the flesh anymore, but now in spirit, and what does he say after?
If indeed the spirit of God lives in you. You can only be
set free by your sinful nature and desires and
not walk in the flesh anymore only if you have the spirit of God in you. How much more clear can Paul be? Yet many still misunderstand out of ignorance and justify their own continuance of committing sins. They falsely think you can walk in the flesh and in the spirit at the same time. Not according to Paul. Paul further says,
For as many as are led in spirit of God, these are sons of God.(Romans 8:14 [ABP])
Whoever has received the spirit of God is a son of God, being
born of God, who can no longer sin. This coincides with other previous scriptures. Do we have other scriptures indicating that a person can stop sinning? Yes, look at this prophecy in Daniel concerning Jesus,
Seventy periods of seven were rendered concise upon your people, and upon the holy city, to finish off sin, and to set a seal upon sins, and to wipe out the lawless deeds, and to atone for iniquities, and to bring eternal righteousness, and to set a seal upon vision and prophecy, and to anoint the holy of holies. (Daniel 9:24 [ABP])
This scripture is often misinterpreted and many believe the false teaching of a "7 year tribulation" as the final week in this prophecy because they don't understand how sin could've been "finished off" knowing themselves that they still continue sinning. Well, sin is "finished off" because of the power the holy spirit gives to cause a person to stop sinning. This prophecy was already fulfilled after the death of Jesus Christ, ending the 70 weeks prophecy. It didn't just stop, then resume in the future over 2,000 years later as many falsely believe. The 70 weeks were sequential years and it was completed with the death of Jesus Christ and the Pentecost that brought in the Holy Spirit giving the
inner perfection and
finishing off of sins. Even in Hebrews we have another affirmations concerning perfection and those that are sanctified by holy spirit,
For by one offering he has perfected in perpetuity the ones having been sanctified. (Hebrews 10:14 [ABP])
So what about grace, or rather, favor? I prefer the use of the word favor because it more accurately conveys in English what is meant by the word grace, in that he chooses to show mercy and compassion, while we don't deserve it, and he doesn't really have to do it, he just merely shows it because he chooses to show his kindness. God does whatever he pleases. This is his creation and his work, and we are creatures made by him, created as sinners. He does whatever he wants with us. The favor of God is bestowed upon us in that while being in our fallen nature not deserving his mercy, he still chose to be merciful with us, forgive our previous sin, and bestow upon us the gift of his spirit, to be sons of the living God empowered to stop sinning because of his spirit. This is where the favor of God demonstrated. As Paul even says,
So then it is not of the one wanting, nor of the one running, but of the showing mercy of God. (Romans 9:16 [ABP])
And he also says,
For to Moses he says, I will show mercy on whom ever I should show mercy, and I shall pity whom ever I should pity. (Romans 9:15 [ABP])
Therefore, it is God who shows the mercy, to whomever he pleases. It is nothing that we have done, it is merely his favor, and in fact, his choosing, that you anyone receives the gift of holy spirit.
