Why Should Women not be Permitted to go Topless in Public?

[Archivist]

There are countless verses concerning immodesty.

Then please provide any that state that it is immodest for a woman to go topless.

The rest of your argument is banal.

In your opinion.

This isn't the rest of the world, this is the USA. Our laws are what they are and for good reason.

And what exactly would that "good reason" be in terms of laws that prevent women from going topless? Further, if laws that prevent women from going topless are "for good reason," why do some states (such as New York) allow women to go topless?

 

[Armoured]

Aw, leave it to an atheist to attempt to imply a body insult to a Christian woman.
I teach aerobics and have to 10 years. How's your wife's body? Mine is as trim as it gets.
How's yours?

Modesty sir, probably escapes you, but none the less.
And for that one that sighed at the mere thought of modesty, please show me in scripture where it says women are to bare their breasts in public for all the world to see.

Looking forward to it.

Says she who's already made comments about who should and shouldn't go topless.

 

[Aldebaran]

Says she who's already made comments about who should and shouldn't go topless.

I have a feeling this subject will go before the Supreme Court as a discrimination against women case. We seem to have nothing better to do.

 

[Armoured]

I have a feeling this subject will go before the Supreme Court as a discrimination against women case. We seem to have nothing better to do.

Which is surely excessive.

Why do people feel the need to dig the heels in against the tiniest social change?

Make it legal for women to go topless tomorrow, I don't think it's going to result in the instant Marseille-isation of the US. I suspect the uptake would be very small.

Yet it will probably take a supreme court ruling, at least, to make it legal. While tonnes of ink and angst is spilled about it.

Equality is important. But aren't there bigger hills to die on? For people on both sides.

 

[TerranceL]

Aw, leave it to an atheist to attempt to imply a body insult to a Christian woman.
I teach aerobics and have to 10 years. How's your wife's body? Mine is as trim as it gets.
How's yours?

Dawwww leave it a christian to say so much but not actually get around to answering the question.

Modesty sir, probably escapes you, but none the less.
And for that one that sighed at the mere thought of modesty, please show me in scripture where it says women are to bare their breasts in public for all the world to see.

Looking forward to it.

The same place where the bible says people are to travel in planes, get vaccinations, use computers, etc, etc.

 

[SuperCloud]

Archivist might be on to something here in a greater beneficial sense to men and teenage boys.

Imagine you're a teenage boy and you have a "hot" looking mom. Your house might become a more popular hangout spot for your teenage buddies as your mom walks around the house and backyard topless.

Or if you're a 50 year-old husband with a wife about the same age whose breasts have begun to sag, you can look at her younger 20ish aged sisters, nieces, and probably coworkers on their off time strutting around their perky youthful breasts.

And if you're a 30 year-old guy with a secret sexual attraction to prepubescent girls, now you can get some eye candy watching topless 7 year-old girls skateboard down the street. I'm especially sarcastic about this last point but you get the point.

Yes, there can be and are cultures where topless women are a far less sexualized thing. But one wonders what the motives are for any American men that are not just championing women going topless but militantly championing it.

If I have a little girl or even teenage daughter... I don't want any perverts looking at their bare breasts. And if I were a teenage boy I sure wouldn't want any grown men let alone teenage boys looking at and commenting on my mothers naked breasts. I'd be ready to take a gun to the back of some guy's knee caps or at least go to fist blows.




Just my 2 cents.

 

[Aldebaran]

Yes, there can be and are cultures where topless women are a far less sexualized thing. But one wonders what the motives are for any American men that are not just championing women going topless but militantly championing it.

If I have a little girl or even teenage daughter... I don't want any perverts looking at their bare breasts. And if I were a teenage boy I sure wouldn't want any grown men let alone teenage boys looking at and commenting on my mothers naked breasts. I'd be ready to take a gun to the back of some guy's knee caps or at least go to fist blows.

You have to remember that some of the people on this board that have no problem with things like this, or gay marriage, or loss of (Christian) freedom also don't have much sense of moral intuition (conscience). They think, "Hey, why not? If men can marry women, why can't they marry men? If men can go topless, why not women? If I can have sex with my wife, why not my dog, or my daughter?

The point is, when you remove ethics, morality, common sense, and God from the equation, then ANYthing can be justified if you really think about it.

 

[Hank]

Once more I give you Ontario, Canada.

About 20 years ago, a girl started a fight for her right to go topless. She won. It is legal for men and women, in Ontario, to go topless. 20 years later, most still go like with a top on, even when it's hot outside.

It was such a big thing on the news, and in the end nothing changed. Leave the people their freedom and they do what is best.

 

[SuperCloud]

You have to remember that some of the people on this board that have no problem with things like this, or gay marriage, or loss of (Christian) freedom also don't have much sense of moral intuition (conscience). They think, "Hey, why not? If men can marry women, why can't they marry men? If men can go topless, why not women? If I can have sex with my wife, why not my dog, or my daughter?

The point is, when you remove ethics, morality, common sense, and God from the equation, then ANYthing can be justified if you really think about it.

You may or may not be right, Alde, but I'm no Puritan and I'm pretty tainted in sin. And being tainted like that can have some lesser or greater impact on your moral intuition.

But I'm just saying I can much appreciate scantly clad women at Miami Beach or the beaches of Rio de Janiero. And I may not object to seeing the 17 year-old or 20ish year-old daughters of other men walking around with their bare breasts exposed.

But just so long as these are not the women of my immediate and extended family. So, what does that make me? If I have a 17 year-old daughter I don't want some guy to be staring at my daughter's naked breasts. And because it's my daughter I'd naturally regard all the dudes as perverts.

 

[SuperCloud]

Once more I give you Ontario, Canada.

About 20 years ago, a girl started a fight for her right to go topless. She won. It is legal for men and women, in Ontario, to go topless. 20 years later, most still go like with a top on, even when it's hot outside.

It was such a big thing on the news, and in the end nothing changed. Leave the people their freedom and they do what is best.

Ontario (Canada whole) is so cold... a guy can't even pee outside without his thing turning into a Popsicle. So, why would any woman walk around out in that freezer without a wool turtleneck on?

You'd have to have one of the red dressed Mounties on horse near by her to escort one of those fat, hairy St. Bernard dogs or whatever you call them. To give the poor dame some of that Canadian whiskey or brandy held in that mini barrel around the dogs neck. To revive her.

Canadian women can't dog sled topless either. Too cold outside with the windchill.

 

[blackribbon]

Personally, I prefer when men don't go topless either.

However, why on earth would a woman WANT to go topless? Is the goal to sag before her time? Most women don't go topless in the privacy of their homes so it isn't like it is a desirable state to be in.

I work in a hospital and many women wear undergarments under their gowns FOR COMFORT reasons.

 

[Conscious Z]

The point is, when you remove ethics, morality, common sense, and God from the equation, then ANYthing can be justified if you really think about it.

Ethics is the process of "really thinking about it." I don't know very many atheists -- actually none -- who do not think ethics exist. What you seem to dislike is a desire to have some sort of logical consistency in our ethical beliefs, which is what one is seeking when asking the sorts of questions you've mentioned.

 

[Aureus]

Ontario (Canada whole) is so cold... a guy can't even pee outside without his thing turning into a Popsicle. So, why would any woman walk around out in that freezer without a wool turtleneck on?

You have no concept of the weather in Canada do you? Maybe you should go check the weather in Ontario this week. Rain this coming weekend but its going to be nice weather on Friday ( high 70s ) before it rolls in.

 

[Carrythecross]

Here in Mexico in the popular beaches, topless women is the norm. But, men do look because a woman's breats are sexual.

A good yardstick is to ask, would you want your wife or daughter to be topless while the men looked?

 

[Armoured]

Here in Mexico in the popular beaches, topless women is the norm. But, men do look because a woman's breats are sexual.

A good yardstick is to ask, would you want your wife or daughter to be topless while the men looked?

Only if you are sexist and hypocritical.

Would you care a jot about your husband or son being topless while women looked?

 

[quatona]

A good yardstick is to ask, would you want your wife or daughter to be topless while the men looked?

Why do you think this is a good yardstick, and for answering which precise question do you think it is a good yardstick?

 

[Eudaimonist]

Here in Mexico in the popular beaches, topless women is the norm. But, men do look because a woman's breats are sexual.

The same thing goes for textile beaches. *shrug*

A good yardstick is to ask, would you want your wife or daughter to be topless while the men looked?

A good yardstick for what purpose?

I personally would have no problem with my wife or daughter to be topless while men looked. I can't imagine why that would be an issue.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Archivist]

Which is surely excessive.

Why do people feel the need to dig the heels in against the tiniest social change?

Make it legal for women to go topless tomorrow, I don't think it's going to result in the instant Marseille-isation of the US. I suspect the uptake would be very small.

Yet it will probably take a supreme court ruling, at least, to make it legal. While tonnes of ink and angst is spilled about it.

Equality is important. But aren't there bigger hills to die on? For people on both sides.

Correct. It has been legal for women to go topless in the State of New York for over 20 years. Very few do.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Correct. It has been legal for women to go topless in the State of New York for over 20 years. Very few do.

I would bet that most women in New York State don't even know that toplessness is legal there.

But for those that do, cultural pressures are likely enough to discourage most of them from making the attempt.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Archivist]

Archivist might be on to something here in a greater beneficial sense to men and teenage boys.

Imagine you're a teenage boy and you have a "hot" looking mom. Your house might become a more popular hangout spot for your teenage buddies as your mom walks around the house and backyard topless.

Or if you're a 50 year-old husband with a wife about the same age whose breasts have begun to sag, you can look at her younger 20ish aged sisters, nieces, and probably coworkers on their off time strutting around their perky youthful breasts.

And if you're a 30 year-old guy with a secret sexual attraction to prepubescent girls, now you can get some eye candy watching topless 7 year-old girls skateboard down the street. I'm especially sarcastic about this last point but you get the point.

Have you bothered actually reading this thread. Based on your comments you apparently have not! First, this thread is about having the right to do something, not actually doing it. As I have said numerous times in this thread, I doubt that most women would be going topless, at least initially. If it eventually did become commonplace then few people would pay attention. Have you visited beaches in Europe? Most European men don't pay much attention to the topless women--it is the American men who stop and stare.

Yes, there can be and are cultures where topless women are a far less sexualized thing. But one wonders what the motives are for any American men that are not just championing women going topless but militantly championing it.

Who in this thread has been "militantly" championing women going topless. I have argued throughout this thread that women should have the right to go topless anyplace that men can go topless. I expect that very few would actually do so. But those few who did shouldn't be hauled off to jail simply for doing what men can legally do.

If I have a little girl or even teenage daughter... I don't want any perverts looking at their bare breasts.

See what I've written above.

And if I were a teenage boy I sure wouldn't want any grown men let alone teenage boys looking at and commenting on my mothers naked breasts. I'd be ready to take a gun to the back of some guy's knee caps or at least go to fist blows.

See what is written above.