WHY SALVATION CAN BE LOST

[LoveGodsWord]

Yes, salvation is conditioned on faith apart from faith's works, only the faith itself saves, not its works.

I think you mean that God's forgiveness of sins is conditional on faith apart from works but even here according to the scriptures, Gods' forgiveness is conditional also on repentance and confession of sin *Acts of the Apostles 2:38; Proverbs 28:13; 1 John 1:9; John 3:36; Romans 3:31; 1 John 2:1-4. According to the scriptures, we are saved by grace through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God and not of works lest any man should boast *Ephesians 2:8-9. Obedience to God's law is not how we are saved because all of us have already broken the law and are under it's penalty of condemnation and death *Romans 3:9-23; 2 Corinthians 3:3-11. So it is by God's grace through faith that we are saved through Gods forgiveness of our sins. According to the scriptures, obedience to Gods' law is the fruit of genuine faith of one that is already been given Gods promise of salvation and the fruit of God's work in us *Philippians 2:13 as we believe and follow his word *John 10:26-27. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *James 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *Matthew 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50; Hebrews 10:26-27. Therefore we do not abolish God's law through faith like some people teach but God's law is established in the heart by faith that works by love *Romans 3:31; 1 John 5:3-4; Romans 13:8-10. According to the scriptures, sin (breaking God' commandments and not believing and following God's Word) is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 John 3:6-10; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14 and according to James there is no such thing as faith that does not have the fruit of obedience to Gods' Word. As posted to your friend faith without works is simply the dead faith of devils according to James 2:17-26. Gods Word does not teach lawlessness (without law) *1 John 2:3-4.

Take Care.

 

[Clare73]

I think you mean

I think I mean what I said.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I think I mean what I said.

Then James disagrees with you in James 2:17-27 as Gods' salvation is conditional on believing and following what Gods' Word says. (Matthew 7:21). Anything else according to James is the dead faith of devils who believe but do not follow.

 

[klutedavid]

Yes, salvation is conditioned on faith apart from faith's works, only the faith itself saves, not its works.

Like salvation by faith--"not by works" (Ephesians 2:8-9)
and righteousness (justification) "apart from works" (Romans 3:21, Romans 3:28, Romans 4:5)
was universally understood for 1,500 years to be the teaching of the NT?

One minor correction. SALVATION IS BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH. Never by faith alone.

 

[klutedavid]

YES, I do! But the problem is that many believers misunderstand what being saved means.

Bear with me and I will clarify for your understanding. When an unbeliever comes to faith, we say he is born-again and SAVED, right? But being 'saved' in this context is merely an expression of the promise of eternal life made to such a believer. No believer in the flesh has the real substance of eternal life, it is only given after the resurrection/rapture after we endure in Christ in this life.

If you still don't believe me, consider the passage below because it corroborates my case.

Matt 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end shall be saved.

What stands out in this text is that Jesus was addressing the disciples. Hopefully, you agree that they, save Judas Iscariot, were all saved/born again? So, if they were already saved/born again at the time of the Olivet discourse, what then did Jesus mean by "shall be saved"; future tense?

• The key is, "he that endures to the end". End of what? Mortal life, of course!
• Therefore, "shall be saved" in this context refers to the reward of immortality and eternal life in the next age after satisfactorily enduring the trials of this age and not denying Christ.
• Matt 24:13 is one of the uncontestable passages that prove that salvation can be lost because it makes no sense if there's no possibility of the saved walking away from Christ.
• Also, at the end of each of the letters to the seven churches in Revelation, the Lord concluded each one with the warning "to him that overcomes/endures AND kept my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations (Rev 2:26)."
• Again, we see the gift of eternal life [saved] as a proviso to overcome/enduing in the Lord to the end of a believer's mortal life.

Hope this helps...

Have another read of your post and compare it to the verse below.

“Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

 

[klutedavid]

Then James disagrees with you in James 2:17-27 as Gods' salvation is conditional on believing and following what Gods' Word says. (Matthew 7:21). Anything else according to James is the dead faith of devils who believe but do not follow.

God's salvation is never conditional upon filthy works, constant failed attempts at obeying the law.

God's salvation is granted as a gift for believing in Jesus Christ. You can either accept the free gift or reject the free gift.

With Jesus Christ we are dealing with absolute promises, never conditional promises. God has promised that anyone who calls on the name of the lord, is saved. That is present and future tense.

You don't believe what God said LGW, do you?

Romans 10:13
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

 

[LoveGodsWord]

God's salvation is never conditional upon filthy works, constant failed attempts at obeying the law.

God's salvation is granted as a gift for believing in Jesus Christ. You can either accept the free gift or reject the free gift.

With Jesus Christ we are dealing with absolute promises, never conditional promises. God has promised that anyone who calls on the name of the lord, is saved. That is present and future tense.

You don't believe what God said LGW, do you?

Romans 10:13
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Matthew 7:21 [21], Not every one that said to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven.

I do indeed believe Gods' Word but no one can claim to believe Gods' Word by not doing what Gods' Word says. Gods salvation is conditional (linked) on believing and obeying what Gods' Word says according to the scriptures. Anything else is the dead faith of devils according to James in James 2:17-26.

Take Care.

 

[klutedavid]

Then James disagrees with you in James 2:17-27 as Gods' salvation is conditional on believing and following what Gods' Word says. (Matthew 7:21). Anything else according to James is the dead faith of devils who believe but do not follow.

Wrong again LGW. James agrees with me.

James 2:22-23
Thou seest that faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect; and the scripture was fulfilled which saith, And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness; and he was called the friend of God.

James is talking about perfecting your faith. Works will perfect your faith.

Think of any work?

I will help that old lady across the street, bingo, perfect faith.

Romans 10:13
For “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

 

[klutedavid]

Matthew 7:21 [21], Not every one that said to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven.

I do indeed believe Gods' Word but no one can claim to believe Gods' Word by not doing what Gods' Word says. Gods salvation is conditional (linked) on believing and obeying what Gods' Word says according to the scriptures. Anything else is the dead faith of devils according to James in James 2:17-26.

Take Care.

What is the will of the Father?

John 6:40
For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.

The free gift of salvation was granted to you while you were dead in your sin.

The free gift is given to those who believe in Jesus.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Wrong again LGW. James agrees with me. James 2:22-23 Thou seest that faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect; and the scripture was fulfilled which saith, And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness; and he was called the friend of God. James is talking about perfecting your faith. Works will perfect your faith.

According to the scriptures genuine faith and works are not separate from each other. Genuine faith in God's Word is obedience to what Gods' Word says. Let's consider all the scripture you have posted here (not some of it) and the full scripture and chapter context if it might be helpful.

James 2:14-26
[14], What does it profit, my brothers, though a man say he has faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

• Note the question being asked can faith without works save anyone? James goes on to answer this question in the rest of the chapter.

[15], If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
[16], And one of you say to them, Depart in peace, be you warmed and filled; notwithstanding you give them not those things which are needful to the body; what does it profit?

• Note James provides the example of someone who has no clothes or food and a person saying to them be warm and full of food without giving them food and clothes. How does this help the person who needs food and clothes?

[17], Even so faith, if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

• Note the response of James. Just like saying to the naked and hungry be warmed and filled without giving them food and clothes, faith if it does not have action is dead (not true faith) being alone. James continues...

[18], Yes, a man may say, You have faith, and I have works: show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.

• Note: James is showing that genuine faith is not separate from our actions and it is our actions that demonstrate if we have genuine faith or not.

[19], You believe that there is one God; you do well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
[20], But will you know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

• Note: James goes on to show that there is a difference between genuine faith which is not separate from our actions and dead faith that has no action and compare it to the dead faith of devils in [19-20]

[21], Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son on the altar?

• Note: Abraham's faith led him to action by following what Gods' Word said in making an offering our of his own son. Now note all the above is the context to your claim of faith without works which is stating the opposite of what you are claiming here.

[22], See you how faith worked with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

• Note: James here is continuing what has already been shared in the scriptures so far by using Abraham's example of believing Gods' Word and obeying Gods' Word to offer up his son as an offering showing that it was Abraham's obedience to Gods' Word that made his faith perfect.

[23], And the scripture was fulfilled which said, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed to him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
[24], You see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

• Note: James is showing here that genuine faith and what it means to truly believe God is to believe and obey what Gods' Word says.

[25], Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
[26], For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

..................

Conclusion: James is showing in full scripture context of James 2:14-26 that genuine faith in Gods Word is not separate from action and that if we have faith in God's Word we will believe and obey what God's Word says. Therefore faith is not separate from obedience to God's Word. Genuine faith is obeying what Gods' Word says from the heart. Anything else is the dead faith of devils.

Take Care.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

What is the will of the Father?

John 6:40
For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.

The free gift of salvation was granted to you while you were dead in your sin.

The free gift is given to those who believe in Jesus.

As shown above faith without works is dead. Genuine faith leads to obeying what Gods' Word says. If we believe in Jesus we will believe and obey what Jesus says (see Matthew 7:21).

Take Care.

 

[Clare73]

Then James disagrees with you in James 2:17-27 as Gods' salvation is conditional on believing and following what Gods' Word says. (Matthew 7:21). Anything else according to James is the dead faith of devils who believe but do not follow.

Then James disagrees with Paul, an apostle, which James was not.

Take it up with James.

 

[Clare73]

One minor correction. SALVATION IS BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH. Never by faith alone.

Yep! And faith is always by grace and no other way, because it is a gift! (Philippians 1:29; 2 Peter 1:1; Acts 13:48; Acts 18:27; Romans 12:3). It not of our own doing.

Salvation is by faith alone in terms of faith's works, it is the only the faith itself which saves, not faith's works: "by grace through faith, not by works." (Ephesians 2:8-9).

 

[GDL]

Romans 10:

Faith and Obedience are parallel:

Romans 10:3-4: Paul says the problem with the unbelieving of Israel is that they have not subordinated/subjected themselves to the Righteousness of/from God, which is [Jesus] Christ in whom they must believe

• Immediately in context, Paul parallels obedience (submission) with belief/faith

• Paul continues this parallelism of faith and obedience in Romans 10:16 where he again parallels obedience to the Gospel with belief/faith in the Gospel

• Faith and obedience are parallels (see also Hebrews 3:18-19; 1 John 3:23)

Faith and Confession – Calling upon the name of the Lord - are required for Salvation:

Romans 10:9-13:

• To make his case, Paul is drawing from Joel 2:32 for the OT quote in Romans 10:13

• Paul makes salvation in the future tense (you will be saved) as being conditioned upon (“If you…”) Faith and Confession

• Paul writes Romans 10:9-12 in a Chiasm: the 2 confession clauses are parallel to one another and the 2 believe clauses are parallel to one another; belief is the central point with confession tied to belief. So:

• IF you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord (YHWH per Joel 2:32 and remember that Paul is mainly addressing the salvation of Israelites) – confession for salvation

• IF you believe with your heart that God resurrected Jesus/Lord/YHWH – belief for righteousness

• So: belief in the resurrected Jesus/Lord/YHWH and confession of the resurrected Jesus/Lord/YHWH for righteousness and salvation (future)

• For another parallel of belief and confession, see John 12:42-46. Note how Jesus is drawing on Isaiah (John 12:38-40) as Paul does in Romans 10:16. Note how Jesus is addressing faith and confession as Paul is doing in Romans 10:9-13.

• If you want to see what God thinks of those who profess (same word as confess) to know Him, but don’t live like it (disobedience and thus no faith), see Titus 1:16. Note that denying God in works is disobedience. Know that the first word used by Paul to describe such people means “disgusting.”

So:

• Clearly, faith & obedience & confession (calling on the name of the Lord/YHWH) are required for righteousness and salvation. What does this do for the “faith alone” – faith reduced to absurdity - theory?

• If we look at all the parsing of verbs in these Romans 10 verses, we have a mixture of aorist and presents tenses. The question, as usual, ends up being whether belief and therefore obedience, confession, calling, are one-time actions, or continuous through a lifetime action? Then, can we believe, obey, confess, call, and then fall/walk away? And if we believe, obey, confess, call, and then walk away and thus stop believing, obeying, confessing, calling (and working per James 2 and Titus 1), does the Lord/Christ/YHWH honor our decision, or force us to abide/remain and just use His warnings to show how He forces us to abide/remain? Scripture seems quite clear once we shed the false gospel and cease reducing Biblical Faith to absurdity.

• Romans 10 makes the case for Biblical Faith for salvation (future) being much more than the oversimplified and one-time belief supported by some. We come to faith/obedience/confession by the work of God in grace drawing us by teaching us (John 6) and we remain/abide (John 15 commands) and grow in this condition (2 Peter 3:17-18 command vs. the opposite = falling away) in God’s Salvation Plan and Process until we take our last breath here.

 

[Danthemailman]

Then James disagrees with Paul, an apostle, which James was not.

Take it up with James.

In James James 2:14 we read of one who merely says/claims they have faith, but they have no works (to evidence their claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith. Simple!

James is discussing the evidence evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18) and not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God. (Romans 4:2-3)

 

[Clare73]

Salvation is by faith alone in terms of/relation to faith's works, it is the only the faith itself which saves, not faith's works: "by grace through faith, not by works." (Ephesians 2:8-9).

True faith saves.
True faith obeys.
But it is not faith's obedience which saves, it is only faith itself, apart from its works which saves (Ephesians 2:8-9).

And that's because "Salvation is the Lord's!" (Revelation 7:10, Revelation 19:1),
his and his alone! (Revelation 4:11, Revelation 7:12)
Man cannot say he contributed anything. . .whatsoever! (Ephesians 2:9; Romans 4:21;
1 Corinthians 1:29).
For God neither gives nor shares his glory with another! (Isaiah 48:5, Isaiah 42:8)

Having been to the third heaven (2 Corinthians 12:1-8) and given understanding of its importance and necessity, Paul is most emphatic that salvation and justification are apart from faith's works (Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 4:2; Acts 13:39; Romans 3:20-21; Galatians 2:16, Galatians 3:11), but which necessary obedience (faith's works) leads to righteousness (Romans 6:16) leading to holiness (Romans 6:19) of sanctification (not salvation or justification), which sanctification is God's will for the believer
(1 Thessalonians 4:3).

One either believes the clear and unequivocal Biblical testimony above, or tries to unseat it.

 

[GDL]

NKJ Ephesians 2:1-3 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, 2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, 3 among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.

• You were dead in trespasses and sins

• You used to walk in trespasses and sins like the world does

• You used to walk in trespasses and sins in obedience to the spirit who works in the sons of disobedience

• You once functioned in the lusts of flesh and fulfilled the desires of flesh and mind – you too were sons of disobedience – children under God’s wrath

• When you were existing in this dead, disobedient, under God’s wrath condition, God made you alive

• God transitioned you from death to life.

• Nothing here says this life will continue/remain

NKJ Ephesians 2:4-10 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

• God in mercy and love made us alive together with Christ when we were dead in trespasses and sins

• (By Grace you have been saved)

• “Saved” in context is when God gave us life when we were dead

• The language focuses on the current state of those who were dead based upon God’s past action of having given them life. It does not say anything about our remaining in this state.

• God also raised us up together [with Christ] and made us to sit together in the heavens in Christ Jesus

• Are we there yet? Is this positional or actual and physical?

• The language about “saved” says nothing about a continuing state, and this says nothing about a continuing position.

7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus

• This is all about God’s Plan and what He intends to do in the future in Christ. Again, there is nothing being said here assuring our abiding/remaining.

8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

• “For” (2:8) indicates that all that has been said previously in context will now be explained:

• Our salvation (life from death, positioned in Christ) through faith is:

• [God’s] grace & gift

• Not due to our works, so we cannot boast

• Explanation (“for” (2:10) will explain 2:8-9):

• We are God’s workmanship

• God created us in Christ Jesus for good works that God prepared before for us to walk in

This is not automatically taking us to Paul’s discussion on “works of righteousness” or "works of law," which are technical discussions dealing with the previous age. In context it’s simple to see that Paul is just clarifying that God’s Salvation is: God’s Plan, not ours; given by God in grace and mercy as a gift that we did not do any work for that we could boast about; that only God could make us alive from death; only God could create us; only God could position us in Christ; only God created good works for us to do; and only God can do as He intends to use all of this to show things about Himself in the future.

There is no way we could make ourselves alive when we were dead, so there’s no way we could take ourselves out of our sinful/disobedient condition. God had to do this for us. There’s no way we could position ourselves in Christ Jesus apart from God’s Plan, God’s Salvation, God’s work, mercy and grace, God’s workmanship, God’s creating us to do good works that God has prepared for us to do.

The point of these verses is that Salvation is God’s Plan and ultimately His Work. This does not say we do nothing within His Plan. In fact, it says we are no longer living in trespasses and sins – in death - and it says we will be doing good works (thus speaking of faith + works). And it speaks of a future (abiding) through faith and good works that God will use to show His vast grace and kindness in Christ Jesus.

There is nothing in the grammar that says that some undefined, one-time faith is being discussed and that our abiding is assured. The grammar pointedly says that those Paul was speaking to, that were living changed lives, stood before him at the time of writing, saved. Nothing in “saved” here says they will remain saved.

There is much to show that our faith and good works are included in God’s Salvation Plan that He and He alone (in this context) created and sovereignly administrates, and that this will all reveal things about Him in the future (abiding is thus inferred).

 

[Clare73]

.
"Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He. . .set his seal of ownership on us and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come."(2 Corinthians 1:21-22)

Also in 2 Corinthians 5:5; 1 Corinthians 1:8.

"We were made heirs, having been predestined according to the plan of him who works out everything in accordance with the purpose of his will." (Ephesians 1:11)

"You who. . .have believed in him were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, (Ephesians 1:13-14)

". . .for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose. (Philippians 2:13)

"Those he predestined, he also called; those he called he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified." (Romans 8:30)

"No one can come unless the Father has enabled him." (John 6:65)

"All that the Father gives me will come to me." (John 6:37)

"I shall lose none of all that he has given me," (John 6:39)

 

[Rapture Bound]

GDL stated [post #994], "Faith and Obedience are parallel:"

My reply :

It all depends upon what you mean by "parallel" :

Keep in mind, that here I'm speaking about the relationship between
faith and obedience as it concerns the issue of a person's
justified status before God.

Synonyms for "parallel" include "similar" and "equivalent"

Faith and obedience certainly are not equivalent or synonymous terms.

If that were the case, this is how Ephesians 2:8 would read by
substituting the word "obedience" for "faith" :

"For by grace are ye saved through [obedience]; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:"

So, if faith and obedience were actually equivalent terms, a couple of important question arises, "whose obedience are we saved by? Christ's, or our own?"... and what do we do with the phrase, "that not of yourselves?"

The Greek construction of Ephesians 2:8 plainly reveals that the "it" ["it is the gift of God"] refers to salvation [a justified status before God] and encompasses and refers back to the totality of the remainder of the verse - "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves"

We must all decide between two truth claims :

(1) we are saved [justified] by grace, through faith in Christ's atoning work;
making salvation an unmerited [unearned] gift.

(2) we are saved [justified] by our obedience [compliance to an order or law];
making salvation a merited [earned] gift.

My choice is clearly (1) - which demonstrates that any person's attempt at boasting in their "worthiness", "deservedness" or "goodness" [in order to justification] is truly a delusion that must be smashed to the ground [the true gospel must be proclaimed].

Romans 3:26-28, " For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law."

The priceless gift of eternal life, merited solely by Jesus for our sake, can only be received or [accredited] to us by faith in by His obedience [perfect fulfilling of, and compliance to the law of God] and His nailing it to the cross [substitutionary atoning work].

Colossians 2:14," Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;"

Romans 4:1-5,"What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted [accredited] unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness."

So yes, in one sense, and one sense only, justification is conditional. It is conditioned upon a person's trusting in the righteousness of Christ [rather than their own] for the saving of their soul. Salvation is not automatic, a person must come to the place where they realize that they are sinners and worthy of condemnation, and make the choice of receiving the forgiveness and imputed righteousness of God that can only come through the merits of Jesus Christ.

John 1:12,"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:"

Should we understand this as a condition of justification? ...certainly ... it is a necessary condition to be fulfilled on the part of the sinner, but it must primarily be viewed as a free, unmerited [undeserved] gift!

And yes, saving faith will bring with it a willing and obedient heart to carry out the will of God as the result of the new heart that was received exclusively through faith [i.e. - trusting in Christ's righteousness on our behalf] at a believer's new birth experience.

 

[GDL]

Some context:

Romans 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose.

• Purpose = God's Plan He set forth in advance
• God's Plan is for His called-out ones - those who love God (which is to obey God, which is to have Faith in God)
• So, yes, just like Ephesians 2, Salvation is God's Plan and ultimately His work even though we in faith do good works He created for us to do

8:29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren.

• Explanation for 8:28
• Within God's Plan, God foreknew and predestined His called ones - those who love Him - to be conformed to be like Christ their first-born brother in God's family

8:30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.

• Continuing explanation of God's Plan
• Predestination to Christlikeness > Called > Justified > Glorified
• God's Predetermined Plan is all in place

8:31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us?

• No one can oppose God's Plan for us

Once again, as in Ephesians 2, the same Paul speaks of God's Plan, which is not our plan, nor anything we worked to put into place.

Nothing is said here to assure abiding for those who fall away

God's Plan is for those who love God. Those who fall away from God, do not love God, do not obey God, do not believe in God