Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

[tas8831]

OK, long as you realize your religious past modeling is an exercise in deception and futility.

Why would I want to emulate you?


You rely on different definitions past and do not even realize it. Your religion forces you to engage in activity that makes you and your religion look foolish, so please continue unabated!~

 

[dad]

Why would I want to emulate you?


You rely on different definitions past and do not even realize it. Your religion forces you to engage in activity that makes you and your religion look foolish, so please continue unabated!~

You deny the evidence for creation that screams out and shouts all around us. You cling to a fantasy nature in the past, upon which you predicate all conceptions of the future and past, and origins claims.

In the end, what science is all about is real bad religion. Completely false prophesies.

I saw this article at RT.

"
Harvard physicists say they know how and, roughly, when the world will end
according to a recent study by experts at Harvard University, published in the journal Physical Review D, all it will take is a destabilization of the one particle thought to give all matter its mass - Higgs boson.

None of us are expected to make it to the grand finale – some 11 trillion years away, based on the team’s predictions – so you won’t mind if we ruin the ending. Unless, of course, you plan on being one of the lucky reincarnated ones in which case: Spoiler alert.

When that detrimental destabilization happens, the world will explode into a huge evaporating bubble of energy and, evidently, will destroy everything in the universe - yes you did read that right, all wannabe Mars colonizers will be wiped out too.

What is slightly concerning is that the physicists say the process could have already begun. Unless someone or something manages to locate the elusive “God Particle” in our infinite universe we won’t ever know when the end is nigh.

It’s also likely the sun will burn up and various other catastrophic celestial events will take place before we reach that particular doomsday.


You are welcome to your religion.

Harvard physicists say they know how and, roughly, when the world will end

 

[tas8831]

You deny the evidence for creation that screams out and shouts all around us.

Please present 2 pieces of actual, verifiable, empirical evidence that screams out and shouts Genesis I and/or II are correct all around us.

No attacks on evolution, none of this dopey 'different states past' malarkey.

Let's see if you have more than shouting from the street corner.

 

[PsychoSarah]

OK, long as you realize your religious past modeling is an exercise in deception and futility.

You say that, but your "different state past" idea is undeniably a product of typical scientific discovery and experimentation. If you actually viewed the bible as flawless, 100% truth, then why do your personal beliefs cater in any regard to scientific observations? You'd never conclude that the planet should appear old because of a different state past in any regard based on the bible alone. So, why aren't you going out there stating that the planet DOESN'T look old?

 

[dad]

Please present 2 pieces of actual, verifiable, empirical evidence that screams out and shouts Genesis I and/or II are correct all around us.

Women, hummingbirds, and stars.

I mean, do you really think this came from pond slime??

 

[dad]

You say that, but your "different state past" idea is undeniably a product of typical scientific discovery and experimentation. If you actually viewed the bible as flawless, 100% truth, then why do your personal beliefs cater in any regard to scientific observations? You'd never conclude that the planet should appear old because of a different state past in any regard based on the bible alone. So, why aren't you going out there stating that the planet DOESN'T look old?

It is the religion of modern science, not any nature in the past that makes things look old to some.

If not for God and His word, we would not conclude a lot of things. That does not mean they are nor very real.

 

[Divide]

Then you are not a hindu because you wish to continue eating cows.

Such arguments are as bad as it gets.

But hey, whatever you need to tell yourself to satisfy your superiority complex.

I never said I was Hindu. Nothing wrong with a good steak, lol.

 

[Brightmoon]

"dad, post: 72512400, member: 98011"]I would tend to agree that it would do that...now. The thing is it was THEN. Not now.
Demonstrate that what you said is accurate

Great. In the final stages of the nature change we would land in this nature...hence, a lot of heat would be expected on land and the sea.

Oh? How do you know that? Source?

Because the earliest rocks we can find are from igneous cratons

I disagree. That is your belief based conception. Try to remember man has not been more than about 10 miles down. Ha.

Seismic waves can determine if something is liquid or solid. Under that much pressure, rock would also have to be hot

If the inner earth was as you think, and the move happened in this nature, you might have a point.

That happened in this nature. By the way, changing the spin or rotation or axis or orbits of bodies in the solar system could be a feature of the nature change.

Humans and other macrolife (animals and plants) couldn’t live thru disturbances that would drastically change the rate of spin of this planet. A relatively small bolide wiped out most of the dinosaurs


After all a lot of debris out there in the solar system exists now, and a lot of craters from falling debris etc etc. Try to remember that the godless little belief based models of the so called science religion are not the only ideas/models.beliefs.[/QUOTE]

I’m not an atheist

Euarchontoglires are one of my favorite super-orders, and not just because I am one.

Oh yeah, roughly the Roberts and rabbits and rodents

 

[Brightmoon]

Women are apes just like any other human . Hummingbirds are dinosaurs like any other bird and stars are balls of very hot mostly hydrogen gas plasma.
So what was your point?

 

[Divide]

-_- if that were actually true, scientific investigations stimulated by the prospect of learning more about "gods creation" would have resulted in observations which supported the idea that the planet, etc., was created. Instead, those people kept finding information that contradicted that idea.

Hmm. It seems to me that observations both supporting and denying creation have been made and continue to be made. I can easily accept the ones supporting creation, because He sent one of His Angels to me one time, and actually spoke to me another time...nevertheless, I don't know it all and for all I know a couple other things may have happened. Maybe there was a gap period in Genesis between the creation of earth, and the creation of man? Perhaps even...13 billion years?! I don't know for sure as I wasn't there. Or maybe even God designed His creation to appear old, to get us to take it on faith? I dunno for sure. What I do know is He IS real.

Nah, I am extremely biased in the FAVOR of believing in the existence of deities, the afterlife, etc. I sincerely WANT those things to exist, but alas, the evidence in supporting that conclusion is extremely lacking. Consider this; you claim to have personally interacted with an angel on at least one occasion, but you know for a fact that this is not a common experience and all claimed instances aren't recorded properly such that people not present can also experience them. This is the same as if I claimed that it is "obvious that my sister has brown eyes, and the evidence is there for everyone to see" while I don't even produce a picture of my sister.

Once again, you Sarah are the exception to the rule here. You are intelligent and prolly easily 20-30 points higher in IQ than most others on this board, lol. Ok, so I've interacted with an Angel so God has been proven to me. That makes it easy to step outside and...look at that tree, whoa. I can see God's fingerprints on that tree myself. I can't make a tree, can you?
Nevertheless, you're making a pretty good point here. I don't have a picture of my Sister to post! All I have is my word, and yeah, I'm as dumb as the next guy is, contrary to popular belief that I somehow think I'm superior, which I am not. But I know one thing...truth is self evident when you see it, unless you don't want to see it for some reason. At least up to a point! You know this, that's why you experiment and think them through. And when you happen across something that does work or makes sense (or doesn't) you know it then. What I know about God is that He wants us to take it on faith first and put our trust in Him...and then He comes and reveals Himself to us. That's how it worked for me. He doesn't want to prove it first. I can't say why, I don't know why. His thoughts and ways are above our thoughts and ways.

We won't state it because it doesn't exist. Just think critically for 1 moment; what logical reason would a person effortfully deny the existence of a deity they internally know exists IF THE END RESULT IS GOING TO HELL? All the various reasons creationists come up for "why people deny the existence of the god they internally believe exists" are extraordinarily weak. The most common one, the "they don't want to stop sinning/be accountable for their actions in the afterlife" makes absolutely no sense. Obviously, if the deity exists, we are going to be judged, and being in denial doesn't prevent that any more than being in denial of the existence of police officers means not being held accountable for crimes. I don't want the events of the Holocaust to have actually happened, but I am not delusional enough to think that denying the events happened makes them no longer have an impact.

That's what I like about you, you can make a man think. Ok. No logical reason I can think of. But! Perhaps...there really is a spiritual war going on? And (if so), then, no wonder they do not publish the entire truth as they would be trying to hide God's existence from the people and make them doubt. Some people ARE denying that the holocaust ever happened! Consider this: The absolute best lies, are the ones couched in truth. Put out some truth, mix in some lies...it makes it hard to distinguish what is truth. The truth IS out there, but we have to mine for it. A little here, a little there.

Furthermore, you are making claims about the thoughts of people other than yourself; thoughts you cannot actually confirm in any way. Yet, as an actual atheist, I know I don't secretly believe in any deities, so your claim just comes off as ridiculous and pointless. Do you think I would regularly cry myself to sleep at night over fear from my inevitable death if I thought an afterlife existed?

This sounds right, lol. I don't know what is in anyones heart here. I can not confirm that, correct. I suppose it would suffice to say, I suspect that many atheists have unspoken ulterior motive. But what do I know? Only that God does exist...and not much ,more, lol! So, Touche' Sister!

For some, it's just because they like debating. Or are all Christians on Islam boards seeking Allah?

Touche' again, lol.

You guys do yourself a favor here...take a real good look at this nice lady. She isn't juvenile and all huh-uh, or taking jabs at people founded in nothing except stupidity. You would do well to follow her example.

 

[Brightmoon]

Oh and dad , I’d have to agree about your belief being Last Thursdayism

 

[Brightmoon]

="Divide, post: 72527755, member: 397388"]Hmm. It seems to me that observations both supporting and denying creation have been made and continue to be made. I can easily accept the ones supporting creation, because He sent one of His Angels to me one time, and actually spoke to me another time...nevertheless, I don't know it all and for all I know a couple other things may have happened. Maybe there was a gap period in Genesis between the creation of earth, and the creation of man? Perhaps even...13 billion years?! I don't know for sure as I wasn't there. Or maybe even God designed His creation to appear old, to get us to take it on faith? I dunno for sure. What I do know is He IS real.

humans separated from the chimp lineage around 7 million years ago and the earth is around 4.5 billion years old . Most Americans,at least, who accept evolution are Christians or other believers. Most Christians accept evolution . At least half of professional biologists are believers. Your mischaracterization of people-who-accept-evolution as atheists is annoying because we are not all atheists as well as this being a silly lie.



: The absolute best lies, are the ones couched in truth. Put out some truth, mix in some lies...it makes it hard to distinguish what is truth. The truth IS out there, but we have to mine for it. A little here, a little there.


This is why I’ve never accepted creationism because of the pseudoscience nonsense [/QUOTE]

 

[Divide]

Here are some things the New Testament teaches that I guarantee you not only don't adhere to, but that you'll never adhere to even though I make you aware of them:

Cut off your hands and gouge out your eyes if you commit a sin with them (Matthew 5:29-30). Recall that the New Testament considers thinking about committing sins equal to actually committing them.

Hey, I never said I was perfect. I try to be good and to walk with honor. No, I haven't gouged out my eyes and don't think I ever would. I don't have it in me to do that.

Don't defend yourself if you are attacked by another person (Matthew 5:39)

Oh, I'm big on defense. I've been a gun guy since I was a kid. This is a deep subject that may deserve it's own thread if you'd like to hear more of my views on defense. It's prolly too much for this thread and would derail the topic.

Don't pray in public (Matthew 6:6)

I do not pray in public.

Don't respect other people (1 Timothy 5:21 and James 2:1-10)

I try to respect people as much as possible. I have good days and bad days. Can I be provoked? You bet I can be. I try not to be, but it happens here and there. Nobody's perfect. I think I am getting better at it.

Don't lie (quite a few verses, and considering that NOT speaking your mind exactly as it is happens to be a lie of omission, good luck with actually trying to follow this one while not breaking any rules about lust, etc.)

Don't judge other people (Matthew 7:1 and Luke 6:37) A ton of other commands can't be followed without inevitably breaking this one.

I don't consciously lie. At least 99% of the time anyway. I used to tell my Wife (who would lie about anything, even petty stuff for which there was no reason to lie) that we should not lie to one another, even if it's bad news. This will do two things. 1, it will let me know the real score of a situation so we can begin to solve the problem rather than chasing rabbit trails, and 2, it will reaffirm that we can trust what comes out of each others mouth no matter what. That's important.

I'm getting better at not judging people. People are really not the enemy. Scripture says, we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but evil spirits (Ephesians 6:12-13)
[Understand that the enemy is not the enemy in his own eyes. This may offer you an opportunity to make him your friend. If not, you can kill him without hate, and quickly. (Lazarus Long)] Lol, I've always liked that one.

Heal sick people, cast out devils, and raise the dead (Matthew 10:8) I don't think it is within your power to accomplish this.

It is not within my power. It is God that does the healing. But, no I have never layed hands on someone and they were healed. I tried it and it didn't happen.
The Lord DID heal ME once though! He reset my dislocated hip. (No insurance no money, layed in bed for a few days, prayed before going to sleep to be healed while I slept. Was woke up with intense heat in my hip. Heat subsided, went back to sleep. Thought about what happened in the night, remembered praying to be healed and recalled hearing healing testimony's from people and they described a heat sensation while being healed. Checked my hip...it was ok!)

I had the unction to raise the dead one time...I chickened out and did not try. I was right there. But no, I was afraid what the family may think blah blah blah. I still regret not trying. I didn't make up that unction, I was being prompted. I think. We'll never know now because I chickened out like a worm.

And many more. It's fairly well known that following all the commands in the NT is not possible, so to claim that someone's beliefs could ever be dictated by an unwillingness to follow these commands is to neglect to recognize that no one, believer or otherwise, does.

Yeah, I know Sarah. I dunno, maybe I was feeling arrogant that day, or was irritated by someone's juvenile comments or something. But! Christians aren't perfect, just forgiven! I'm trying. I don't give up trying to be a good man to everyone and walk with honor. My dad taught me when I was young...When you stop being better, you stop being good. So I'll keep trying and I will be better tomorrow than I am today.

Blessings be upon you Sister.

 

[Brightmoon]

I just got finished watching a movie called “something the lord made” . Speaking of raising the dead . It was about the two men and one woman who were responsible for the current ability to operate on the heart . The movie was about the black man Vivien Thomas (Vivien is actually a man’s name the woman’s version is Vivienne ) with just a high school diploma he ended up teaching surgical techniques on the heart at Johns Hopkins . This is a true story . That’s the modern version of raising the dead - using modern medicine to save lives.

 

[Divide]

Do YOU?

This is a bit off topic, but I am curious - you seem religious. Do YOU think Trump is a great Christian, chosen by God (as many prominent evangelicals have claimed)? If so, why?

No, I don't. I try to, but I fail regularly. I am not religious, but I seek the true God and a relationship with Him.

Trump? How would I know what Trump has in his heart? I've never met the man or talked to him. I am well aware that many Christians say that he...had a visitation from the Lord and the Lord put him in office...Is it absolutely true? I have no proof of that one way or the other. Am I inclined to believe it?! You bet I am. The fix was in! Hillary was supposed to win, all monies had been paid! Then Trump won...Huh. So it could very well be so what they say. Why do you think she's so [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]ed that she lost?! God jerked the rug out from under her! That's funny.

But I don't have any proof for you guys. So, who knows?

 

[Brightmoon]

A self centered narcissistic misogynist racist who likes chaos and I don’t think it was God who wanted him in power. Hmmm! Hitler won because most German people didn’t vote . Trump grabbed the fundie vote by putting mike pence on the ticket. You don’t have to guess at what Trump is thinking because he has a motor mouth .

 

[Divide]

humans separated from the chimp lineage around 7 million years ago and the earth is around 4.5 billion years old . Most Americans,at least, who accept evolution are Christians or other believers. Most Christians accept evolution . At least half of professional biologists are believers. Your mischaracterization of people-who-accept-evolution as atheists is annoying because we are not all atheists as well as this being a silly lie.

That could very well be brother. It may turn out to be true that God did create the world, then (4.5 billion or 13 billion years, depends who's stuff you read, could be either)...went by and maybe evolution did happen some during that period? I really don't know. Your point of my characterization of atheists is acknowledged and point well taken. That was a bad call on my part.

This is why I’ve never accepted creationism because of the pseudoscience nonsense

Ok, your turn...you can't call that psudoscience. You don't know like I don't know. You weren't there, I wasn't there. Eh!

I now suspect that...the truth is likely somewhere between the two extremes of this debate, with portions of each being true...we just don't see how they mesh together yet. Maybe.

 

[MoneyGuy]

You don’t have to guess at what Trump is thinking because he has a motor mouth .

Motor finger, too. He can't not tweet.

 

[Divide]

I just got finished watching a movie called “something the lord made” . Speaking of raising the dead . It was about the two men and one woman who were responsible for the current ability to operate on the heart . The movie was about the black man Vivien Thomas (Vivien is actually a man’s name the woman’s version is Vivienne ) with just a high school diploma he ended up teaching surgical techniques on the heart at Johns Hopkins . This is a true story . That’s the modern version of raising the dead - using modern medicine to save lives.

I got nothing against modern medicine. I'm not one of those wackos who wouldn't take my kid to the doctor. But modern medicine is a lot like everything else....some good, some bad. More people die from medical malpractice than gun & alcohol related, combined. So it behooves us to use our heads. But the fact does remain that modern medicine does save lives. Prolly less than it kills, lol but it does.

That last line is largely a joke brother.

Sounds like a good movie. I'm going to look for that.

 

[Divide]

That’s the modern version of raising the dead - using modern medicine to save lives.

Do you, not believe that people have been raised from the dead. I mean from the dead dead, not just sick?

From what I hear, it happens fairly regularly in Africa. The reason it happens there is that, they have not been indoctrinated against belief like we are in the US. So when they establish faith, they believe what those scriptures say!