Why is "MAGA" offensive?

[cow451]

Polls show about 53% of Democrats support it.

New Polling Reveals Percentage Of Democrats Who Support Open Borders. It Is Terrifying

It's funny how liberals all pretend like they haven't heard the same things everyone else has a million times. We all know that a lot of Democrats support open borders...the only reason to pretend otherwise is deception.

The poll doesn’t say that but nice try. 53% said that those immigrants that make it across the border should be allowed to stay. Combined with the other poll questions it is clear that no question about open borders was asked. The poll report is 229 pages. Try reading some of it instead of allowing second rate media to spoon feed you.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Oh yeah, what ever did the USA do for the 220+ years it existed without ICE?
tulc(shudders to think what would happen if it went away)

Who exactly would you like to deport all the illegals if we get rid of ICE?

Or would you prefer we stop deporting illegals?

 

[EpiscipalMe]

Some Democrat voters do. I've heard both sentiments here on CF. I don't know about Democrat politicians.

Have you checked the numbers on that?



A poster I was responding to did that...did you not read the posts?

Of course you are going to find voters who want all sorts of things.

I should have been clearer that I meant the Democrat politicians who make policy. Show me examples of Dem leaders who are either for open borders or who think opposition to illegal immigration is racist.

 

[Ana the Ist]

The poll doesn’t say that but nice try. 53% said that those immigrants that make it across the border should be allowed to stay.

That's an open border policy....they may not be calling it that, but it's definitely what they're describing.

Open border - Wikipedia

 

[tulc]

I bet they dont want to abolish TSA (the other three letter) security agency, anything on that?

It would appear some people also want to get rid of TSA:
https://thefederalist.com/2019/01/18/government-shutdown-perfect-time-finally-abolish-tsa/
The Government Shutdown Reveals Another Reason to Abolish the TSA | Ryan McMaken
tulc(hopes this helps)

 

[Radagast]

Of course you are going to find voters who want all sorts of things.

I should have been clearer that I meant the Democrat politicians who make policy. Show me examples of Dem leaders who are either for open borders or who think opposition to illegal immigration is racist.

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has repeatedly said that opposition to illegal immigration is racist. She's not the only one.

 

[SummerMadness]

It’s Time To Decriminalize Immigration, Say Top Texas Dems


It’s Time To Decriminalize Immigration, Say Top Texas Dems

Where is the quote calling for open borders? This is a link to an article. Please provide the quotes.

 

[WherevertheWindblows]

It would appear some people also want to get rid of TSA:
https://thefederalist.com/2019/01/18/government-shutdown-perfect-time-finally-abolish-tsa/
The Government Shutdown Reveals Another Reason to Abolish the TSA | Ryan McMaken
tulc(hopes this helps)

YES!! Awesome thanks!

 

[Ana the Ist]

Of course you are going to find voters who want all sorts of things.

I should have been clearer that I meant the Democrat politicians who make policy. Show me examples of Dem leaders who are either for open borders or who think opposition to illegal immigration is racist.

In this article you can find an elected Democrat wearing a t-shirt proclaiming that he "doesn't believe in borders".

The new guard of the Democratic Party absolutely supports open borders

 

[USincognito]

Trump actually gets things done where others merely talk. The (D)'s have talked tuff on border security, Trump is trying to get it done,

The weak indulge in resolutions, the strong act.

Again. What does this non sequitur have to do with the fact that brave pugilistic hero Trump perpetually whines about how mistreated and put upon he is.

 

[USincognito]

Importing voters

You do know non-citizens can't vote, right?

 

[Radagast]

You do know non-citizens can't vote, right?

They're not allowed to vote. In many cases, there are no mechanisms to stop them.

 

[EpiscipalMe]

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has repeatedly said that opposition to illegal immigration is racist. She's not the only one.

AOC is not a Dem leader. Even if she was, where is your evidence?

In this article you can find an elected Democrat wearing a t-shirt proclaiming that he "doesn't believe in borders".

The new guard of the Democratic Party absolutely supports open borders

The Washington Examiner? Really? And you call MSNBC and CNN fake news? Show me where Keith Ellison has supported open borders in policy - something more than just a T-shirt. Besides, he is the Minnesota attorney general - he has no role in national Democratic Party policy making.

 

[USincognito]

Wanting to abolishing ICE (who is our border security) and also against a wall on our border would be an open and unsecure border.

Those who want to abolish ICE want it replaced with a different entity and no wall =/= open and unsecured border.

 

[EpiscipalMe]

They're not allowed to vote. In many cases, there are no mechanisms to stop them.

Evidence of widespread voter fraud?

 

[USincognito]

They're not allowed to vote. In many cases, there are no mechanisms to stop them.

Wrong. Cases of non-citizens voting are in the handfulls each year and that has more to do with soddy registration policy not the act of voting itself.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I've got no idea what "Trumpism" means, given that there is no actual "Trump party."

If you mean "ideas shared by Trump voters," it seems to reflect a combination of some traditional GOP policies with a desire for support of blue-collar workers.

To my naive mind, neither of those things sound unreasonable.

Trumpism is the political movement centered around Donald Trump. Trumpists may vote Republican, but they are not Republicans--they have no need for any political party if that party does not support Donald Trump. What does this look like? It looks like those who attack Republicans when said Republicans are not genuflecting at the feet of Trump or praising his "stable genius". It is the hate and vitriol that was directed against Sen. John McCain, it's the hate and vitriol against Robert Mueller (a life-long Republican), James Comey (also a life-long Republican), and so on. Whatever the Republican Party meant or stood for in the past simply no longer matters, what matters is Donald Trump.

Trumpism, like all forms of fascism, involve several elements:

1) Radical Nationalism
2) Devotion to a Leader
3) Scapegoating the undesirable
4) Demonizing and criminalizing all oppositions
5) Targeting democratic institutions, such as freedom of the press

This list is not exhaustive, but it is a few elements that deserve attention.

The Oxford Dictionary defines fascism this way:

"An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization."

Merriam-Webster defines fascism this way:

"a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition"

Umberto Eco's article from the New York Review of Books (dated June 1995): here. Also relevant: here.

Trumpism is simply the form and shape of fascism in America. No, it's not Hitlerism, no it's not Mussolinism, no it's not Francoism, it's Trumpism. Donald Trump is not Hitler or Mussolini or Franco. Trump is Trump. But the language of violence, nationalism, and the barrage of attacks upon democracy are absolutely present.

The language of "the wall" is simply part of the language of violence against immigrants who are the particular scapegoat in Trumpism, along with Muslims. To speak about a caravan of refugees fleeing for their lives as a threat is to dehumanize people on the basis of their being other. They aren't us, and that is what makes them dangerous. That is the language of fascism.

All criticism is abhorrent, there can be no criticism, and so the free press is attacked without mercy; the only acceptable press is favorable propaganda. That is the activity of fascism.

Fascism favors the strong man. Fascism abhors the weak. Fascism has no room for altruism and egalitarian principles. Fascist dogma is that might makes right, and the strong must rise above the weak.

The seeds and soil for Trumpism were here long before Trump. But Trump brought the industrial farming equipment to let it grow. It would almost certainly have arisen eventually, in some way, even without Donald Trump. But here and in this moment of history, Trump was the catalyst.

You can't preach the dogma of fear, anger, and hatred without it eventually taking shape in the form of the restless mob of the naive, gullible, angry, hateful, and deplorable.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[WherevertheWindblows]

You do know non-citizens can't vote, right?

Of course, the future voting base

 

[cow451]

That's an open border policy....they may not be calling it that, but it's definitely what they're describing.

Open border - Wikipedia

No it’s not but stay in your bubble. It’s safer than questioning lazy reporting.

 

[WherevertheWindblows]

Those who want to abolish ICE want it replaced with a different entity and no wall =/= open and unsecured border.

An entity?