Why do some people think Apostle Paul is evil?

[timothyu]

God always viewed Israel as a whole.

Yes but the Jews still called their brother tribes gentiles.

 

[Guojing]

Yes but the Jews still called their brother tribes gentiles.

Well what matters in terms of scripture is how God view it right?

 

[timothyu]

Well what matters in terms of scripture is how God view it right?

What matter's should be what Jesus said and taught. To have that set aside in favour of another does not show a problem with Paul, but with those who rejected Jesus and his Gospel for Paul and his epistles because they were more convenient to their cause, where as the governance of God over this world was not. it is apparently ok to use God to justify their actions but they were unwilling to change to serve the will of God. This would make them contrary to the teachings of Jesus , anti-Christ in fact. The system changed from the will of the Father back to the will of man, the same as man has done since the Garden.

 

[Guojing]

What matter's should be what Jesus said and taught. To have that set aside in favour of another does not show a problem with Paul, but with those who rejected Jesus and his Gospel for Paul and his epistles because they were more convenient to their cause, where as the governance of God over this world was not. it is apparently ok to use God to justify their actions but they were unwilling to change to serve the will of God. This would make then contrary to the teachings of of Jesus , anti-Christ in fact. The system changed from the will of the Father back to the will of man, the same as man has done since the Garden.

But Jesus said clearly in Matthew 10:5 not to preach the contents of the gospel of the kingdom to the Gentiles. He also said he was not sent but to the lost sheep of the house of israel.

He raised Paul to be our apostle. It was said many times in Acts as well as in Paul's letters. Jesus is telling you that Paul is your apostle.

 

[hedrick]

To all or just Paulists?

To anyone that reads both and isn’t ideologically committed to the idea that there can never be disagreements. After all, the whole discussion of differences between Jesus and Paul makes no sense unless you acknowledge that there can be differences among Biblical authors and Jesus.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

I think Paul's justification by faith, and emphasis on the Holy Spirit places him on Jesus' side of the disagreement with the Pharisees. Still, his use of holiness and purity allowed him to be cited to support the moralism of the next generation of Christians, and of many Christians today.

There are several reasons one might guess for the difference in approach between Paul and Jesus:

I might also add that Paul is now dealing with established Christian communities that are trying to figure out the day-to-day implications of Christ's teachings a couple decades after the resurrection. They are being led by people taught by the Apostles and the Seventy but they are having to deal with other beliefs, a variety of religions, philosophies, Jewish leaning Christians, and even local politics.

 

[timothyu]

Jesus is telling you that Paul is your apostle.

Sorry, Paul is not my messiah and unless there are books we are unaware of about his teachings on the Kingdom, his epistles only serve those wishing to build an institutional religion, not follow the Kingdom/governance of God. No doubt chosen to back their agenda.

 

[timothyu]

I might also add that Paul is now dealing with established Christian communities that are trying to figure out the day-to-day implications of Christ's teachings a couple decades after the resurrection. They are being led by people taught by the Apostles and the Seventy but they are having to deal with other beliefs, a variety of religions, philosophies, Jewish leaning Christians, and even local politics.

So who confused the issue of the original teachings of putting the will of the Father before man's, and as a result, loving all as self. Couldn't have been much simpler. We were left with a way of life to see us through.

No need to expound on the work Jesus completed because there was nothing man could do to change it. Yet man has focused on freely given salvation and has made it all about us while ignoring the commandments God gave (which mirror the ways of the Kingdom) and have refused to change to live by them. A subtle shift by gentile religion away from the Kingdom and back towards self and the world, while proclaiming we need not love all as self or put God's will first. Simple belief in Jesus is enough (without doing as He commanded).

 

[Guojing]

Sorry, Paul is not my messiah and unless there are books we are unaware of about his teachings on the Kingdom, his epistles only serve those wishing to build an institutional religion, not follow the Kingdom/governance of God. No doubt chosen to back their agenda.

You remind me of how the Jewish leaders used to complain about the Lord only speaking thru Moses.

Numbers 12:2 And they said, Hath the LORD indeed spoken only by Moses? hath he not spoken also by us? And the LORD heard it.

 

[timothyu]

You remind me of how the Jewish leaders used to complain about the Lord only speaking thru Moses.

Speaking through Jesus is better than offshoot theologians speaking through themselves and choosing scriptures other than the words of Jesus to defend their views. Again, if Paul taught the Gospel of the Kingdom as scripture states then having those teachings in the NT in his words would totally blow a religion built on his epistles only right out of the water. Conveniently for Paulists they are not there, but they are still there in the teachings of Jesus, which of course are set aside to pursue the epistles of Paul by those who say the teachings of Jesus don't apply. Paulianity never made it as a catch phrase or name of a religion.

 

[Guojing]

Speaking through Jesus is better than offshoot theologians speaking through themselves and choosing scriptures other than the words of Jesus to defend their views. Again, if Paul taught the Gospel of the Kingdom as scripture states then having those teachings in the NT in his words would totally blow a religion built on his epistles only right out of the water. Conveniently for Paulists they are not there, but they are still there in the teachings of Jesus, which of course are set aside to pursue the epistles of Paul by those who say the teachings of Jesus don't apply. Paulianity never made it as a catch phrase or name of a religion.

I have already explained to you regarding what Paul meant when he preached the Kingdom of God, it is NOT the Gospel of the Kingdom that you think he was preaching.

Do you actually understand the contents of the Gospel of the Kingdom?

 

[timothyu]

it is NOT the Gospel of the Kingdom that you think he was preaching.

Sez you. There is only one Kingdom and it is the governance of the Father. His kingdom come, His will be done in earth.

 

[Guojing]

Sez you.

Maybe you want to tell your readers what you understand as the contents of "The gospel of the kingdom"?

 

[timothyu]

Just did.

 

[Guojing]

Just did.

where?

 

[timothyu]

where?

52

 

[Guojing]

52

Okay, so 2 questions will clarify your understanding.

Was the Gospel of the Kingdom only meant for the Jews? (Matthew 10:5)
Did the Gospel of Kingdom require all of them to continue keeping the Law of Moses? (Matthew 5:17-19)

 

[timothyu]

Was the Gospel of the Kingdom only meant for the Jews?

Is God only the God of the Jews or all of creation? His governance applies to all.

Did the Gospel of Kingdom require all of them to continue keeping the Law of Moses?

Jesus commanded us to put the will of the Father before our own, which is love all as self. That covers all laws God gave man previously.

 

[Guojing]

Is God only the God of the Jews or all of creation? His governance applies to all.


Jesus commanded us to put the will of the Father before our own, which is love all as self. That covers all laws God gave man previously.

So if Paul said Gentiles are dead to the Law, then the Gospel of the Kingdom was clearly not meant for them.

 

[hedrick]

So if Paul said Gentiles are dead to the Law, then the Gospel of the Kingdom was clearly not meant for them.

Huh? So all of Jesus teaching about how we should acts as members of the a Kingdom is just for Jews? There’s no sign of that in the Gospels.