Why conservatives are boycotting paypal

[TLK Valentine]

If their next choice of a location costs more to do business than Charlotte, then from a financial perspective it is a poor choice.

That's a big if... OTOH, the free publicity they gain by being "LGBT-friendly" should be a boost to their revenue...

 

[GoldenBoy89]

No, but they might listen to a bunch of whining social conservatives who take their business elsewhere.....

If there's enough of them to make a noticeable impact, of course. I'm guessing the people at PayPal aren't so foolish as to not know that social conservatism is not exactly popular with the public at large right now.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Perhaps for you. Others of us recognize that mankind has the capacity for laudable action. In any case it is not relevant to my question. Does one morally ambiguous act negate any good that a person performs?

You used the term "moral model" which is why I answered the way I did so it was relevant to your question.
From the human perspective, who really can't see much further than the nose on their face, there is some validity to your question.
From God's perspective the answer would be yes. Note Matthew 7:21-23.

 

[expos4ever]

So people must act correctly in every situation or we can not consider them a hero? Any good they might do is completely negated by one morally ambiguous act?

I think the devil is in the details here. Consider this situation:

Fred takes some personal risk by rescuing a drowning person on Monday. On Tuesday, he sees someone else drowning yet chooses not to help.

Here, I agree with you - Fred's refusal to act on Tuesday does not negate his action on Monday. And there is another important difference from the paypal scenario: Fred is not saving drowning swimmers as a calculated act to improve his own wealth - he is simply reacting as a caring person. Fred can be rightfully praised as a good person.

However, I suggest the situation with corporations is not analogous. If they do "good things" when there is little or no financial downside (and possibly even a profit to be made), and fail to do "good things" when it costs them, there is no basis to see their good acts as praiseworthy: acting "morally" is more profitable, and I maintain that is all they care about.

Even if taking a stand costs them in the short term, they would only that stand if they believed it would be ultimately profitable in the long term.

I politely assume that, like me, you are a mere minion - a working level person. I believe people like you and me can easily assume too many good things about the "power-brokers" that run our world. I know this seems cynical but I believe that, in the main, they are decidedly less moral than the rest of us.

Here is a quote from activist Chris Hedges (I am sort of a fan of his, although I think he can be overly strident at times):

“We have to grasp, as Marx and Adam Smith did, that corporations are not concerned with the common good. They exploit, pollute, impoverish, repress, kill, and lie to make money. They throw poor people out of homes, let the uninsured die, wage useless wars for profit, poison and pollute the ecosystem, slash social assistance programs, gut public education, trash the global economy, plunder the U.S. Treasury and crush all popular movements that seek justice for working men and women. They worship money and power.”

 

[TerranceL]

Do you think Paypal is capable of making a difference to the laws in Saudi Arabia?

Probably about as capable as they are of making a difference in NC.

 

[civilwarbuff]

“We have to grasp, as Marx and Adam Smith did, that corporations are not concerned with the common good. They exploit, pollute, impoverish, repress, kill, and lie to make money. They throw poor people out of homes, let the uninsured die, wage useless wars for profit, poison and pollute the ecosystem, slash social assistance programs, gut public education, trash the global economy, plunder the U.S. Treasury and crush all popular movements that seek justice for working men and women. They worship money and power.”

I agree that is exaggerated but there is a kernel of truth in what he states.....

 

[TerranceL]

How about if they had a reasonable expectation that their actions would shine the light on the lesser situation but go ignored in the more drastic case? Does not the idea of actually being effective make more sense?

Is there any real reason to think that Paypal has so much pull that they will be effective? They aren't exactly crucial to the economy.

I don't know. Does supporting those two invalidate any other actions the US takes?

So as long as were not doing it ourselves just supporting the people who do those things it's ok?

 

[Belk]

You used the term "moral model" which is why I answered the way I did so it was relevant to your question.

Fair enough.

From the human perspective, who really can't see much further than the nose on their face, there is some validity to your question.

It is the only perspective I feel confidant I can represent.

From God's perspective the answer would be yes. Note Matthew 7:21-23.

I will leave the representation of the perspective of infinite beings to you. If you feel that would be the correct position I defer to your opinion.

 

[Arcangl86]

Don't know how accurate your statement is (it may the from just the people you hang with) but if the lgbt don't want to live in Charlotte, one of the nicest places in the eastern US, then that is their choice. A business does not exist to conform society to the wants of its employees; it exists to make money for its owners. Seems like paypal may be forgetting the lesson.....

Yeah how dare people want to live in a place where they don't have to worry about being discriminated against. And yes a business exists to make money for its owners. Part of that is ensuring you get the best employees you can, which in some cases includes have locations in attractive locations.

 

[TerranceL]

They didn't stop doing business in NC, they decided not to expand operations (a physical presence of employees) in a polity with policies it felt did not treat their employees fairly. In how many of those countries do they have physical offices?

Well they have offices in Malaysia where homosexuals get jail time and lashes, Singapore where homosexuals get 2 years in prison, United Arab Emirates where homosexuals can get the death penalty, India where you can get a life sentence for being gay.

 

[expos4ever]

Except that God explicitly meted out punishments which were passed down to their descendants...His actions were deliberate, and explain the story (and Christian theology) far more clearly than two people who just so happened to "break" all of creation because they took bad advice from a talking reptile...

My whole point is that the entire "literary" character of the Bible justifies my interpretation even though it clearly is a departure from a literal reading.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Yeah how dare people want to live in a place where they don't have to worry about being discriminated against. And yes a business exists to make money for its owners. Part of that is ensuring you get the best employees you can, which in some cases includes have locations in attractive locations.

Of which Charlotte, I can assure you, is one of those. No one in NC is discriminating against lgbt, they are declining to provide them with any special privileges.....there is a difference.

 

[PsychoeDial]

Paypal is just virtue signaling. They don't REALLY care about LBGT rights, how do we know this?

Here's a list of countries that have anti-lbgt laws, more than a handful of them proscribe death as the punishment.

https://76crimes.com/76-countries-where-homosexuality-is-illegal/

Here is a list of countries that Paypal serves:
https://www.paypal.com/webapps/mpp/country-worldwide

Here's a small sample of the countries that they serve that have anti-lbgt laws:
Yemen
Mauritania
Nigeria
Qatar
Saudi Arabia
Somalia
Indonesia
India
Kuwait
Sri Lanka
Belize
Guyana
Grenada
Jamaica
Russia

If Paypal really believes in what they are saying and aren't just moralizing hypocrites they will stop doing business in the above countries.

Exactly.
Good to hear people are boycotting PayPal. Maybe it is largely because people see this pull out of North Carolina for what it is. Just like the musicians that are no longer top 10 hit makers pulling out on their fans by refusing to play concerts in North Carolina and all the while in their tour rear view mirror they've played countries that are the epitome of evil when it comes to human rights.
Publicity! In this case it's as transparent as a cheap paper dress.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Well they have offices in Malaysia where homosexuals get jail time and lashes, Singapore where homosexuals get 2 years in prison, United Arab Emirates where homosexuals can get the death penalty, India where you can get a life sentence for being gay.

Don't talk about the truth....it is too hard twist...

 

[TLK Valentine]

Why would any company want to attract talented lgbt individuals instead of attracting the best possible person for the compensation offered? Why does it matter if they are lgbt or not? Shouldn't a well run business simply want the best bang for the buck regardless of a person's "background"?

Indeed.. so why should a business set up shop in a place where talented people who happen to be LGBTs are discouraged due to laws passed against them?

Why should a business set up shop in a place where it's going to have to jump through hoops to comply with a law they don't agree with, when they can easily avoid the problem by going across the state line?

 

[Armoured]

Of which Charlotte, I can assure you, is one of those. No one in NC is discriminating against lgbt, they are declining to provide them with any special privileges.....there is a difference.

Oh I love a good special rights claim. They never hold up.

 

[Cute Tink]

Of which Charlotte, I can assure you, is one of those. No one in NC is discriminating against lgbt, they are declining to provide them with any special privileges.....there is a difference.

What "special privileges"?

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Of which Charlotte, I can assure you, is one of those. No one in NC is discriminating against lgbt, they are declining to provide them with any special privileges.....there is a difference.

It's a special privilege to use a public restroom now?

 

[Larniavc]

the issue is that they feel the need to shove it down peoples throats as if only they are right and everyone who disagrees with them is wrong.

Now which other group of people has done this throughout history?

 

[civilwarbuff]

What "special privileges"?

Let's look at it this way. I go to the mens room and it is all funky and I decide to use the women's room. I walk in someone says something to security, they confront me and then I say "I feel like a female today" and now I get to walk away. Sounds like special privilege to me.