Why conservatives are boycotting paypal

[Landon Caeli]

No, red herrings are a fallacy. Claiming that Any entity must act consistently in all situations regardless of how they vary is not logic.

Now it's your turn I see. Isn't that a Straw Man?

 

[civilwarbuff]

Yeah, I'm sure they're going to listen to a clutch of whinging social conservatives...

No, but they might listen to a bunch of whining social conservatives who take their business elsewhere.....

 

[civilwarbuff]

ou

They chose to open a new office in Charlotte. Part of the reason they chose Charlotte was that Charlotta had a local ordinance preventing discrimination among LGBT people and Veterans. The State then nullified this law. Paypal decided that as a result the environment in Charlotte was no longer one that they wanted for their employees and decided to look elsewhere. So how exactly is this disassociated with their business?

If their next choice of a location costs more to do business than Charlotte, then from a financial perspective it is a poor choice.

 

[Arcangl86]

If their next choice of a location costs more to do business than Charlotte, then from a financial perspective it is a poor choice.

Not if it allows then to attract talented LGBT individuals that they wouldn't be able to get in Charlotte.

 

[Belk]

I agree, but to the extent that paypal - or anyone else - "picks and chooses" which moral issues they will take a stand on is influenced by the profit motive, their moral credibility is severely diminished.

In short, if paypal claims the moral high ground in NC, but otherwise 'does business with the devil' in other places (where taking a moral stand would cost them $$), their implied claim to taking the high ground loses all credibility.

So people must act correctly in every situation or we can not consider them a hero? Any good they might do is completely negated by one morally ambiguous act?

 

[Belk]

Now it's your turn I see. Isn't that a Straw Man?

I don't see how it is. I am not claiming that is your argument. I am stating that it is an unrealistic expectation to hold for any and all entities .

 

[civilwarbuff]

Not if it allows then to attract talented LGBT individuals that they wouldn't be able to get in Charlotte.

Why would any company want to attract talented lgbt individuals instead of attracting the best possible person for the compensation offered? Why does it matter if they are lgbt or not? Shouldn't a well run business simply want the best bang for the buck regardless of a person's "background"?

 

[civilwarbuff]

So people must act correctly in every situation or we can not consider them a hero? Any good they might do is completely negated by one morally ambiguous act?

Hero= Red Herring

 

[Belk]

Hero= Red Herring

Why is it a red herring? Is that not who we usually hold up as a moral model? Very well civilwarbuff. Is the good any human does negated by a single morally ambiguous act?

 

[JustOneWay]

Why would any company want to attract talented lgbt individuals instead of attracting the best possible person for the compensation offered? Why does it matter if they are lgbt or not? Shouldn't a well run business simply want the best bang for the buck regardless of a person's "background"?

Talented LGBT=red herring

 

[Landon Caeli]

I don't see how it is. I am not claiming that is your argument. I am stating that it is an unrealistic expectation to hold for any and all entities .

...But since nobody actually said that, then its setting up a Straw Man.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Why is it a red herring? Is that not who we usually hold up as a moral model? Very well civilwarbuff. Is the good any human does negated by a single morally ambiguous act?

We should never hold anyone up as a "moral model" because all men fail. Only God should be looked to for that model, not man.

 

[Belk]

...But since nobody actually said that, then setting up a Straw Man.

Really? No one claimed that PayPal must act to protest LGBTQ violations I other countries the same as it did in NC or lose their moral credibility? How is that not claiming they must act the same regardless of situational differences?

 

[Arcangl86]

Why would any company want to attract talented lgbt individuals instead of attracting the best possible person for the compensation offered? Why does it matter if they are lgbt or not? Shouldn't a well run business simply want the best bang for the buck regardless of a person's "background"?

Because the tech sector is heavily LGBT or supporters, partially because of how young must tech people are. So in many cases, the best person for the job is LGBT.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Really? No one claimed that PayPal must act to protest LGBTQ violations I other countries the same as it did in NC or lose their moral credibility? How is that not claiming they must act the same regardless of situational differences?

I don't know if anyone said they MUST (they may have if someone could point to it) act but did question why they have not acted and used that to call their credibility into question. I also asked if this issue is so important to them, why have they waited so long to speak/do something? This smells primarily like a publicity stunt....one that may backfire on them.

 

[Belk]

We should never hold anyone up as a "moral model" because all men fail. Only God should be looked to for that model, not man.

Perhaps for you. Others of us recognize that mankind has the capacity for laudable action. In any case it is not relevant to my question. Does one morally ambiguous act negate any good that a person performs?

 

[TLK Valentine]

I believe we can legitimately read that story not as:

"God is in the punishment business and seemingly arbitrarily punishes the children for the sins of the parent"

....but that rather as:

"God took a risk in putting humans in a stewardship role over creation; part of that risk was that if humanity chose another path, creation itself would be damaged. And part of that damage is wrought on all humans born thereafter"

Note how, on this perspective:

1. The traditional idea of God as fully omnipotent is nuanced (I am perfectly comfortable with this);
2. God is not "punishing" people.

Except that God explicitly meted out punishments which were passed down to their descendants...His actions were deliberate, and explain the story (and Christian theology) far more clearly than two people who just so happened to "break" all of creation because they took bad advice from a talking reptile...

 

[TLK Valentine]

Please don't insult God on a Christian forum. It's disrespectful.

Im just following the logic where it leads... no disrespect intended.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Because the tech sector is heavily LGBT or supporters, partially because of how young must tech people are. So in many cases, the best person for the job is LGBT.

Don't know how accurate your statement is (it may the from just the people you hang with) but if the lgbt don't want to live in Charlotte, one of the nicest places in the eastern US, then that is their choice. A business does not exist to conform society to the wants of its employees; it exists to make money for its owners. Seems like paypal may be forgetting the lesson.....

 

[The Cadet]

Non-Sequitur. You don't believe PayPal's excuse for supposedly pulling out of NC should reflect a consistent concern for human rights?
That's the issue here.

I think there are a few significant differences that make the accusation of hypocrisy nonsensical. Most notably: Paypal isn't actually going to be able to do anything to change the laws in those places. Their impact just isn't that big, and the only result would be a loss of business. Meanwhile, they clearly have some power within the USA, within the context of particular states. That's a significant difference, in my opinion.

Bruce Jenner is not as supported as many progressives had hoped. Didn't his show get cancelled?

Caitlyn Jenner happens to be kind of a terrible person. That's why she's not particularly supported.

No, but they might listen to a bunch of whining social conservatives who take their business elsewhere.....

Where? No, seriously, like I pointed out at the start of this thread, where does a poor beleaguered bigot go when they don't want to support pro-LGBT businesses?