Why Catholics become Protestants

[christseeker45]

Duh... I told you what is there... were you not "reading"?

Of course I was. You come off as quite resentful because of how you talk about Protestants. Saying things like they are fake is not lovig

well that's just stupid. I'm not going to believe in God and His Church because of what others do. if that is the case, I would have ditched this Church long ago because of the sexual abuse of kids and the cover ups. I'm mad as heck at the men running the Church right now but I'm not leaving it.. where am I gonna go? You (the Church) have the words of eternal life, the sacraments.

Many base what they do on the actions or in actions of others. We do it all the time. How one acts toward others is very important, you may be the only representative they see.

I pretty sure it read, "not fake like you".

Finish it. Not fake like you said, you conveniently left that part off.

Agreed. It (men) let him down. The diocese here really let me down once. I was really PO, but so what? Its the men, not the truth, the teachings. Its that they do not practice what they preach, not that what is preached is wrong. Its not. so I suffer with Christ and He's mad to when His men screw up.

You pick yourself up, brush off and understand they are jerks not following but you still will and that's when you know, this is not a cake walk and you can not be in it for nothing other then because you love God. Not for blessings or feelings or even answered prayers but for God and God alone. You get nothing out of it sometimes and sometimes you get hurt. You have to remain faithful even in the face and bad people being bad.

You know how many saints went through creepy bishops and creepy priest harassing them? It happens and its a test when it does.

what goes beyond emotion is purification, illumination and unification. Its a journey a process and we takes steps forward and back again.

what you describe is pure emotion by someone who changed his ways. he had a change, a conversion but that conversion is on going and if someone is mean to him again? what then?

Its not a testament to the teachings are false. its a testament to how human nature is. how people allow other people to dictate to them how the feel.

he can take that on fireness and be Catholic. It sad he needed to go else where to get it but it literally has nothing to do with Catholicism or Protestantism. You can not actually think on fireness is only fund in a non catholic congregation... that is utter ridiculousness if you think that. You are discounting everybody else who found it while being catholic and I do not say in the catholic Church because its not found IN a place or a religion. it comes from with in. Do you understand this?

It had a lack to do with the lack in the Catholic Church and I think it's because the Church is more colder to people because it is just about participation and who cares about the person. The problem is you refuse to get past your barrier of putting emotions in everything. The joy that my friend and countless others has have nothing to do with emotions and Scripture speaks about it.

do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God. And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.


Phil 4:6-7

and

You keep him in perfect peace
whose mind is stayed on you,
because he trusts in you.

Is 26:3

This isn't emotion, silly non trust worthy emotion but something that far surpasses it. This is something that comes only from the Holy Spirit. This what I see in my non Catholic Christians friends that frankly I have not seen that much in my Catholic friends and family. It's something I desire too my prayer is:


Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation: and uphold me with a free spirit.

Ps 51:12

 

[christseeker45]

Do you believe that the Holy Eucharist is the body, blood, soul, and Divinity of our Lord? Because your comparison of it to a baseball game I find a bit off base for the respect that is deserving of the Holy Eucharist. BTW, I am quite old too.

I do not know anymore. I was going on what benedictaoo was saying, it seemed as if we just went to Mass only to participate and I don't know about her but I go for much more

 

[steve_bakr]

I do not know anymore. I was going on what benedictaoo was saying, it seemed as if we just went to Mass only to participate and I don't know about her but I go for much more

In talking about participation in the Mass, I think that the Catholic Church means by that the participation, at the Eucharist, in the Divinity of our Lord, like it says in 2nd Peter 1:4. In order to get the most out of the Eucharist, you need to discern the dody and blood of the Lord, so that you will participate in the Divine Nature. Please think of it that way.

Also, you seem to hunger for good preaching, and many Protestants excel in that art. There are many famous Protestant preachers. There is nothing wrong with listening to good preaching. It can be very inspiring. Also, many Protestants do love the Lord (my wife is one of them), and there is nothing fake about it.

One option you may consider--now I don't want to lose you to the Protestants, though--is to take care of your Sunday Mass commitment at the Saturday vigil and go get some Protestant preaching on Sunday. The thought of losing you does concern me. But I have read some of your posts. There is a hunger there for God's Word, and I believe it is genuine.

 

[underheaven]

In talking about participation in the Mass, I think that the Catholic Church means by that the participation, at the Eucharist, in the Divinity of our Lord, like it says in 2nd Peter 1:4. In order to get the most out of the Eucharist, you need to discern the dody and blood of the Lord, so that you will participate in the Divine Nature. Please think of it that way.

Also, you seem to hunger for good preaching, and many Protestants excel in that art. There are many famous Protestant preachers. There is nothing wrong with listening to good preaching. It can be very inspiring. Also, many Protestants do love the Lord (my wife is one of them), and there is nothing fake about it.

One option you may consider--now I don't want to lose you to the Protestants, though--is to take care of your Sunday Mass commitment at the Saturday vigil and go get some Protestant preaching on Sunday. The thought of losing you does concern me. But I have read some of your posts. There is a hunger there for God's Word, and I believe it is genuine.

Yes ,I am a protestant /catholic .I have a left and a right,and I need both of them ,but
when I say 'protestant',I do not belong to a church,but a way of thnking .The best 'sermon'
I ever heard ,was from a 'Free Kirk' minister, in the north of Scotland. I went out of curiosity just for
a minute, and stayed till the end of a long ,but riviting talk ,brilliant and inspiring. Having been 'taught '
to look down on these people ,I was never the same again towards the 'Frees' etc .
I realised how predjudiced, especially the libertine media,and the rest were,and are.

 

[benedictaoo]

Of course I was. You come off as quite resentful because of how you talk about Protestants. Saying things like they are fake is not lovig

neither is calling me a hater.. i wished folks would realize that it always goes both ways. You claimed first that Catholics don't have joy or that the Church is at fault for what ever it is you think ran your freind off but its not true. Its the person who makes or breaks it in any situation. This notion you have about no joy in the Catholic faith because you personally have not seen it, is ridiculous. You are the one hatin and resentful towards our Church. I just called you out on it and FWIW, I didn't say Prots are fake... I said the feelings tend to be just that, feelings. "Joy" or peace that surpasses all understanding is not in the form of a feeling. If I did not make that clear enough, I apologize.

Many base what they do on the actions or in actions of others. We do it all the time. How one acts toward others is very important, you may be the only representative they see.

I agree. I'm big on that... which is why I do not care for many members on here that have done wrong, however a person is a dang fool if they allow a human being who is imperfect like we all are to dictate to them what objective Truth is. The Church is Truth. A good or bad witness does not change that fact.

There is no justification for anyone leaving the Church because the men in the Church "failed" them. I can understand leaveing a parish for another or being mad and disgusted but to go to a Protestant congregation becuase you like it better or because the people there are nicer, like, what is that?

Finish it. Not fake like you said, you conveniently left that part off.

It wasn't there... ? I'll have to go back and read it. and I do not leave anything off or out for convenience. Lord, If people do not know by now... if I am anything, I am HONEST about what I do. why would I be here if I was about being sneaky and trying to make people look bad? I can't believe, still trying to get over that other people on here are that way. it freaks me out. why are they even here if they are out to get anyone or make them look bad?

It had a lack to do with the lack in the Catholic Church and I think it's because the Church is more colder to people because it is just about participation and who cares about the person. The problem is you refuse to get past your barrier of putting emotions in everything. The joy that my friend and countless others has have nothing to do with emotions and Scripture speaks about it.

No... you are not correct. The CHurch which was given to us by Jesus Christ does NOT fail people. Men can and really? you are gonna let someone else run you off from what Christ gave to you? Why o earth would you do that.

You do not get that THIS Catholic Church IS the True Church that all others broke away from because they didn't like this or that... Its NOT okay to leave it for a church that is, simply put, in rebellion against or ( please pay attention to the choice of words here) or who does not know this is the true Church, what Christ instituted. All Christian sects are not equal. WE have the sacraments that GOD ordained for us that imparts HIs grace to us so we can be sanctified and purified and made Holy, like He is holy. You can not forsake that for something else you perfer over that who does not teach this TRUTH or believe in it or thinks we are in error because they are nice... that is just crazy.

do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God. And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.
and

You keep him in perfect peace
whose mind is stayed on you,
because he trusts in you.

and what you describe is not that. It could be... it begins with that but its not the whole of that. and its silly for you to make the claim (siller for me to argue with you about this, its so silly) that a Catholic who left the Church for Protestantism, who "gave his life to Christ" (hey, his life was given to Christ when he was baptized) has reached perfection and knows God like th saints did...

What that is ^ up there is a life long progress. Its what the Saints had... Its the knowelge of God. Not as I know, I believe, have faith, but I know, as in a intimate knowing God... I can no put it into words. If you understood the Catholic faith fully then we would not even be having this conversation.

This isn't emotion, silly non trust worthy emotion but something that far surpasses it. This is something that comes only from the Holy Spirit. This what I see in my non Catholic Christians friends that frankly I have not seen that much in my Catholic friends and family. It's something I desire too my prayer is:


[/COLOR]Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation: and uphold me with a free spirit.

Ps 51:12

Are you really Catholic? or are you just trying to get away with proselytizing? This quoting scripture OUT OF CONTEXT with arbitrary personal interpretation, is making me suspect.

geeze Louise. what the heck is going on? Explain yourself please.. why are you Catholic if you do not believe in the Church, know its teachings and knock it? You have knocked it left and right and I can not believe others on here in this thread is allowing you to get away with that and are cheer leading you because you are arguing with me.

So if you are Catholic for real... why? You clearly have a problem with the Church and the things you say, they are indicative of a person who is trying show that the Church is not true.

I have been around for so so long, I have seen it all and something is just not right here.

 

[WarriorAngel]

In talking about participation in the Mass, I think that the Catholic Church means by that the participation, at the Eucharist, in the Divinity of our Lord, like it says in 2nd Peter 1:4. In order to get the most out of the Eucharist, you need to discern the dody and blood of the Lord, so that you will participate in the Divine Nature. Please think of it that way.

Also, you seem to hunger for good preaching, and many Protestants excel in that art. There are many famous Protestant preachers. There is nothing wrong with listening to good preaching. It can be very inspiring. Also, many Protestants do love the Lord (my wife is one of them), and there is nothing fake about it.

One option you may consider--now I don't want to lose you to the Protestants, though--is to take care of your Sunday Mass commitment at the Saturday vigil and go get some Protestant preaching on Sunday. The thought of losing you does concern me. But I have read some of your posts. There is a hunger there for God's Word, and I believe it is genuine.

There was a member here who tried that - it caused her problems because it annoyed her the errors they were teaching. The Holy Spirit was strongly opposing what she heard in the Protestant churches and it bothered her.

It would also get pretty confusing and the lines would blur.

Personally i cannot hear what they say because i know too much history and scriptures and Catechism and so forth so i 'politely' attend ceremonies - but the preaching is so out there - so wrong - that it is simply too difficult or even wrong to give them equal status.

Let's not fear the truth - and it is in the Church. Has been for 2000 years.

There are no co equals in this. Catholics should avoid erroneous teachings because they are not on equal footing. WE love Protestants - pray for them, hope they find the font of Grace in the Church's sacraments, but the teachings are too contrary.

And again, depending on the person - it will either confuse them - or it will annoy them to do both.

Not a good idea. Just saying...

 

[benedictaoo]

I think that homilies are needed because part of the Church's ministry is to preach the Gospel and to teach. Many Catholics are not properly catechized and need more teaching. Visitors need preaching so that they may be drawn into the Church. Adult Catholics need teaching because they need to understand their faith. We must not forget that the Mass comes in two parts, the first of which is the Liturgy of the Word, because we are fed by his word as well as his body and.blood, and it is appropriate for there to be a homily after the reading of the Gospel.

BUt that's not why... its a little bit of teaching yes, but its not our catechism. we have an obligation to learn up ourselves, to go seek it out and we are to teach our kids, not think its someone else's job.

so its to teach but not in depth. Its really to be related back to the readings in no way is it to be political or to take on controversial topics. Its to shed light on the readings and its also not supposed to be a bible interpretation lesson either. Its to reiterate Christ and what He said.

Do we need that? Yeah but not strictly so... my point was, its so not like what Protestant ministers do. Its no way like what they do. Priests do not preach the bible to us or at us and tell us what this or that means. Its not that. Its something totally different from that and if a Catholic like Christseeker thinks he needs that at the end of the week and if he can't get that, its not worth going... Communion, where we commune with almighty GOD is not worth going for but a preacher man preachin, is? huh? ... ??? what? huh? really... no... not really. Its very odd indeed for a Catholic to say that. and I thank you for picking up on that as well.

 

[benedictaoo]

There was a member here who tried that - it caused her problems because it annoyed her the errors they were teaching. The Holy Spirit was strongly opposing what she heard in the Protestant churches and it bothered her.

It would also get pretty confusing and the lines would blur.

Personally i cannot hear what they say because i know too much history and scriptures and Catechism and so forth so i 'politely' attend ceremonies - but the preaching is so out there - so wrong - that it is simply too difficult or even wrong to give them equal status.

Let's not fear the truth - and it is in the Church. Has been for 2000 years.

There are no co equals in this. Catholics should avoid erroneous teachings because they are not on equal footing. WE love Protestants - pray for them, hope they find the font of Grace in the Church's sacraments, but the teachings are too contrary.

And again, depending on the person - it will either confuse them - or it will annoy them to do both.

Not a good idea. Just saying...

Right. I agree. A Catholic who KNOWS the faith, really knows it, its history, its teachings, the whole nine, they don't leave it for Protestantism. Its literally un heard of.

You just get to a point where there is no turning back, no way you can leave it for that. and that is not a dig or a put down. Its this Church or nothing as far as I am concerned. If this isn't true than nothing is. Not a dig but a reality.

 

[benedictaoo]

Ah so we should get nothing out of going to Mass, after all it's no different than anything else if all I have to do is participate. Who cares about being feed spiritually at Church, do it yourself. No wonder Catholics are looked at as working to save ourselves

You aren't really a Catholic, are you? and that is NOT an accusation but a sincere, really curious, me wantin to know, question. Are you? or are you not? and if you really and truly are, then... what is up? The things you say are just not right.

 

[CaliforniaJosiah]

I believe the rule at CF is that a person's faith icon DETERMINES their religion. If the icon is a Catholic one, we are to embrace them as Catholic. That was the rule for years, anyway...

 

[benedictaoo]

I do not know anymore. I was going on what benedictaoo was saying, it seemed as if we just went to Mass only to participate and I don't know about her but I go for much more

Like what? A meal? The Mass is this; a sacrifice and a meal. its not either/or but both & and. some like to think it as a family communal meal, others a sacrifice, the sacrifice but its both. and we are AT Calvary when we are at Mass via a miracle. So that is what your participation is. You get to be there when they crucified our Lord and you get to offer that with Mary who was there, and St John at the foot of His cross and you get to offer that with them, with everyone in heaven and on earth for the worlds salvation, conversion, and for the souls in purgatory.

Why is this not considered the coolest thing?

Do you listen to the prayers of the priests? They are really wow. Its a mystery, its so deep and awesome.

Memory or recall does not mean to remember or think back on once upon a time. Its to recall, bring about, bring it into this reality, into the here and now. We recall it, we make it happen. Not reenact but re-present it, take what happened in time and live that very moment because GOD is outside of time and space. We transcend. Its heaven on earth. literally, heaven on earth.

all these words, like peace and joy. I don't think you know their true meaning. Peace is not peace, like to chill. Its God's peace, its forgiveness.

when we are at peace or have peace, its not a calmness soul... it means we are in His grace. We are in a state of sanctifying grace.

Joy is in knowing this, in knowing our salvation. Knowing grace is making us what Christ redeemed us to be, TRUE sons and daughters in Christ. That is what our human understanding can not understand... God becoming man so we can become God (God-like or godly, not a divine being).

we tend to think its all about making this life the best it can be and that is not joy, that usually ends in misery, unfulfillment, a let down.

so read the prayers and see if you can understand what they say. You have to look at it deeper then what you are. Its Calvary in a unbloody manner manifested in the Eucharist, the bread and wine. So deep. Why would I leave this?

Father, we celebrate the memory of Christ, your Son. We, your people and your ministers, recall his passion, his resurrection from the dead, and his ascension into glory; and from the many gifts you have given us we offer to you, God of glory and majesty, this holy and perfect sacrifice: the bread of life and the cup of eternal salvation.

Look with favor on these offerings and accept them as once you accepted the gifts of your servant Abel, the sacrifice of Abraham, our father in faith, and the bread and wine offered by your priest Melchizedek.

Almighty God, we pray that your angel may take this sacrifice to your altar in heaven. Then, as we receive from this altar the sacred body and blood of your Son, let us be filled with every grace and blessing. [Through Christ our Lord. Amen.]

Remember, Lord, those who have died and have gone before us marked with the sign of faith, especially those for whom we now pray, {names deceased loved ones whom the celebrant or parishioner wishes to offer before God}. May these, and all who sleep in Christ, find in your presence light, happiness, and peace. [Through Christ our Lord. Amen.]

For ourselves, too, we ask some share in the fellowship of your apostles and martyrs, with John the Baptist, Stephen, Matthias, Barnabas, [Ignatius, Alexander, Marcellinus, Peter, Felicity, Perpetua, Agatha, Lucy, Agnes, Cecilia, Anastasia] and all the saints. Though we are sinners, we trust in your mercy and love. Do not consider what we truly deserve, but grant us your forgiveness. Through Christ our Lord.

Through him you give us all these gifts. You fill them with life and goodness, you bless them and make them holy.

So we offer the Mass with all of heaven, the angels the saints, each other, in union with all the Masses said through the world and its one huge unified prayer going up to God and this is what we do and it is what draws down God's grace and mercy and peace to all of mankind. isn't that what Christ's sacrifice did? That is what Mass is, what it does, what its for.

Best believe this is true. If we didn't have Mass anymore, the world would stop. Its would cease to exist.

 

[benedictaoo]

I believe the rule at CF is that a person's faith icon DETERMINES their religion. If the icon is a Catholic one, we are to embrace them as Catholic. That was the rule for years, anyway...

and I am- see all my posts to him explaining our faith that takes time out my life that I can never get back? That is embracing him as a Catholic, assuming he really just don't know.

but I can ask a question LIKE I DID, I did not accuse. that is what is againt the rules. accusations. thank you very much.

this dude is not talking like a Catholic regardless if he is, he is not talking like one I ever knew. and I am more then happy to help a dude out if he wants to know what we (as in he and I)are about. but if a dude is not really Catholic and/or wants to just knock the Church and especially the Mass, then I'm not wasting my time.

Look, you and I both know the drill. We know what looks and sounds like ducks. But I am not jumping to conclusions. I will await and continue to take the icon's word for it until clarification is given. But I have totally good reason enough to ask, not accuse but ask.

 

[benedictaoo]

One option you may consider--now I don't want to lose you to the Protestants, though--is to take care of your Sunday Mass commitment at the Saturday vigil and go get some Protestant preaching on Sunday. The thought of losing you does concern me. But I have read some of your posts. There is a hunger there for God's Word, and I believe it is genuine.

A Catholic is absolutely not allowed to do that. You can't be dual members. and listen to good preachin? I dare to say half of it is erroneous bible interprations and error being taught/preached.

and yeah, they love the Lord, I agree and that is not fake, they are not fakes but the happy, happy, its emotion, and its not bad and I'm not referring to the love of God but the happy, its just one element of the Christian life. They do not have the whole of the faith, the fullness of it.

and I know what I'm meaning when I say these things and it has literally nothing at all to do with hatin on them. that is so ridiculous to assume but I get that not everyone is on the same page as me. at least I'm not comparing them to fast food.

This is the true Church, there are no others. Others are linked to us through a valid baptism/confession but they are not the whole of it. saying this is not hating. Its just stating what is true. I'm not candy coating it, but I'm not hating.

I may have used a bad choice of words by saying its not real or fake which I don't think I used that word... but I was speaking to a Catholic... I was wrong to assume he understood the nuance of what I meant- I meant they lack the fullness of their faith teachings and the lack of sacraments that make us holy. Joy is holiness. Joy is not happiness you are just so nice to everybody that comes your way. I do not know how Christseeker is using the word joy. but for us, its holiness, attached to the beatific vision and our joy is complete when we make it to heaven. Its theosis, deification, divinization. Only one Orthodox poster way back when in this thread got that.

 

[benedictaoo]

This is a great post because it highlights the true divine between Catholic and Protestant theologies. We always talk about Papal Infallibility, Mariology, rosaries, and the like but on a very fundamental level most Protestant theology is void of what the Orthodox call theosis and with Catholic ideas about having a share in Calvary and redemptive suffering. It is such a polar opposite sort of thing. Some Anglicans have it, but it's mostly a RCC/Orth. mindset.

As someone who is praying and discerning about my life with Christ and where I want to be, I can tell you...this divide is very deep and is the font for the entire Catholic vs. Protestant issue, in my mind.

Only one person who gets it. That's sad...

 

[steve_bakr]

A Catholic is absolutely not allowed to do that. You can't be dual members. and listen to good preachin? I dare to say half of it is erroneous bible interprations and error being taught/preached.

and yeah, they love the Lord, I agree and that is not fake, they are not fakes but the happy, happy, its emotion, and its not bad and I'm not referring to the love of God but its just one element of the Christian life. They do not have the whole of the faith, the fullness of it.

and I know what I'm meaning when I say these things and it have literally nothing at all to do with hatin on them. that is so ridiculous to assume but I get that not everyone is on the same page as me.

This is the true Church, there are no others. Others are linked to us through a valid baptism/confession but they are the whole of it. saying this is not hating. Its just stating what is true. I'm not candy coating it, but I'm not hating.

I may have used a bad choice of words by saying its not real or fake which I don't think I used that word... but I was speaking to a Catholic... I was wrong to assume he understood the nuance of what I meant- I meant they lack the fullness of their faith teachings and the lack of sacraments that make us holy. Joy is holiness. Joy is not happiness you are just so nice to everybody that comes your way. I do not know how Christseeker is using the word joy. but for us, its holiness, attached to the beatific vision and our joy is complete when we make it to heaven. Its theosis, deification, divinization. Only one Orthodox poster way back when in this thread got that.

I know that a Catholic is not allowed to have dual membership,but I thought it was OK to attend other services. Anyway, it was probably a bad idea.

I am taking Christseeker at his word. He says he is Catholic, but he does sound like someone who is very familiar with Protestent ideas and attitudes. I asked Christseeker if he believes that the Holy Eucharist was the body and blood of Christ, he said he did not know. He seems to be lacking in catechesis. There are some basic concepts that he does not seem to grasp, most evidently the sanctity and meaning of the Eucharist and our participation in it. He seems to know more about Protestantism than Catholicism, so he needs to learn more about his own faith.

 

[benedictaoo]

I know that a Catholic is not allowed to have dual membership,but I thought it was OK to attend other services. Anyway, it was probably a bad idea.

Its not allowed when you go for the reasons you gave for him going, so he can be 'fed'. We can not give credence to false teaching. I mean, you are recommending him going so he can listen to false teaching? Not all of it, but there will be some, no doubt. why would you think that is an option?

The Church says we are not allowed to do that. Sure as heck not allowed to partake of any, if there is any, communion of theirs. When we say Amen in our Church at Communion, we are saying we believe in all of this stuff and are united as Catholics. To go to a Prot church undermines this for one and it denotes a unity that is not there.

Now, you can go like in your case, for the sake of a spouse but you are not going for the teaching or the communion, you are going for the sake of your family. Totally different. but you know, the kids are to raised Catholic and you are to be trying to have you wife enter the Catholic Church.

I am taking Christseeker at his word. He says he is Catholic, but he does sound like someone who is very familiar with Protestent ideas and attitudes. I asked Christseeker if he believes that the Holy Eucharist was the body and blood of Christ, he said he did not know. He seems to be lacking in catechesis. There are some basic concepts that he does not seem to grasp, most evidently the sanctity and meaning of the Eucharist and our participation in it. He seems to know more about Protestantism than Catholicism, so he needs to learn more about his own faith.

Yeah me too. But the knocking Catholics (the people) and the Church, and not just his posts, there are other to saying some real insulting things about us and the Church. I guess no other Catholic is reading these posts because I am not pleased with how they have allowed them to disrespect us so much but yet, they want to call me out on what I say and I never one time said Protestants are fake. Or that homily suck or that the liturgy of the word is insigficant or the liturgy is unimportant or that we are to go through motions, rituals like we're pagans, stick our heads in the sand... I never said any of that. But yet I was called out on it when I never said it...

but those other comments, like our faith has holes and Mass is lacking and the Church teaches works and we do not teach Christ is enough and that no Catholic ever has ever had any joy but they are/we are cold... I was not unloving in the very least, but other were. and I did not condesend but yet, they want to correct me... Unbeliveable. But not really, its what this place is. the only time I used the word fake was in reference to the OBOB members who, I will not name names.

and Cristseeker, what you said was, "not fake like you're always typing..." did not leave anything out for convenience sake. I ain't like that. Accuse me of what I do, not what I don't do.

But in re reading it, that sounds like you were saying I'm always typing the word fake in referring to them. I can see where you meant that I'm always typing they are fake and you were not saying I am a fake. So we are cool on that note. However, I never one time typed they were fake. I said that only once in referring to the OBOB mebers when you said I was resetful. Yeah I am... and I explained why in just about every post and if no ones gets why I am by now, then, lawd.

So no more about how i'm hatin and have hidden resentment and what ever. Its you that has a clear issue with Catholics, the Church, Mass and everything else catholic. Its you who has resentment and I have allowed for long enough your projection of your issues onto me.

 

[christseeker45]

You aren't really a Catholic, are you? and that is NOT an accusation but a sincere, really curious, me wantin to know, question. Are you? or are you not? and if you really and truly are, then... what is up? The things you say are just not right.

I been Catholic for 17 years. I am not sure I wish to remain so

 

[christseeker45]

and I am- see all my posts to him explaining our faith that takes time out my life that I can never get back? That is embracing him as a Catholic, assuming he really just don't know.

but I can ask a question LIKE I DID, I did not accuse. that is what is againt the rules. accusations. thank you very much.

this dude is not talking like a Catholic regardless if he is, he is not talking like one I ever knew. and I am more then happy to help a dude out if he wants to know what we (as in he and I)are about. but if a dude is not really Catholic and/or wants to just knock the Church and especially the Mass, then I'm not wasting my time.

Look, you and I both know the drill. We know what looks and sounds like ducks. But I am not jumping to conclusions. I will await and continue to take the icon's word for it until clarification is given. But I have totally good reason enough to ask, not accuse but ask.

No this dude doesn't take Catholicism the same way you do

 

[christseeker45]

I may have used a bad choice of words by saying its not real or fake which I don't think I used that word... but I was speaking to a Catholic... I was wrong to assume he understood the nuance of what I meant- I meant they lack the fullness of their faith teachings and the lack of sacraments that make us holy. Joy is holiness. Joy is not happiness you are just so nice to everybody that comes your way. I do not know how Christseeker is using the word joy. but for us, its holiness, attached to the beatific vision and our joy is complete when we make it to heaven. Its theosis, deification, divinization. Only one Orthodox poster way back when in this thread got that.

You definitely used the wrong choice of words and I am using joy exactly the way you said means - holiness.

 

[christseeker45]

I know that a Catholic is not allowed to have dual membership,but I thought it was OK to attend other services. Anyway, it was probably a bad idea.

I am taking Christseeker at his word. He says he is Catholic, but he does sound like someone who is very familiar with Protestant ideas and attitudes. I asked Christseeker if he believes that the Holy Eucharist was the body and blood of Christ, he said he did not know. He seems to be lacking in catechesis. There are some basic concepts that he does not seem to grasp, most evidently the sanctity and meaning of the Eucharist and our participation in it. He seems to know more about Protestantism than Catholicism, so he needs to learn more about his own faith.

I have been thoroughly versed in Catholicism, studied it extensively. I know about the Eucharist, Mass, Confession and all the other things that are necessary, I took in depth CCC classes when it came out. As far as study is concerned I have dotted all my i's and crossed my t's. I may not know all the terms all the time but I call tell you I have head knowledge. It still comes down to belief not just knowledge.