Why can't we all get along?

[Tamara224]

Yes, I couldn't agree more. People not only should be honest and not put up a front of love but people need to honestly listen to those who have major problems with what you might believe.

I don't believe that if we really aren't feeling love towards someone that we then let them have it, and I don't think that is what you are sayiong either, but we shouldn't lie to ourselves and especially those who we are talking to here in the forum. Fake love and rudeness are equally as bad.

You understood me.

And Tamara, you, as well as anyone, knows that I can be just as guilty as anyone around here. I've at times haven't treated you in a very loving way and for that I am sorry, but you know I have to admitt, the love wasn't in me.

And at times I haven't treated you well, either. I forgive you and hope you can also forgive me.

 

[jeolmstead]

Why can't we all get along?

Because we're full of pride and most of us don't really care about the Truth. We only care about pointing out flaws in others and proving that we're right and they're wrong.

Even some of the people who preach about love will, in the very same post, turn around and get their jab in. In essence they say: "We should all love one another. You aren't being loving, I am." I've done it too.

Right now I'm to place where I figure that most of the "lovingness" around here is a sham anyway. If we have to say we're being loving, then it's probably not true.

I kind of prefer the nastiness to the fake love. At least it's real. It seems to me that some of the preaching about love has just become one more attempt to silence disagreement and to control the behavior of others - something that not only can't be done but is also wrong to attempt.

JMHO. (And I am not trying to single out any one person here, nor is this as much of a response to the OP as it is something that has been growing in me in the last few months, in response to numerous posts and threads and attitudes I have encountered.)

I confess, I am guilty…

I’m better then I used to be, and, with the Lords help I’ll be better still.

If love is truth, then I will preach the ideal even though I fall short of it sometimes.


Love, like all truth stands on it’s own two feet:.

Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears

This passage says to me a lot (too much to write here)

One thing (to me) to whatever degree I am a prophet I fall short. My tongue will be silent. Whatever I think I know will pass away, and, all this is imperfect. Love however does not fail (because God is Love), and Love is the only discipline I can ever in this life achieve perfection. Because, even in my imperfection I can choose to love you.


John O

 

[nephilimiyr]

You understood me.

Well, it isn't the first time you know

And at times I haven't treated you well, either. I forgive you and hope you can also forgive me.

Of course I do! This life is to short and important to be so prideful not to ever accept apologies

 

[Br0kenSunshyne]

I think the most obvious answer is "no". Then we all follow the example of this thread and "kiss and make up". It's a cycle.

 

[Tamara224]

I confess, I am guilty…

I’m better then I used to be, and, with the Lords help I’ll be better still.

If love is truth, then I will preach the ideal even though I fall short of it sometimes.


Love, like all truth stands on it’s own two feet:.

Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears

This passage says to me a lot (too much to write here)

One thing (to me) to whatever degree I am a prophet I fall short. My tongue will be silent. Whatever I think I know will pass away, and, all this is imperfect. Love however does not fail (because God is Love), and Love is the only discipline I can ever in this life achieve perfection. Because, even in my imperfection I can choose to love you.


John O

I know what you mean, John and I'm glad you said it.

I struggle more every day with the problem of pointing out error in others, or about preaching an ideal that I don't live up to. I think the only solution is to be sure we examine ourselves first and humble ourselves.

And the truth is that if we were all perfect we wouldn't need God. God doesn't use perfect people.

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

I think the most obvious answer is "no". Then we all follow the example of this thread and "kiss and make up". It's a cycle.

I think we're long overdue to break that cycle and actually learn how to get along. But that's just me.

 

[Br0kenSunshyne]

I think we're long overdue to break that cycle and actually learn how to get along. But that's just me.

I would agree.

 

[nephilimiyr]

God doesn't use perfect people.

Hey, that's kinda like part of my signature!

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]God isn't looking for sinless, good guys,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]He's looking for people that will believe Him.[/FONT] ​

 

[Alpine]

Dang it! This thread is getting too friendly!!

 

[Alpine]

I'm myself in my real life and on these message boards. What you see is what you get. I wish we could see facial expressions and hear voice inflection though; that would help a lot.

That's true. It is often easy to misunderstand and misinterpret where people are coming from when it lacks the tone and inflection of the voice.

 

[jeolmstead]

That's true. It is often easy to misunderstand and misinterpret where people are coming from when it lacks the tone and inflection of the voice.

I always write my posts in Word first. I read through them several times. I do not wish to offend anyone, so, I try to remove the “barbs”

Sometimes I miss a few.

John O.

 

[probinson]

... I try to remove the “barbs”

This here is key. There are too many people that mistake "standing for truth" for jabbing people with their barbs.

One can speak what they believe without barbs and thorns, without compromise.

Yes, there are times when people take offense where no offense was intended, but that's not the main problem in this forum, IMO.

The problem is, people think that what they perceive as the "Truth" gives them license to just spout off and say whatever they want to say, however they want to say it.

Why can I say this is so? Because I have been one of the biggest offenders of this.

 

[Br0kenSunshyne]

I always write my posts in Word first. I read through them several times. I do not wish to offend anyone, so, I try to remove the “barbs”

Sometimes I miss a few.

John O.

I just wanted to give you a really big hug.

 

[jeolmstead]

I just wanted to give you a really big hug.

Thank you Dear....

I needed one.

John O.

 

[importunity]

So many of us disagree on so many things.

So many times we go beyond disagreeing, and we bash our brothers and sisters in Christ. Are you guys like this in your churches and the real world? I doubt it!

I'm not word of faith, I disagree with a few word of faith ideas. BUT, I would never think of word of faithers as cultists or as non Christian.

Truth is, a person who was my spiritual father for a time in my life was word of faith, and he was a huge blessing. An associate pastor at the Assembly of God I used to attend was word of faith, and he is an amazing Christian. I've met so many wonderful word of faithers in my life.

Maybe part of the problem for some is that you need to visit some word of faith churches. You will most likely not agree with some of the doctrines, but you will at least soften up on how severely critical you are.

You will realize word of faith believers are true Christians and love Jesus, just like you do!

Hey man good try, Rodney King said it this way can't we just all get along. And we know what happend then. The same thing that happend after you posted all this. A Riot.
Same spirit, it doesn't just run in the world, it runs with so called believers also. Those who say they have love but don't walk in it.
The World is looking for it, and they can't produce it. The Church is supposed to have it and they choose not to produce it.

When we are face to face, we can have any exuse we want to have but it won't do us any good.

The world is waiting for the the Love of God to show up. And if they come here they won't find it.

And all so called cult hunters and heresy hunters, you will have your day. And pray that God is more merciful on you than you are on others.

Self righteous pride, that's all it is. With out love you are just clanging brass, just a bunch of noise.

The Church better wake up because JESUS is coming, and all this garbage will be judged. Blood thirsty christians, all in the name of Jesus (give me a break).

Where is the Love?

 

[importunity]

Hey man good try, Rodney King said it this way can't we just all get along. And we know what happend then. The same thing that happend after you posted all this. A Riot.
Same spirit, it doesn't just run in the world, it runs with so called believers also. Those who say they have love but don't walk in it.
The World is looking for it, and they can't produce it. The Church is supposed to have it and they choose not to produce it.

When we are face to face, we can have any exuse we want to have but it won't do us any good.

The world is waiting for the the Love of God to show up. And if they come here they won't find it.

And all so called cult hunters and heresy hunters, you will have your day. And pray that God is more merciful on you than you are on others.

Self righteous pride, that's all it is. With out love you are just clanging brass, just a bunch of noise.

The Church better wake up because JESUS is coming, and all this garbage will be judged. Blood thirsty christians, all in the name of Jesus (give me a break).

Where is the Love?

A family was involved in a serious traffic accident.

Mike, the youngest of two brothers involved, was badly injured and needed a blood transfusion.

Mike’s big brother Danny, who was only eight years old, had the same blood type as his younger brother.

The dad sat down with Danny and carefully explained to him why this blood transfusion was needed and how wonderful it would be for his little brother.

After some silence, Danny responded by saying,
"Yes, Daddy, I’ll give my blood to Mike so he can get well."

At the hospital, a pint of blood was drawn from Danny’s veins.
Only after the needle was removed did Danny turn to his father with tears rolling down his cheeks and asked,
"Daddy, when do I die?"

The father suddenly realized with a shock that Danny had misunderstood his explanation of giving blood.

Danny thought he was giving all of his blood to save the life of his brother!

He thought that he would die after the trans-fusion was over.

Yet he still had agreed to help his little brother.



The whole world is crying out:
Where is the Love?

 

[Yitzchak]

We attended a WOF church for a few months a while back. My observation was this. They are no different than any other denomination in the sense that if they would follow their own teachings , they would be an awesome church but most of the time it was just talk.

For example , they preached over and over that they were blessed to be a blessing. To promote God's kingdom and to give generously to help the poor.

In the history of the church the most they had ever helped someone with was a grocery gift certificate for 100 dollars. there were several needy families right in the church who received little or no help. The focus was selfish and not on being a blessing as they preached. They would hold up one or two examples in 22 years of ministry as proof that they were generous. But my unsaved family has just as many examples of charity.

And it wasn't just with issues such as money. There were people in that church who had studyed for 30 years about praying for healing. Books , conferences , etc. But all they ever used their vast skills and faith for was praying for themselves. There were sick people in church and these people might pray a 20 second prayer for them once or twice. But they would seldom get healed and there was no concern to really help them if it meant they might have to fast or give up some serious time and effort to see them through to healing.

Unfortunately , my personal experience led me to conclude that WOF was no different than almost every church I have ever attended. Selfish. They feel they have a better method of procuring blessings and perhaps in some cases they do. But what virtue is it to heap more and more blessing upon myself and only give out a tiny bit to others ??

But this isn't WOF really. It is almost all churches who don't practice what they preach.

 

[Deba]

For there must also be factions among you,
so that those who are approved may become
evident among you. 1 Cor 11:19

 

[JimB]

So many of us disagree on so many things.

So many times we go beyond disagreeing, and we bash our brothers and sisters in Christ. Are you guys like this in your churches and the real world? I doubt it!

I'm not word of faith, I disagree with a few word of faith ideas. BUT, I would never think of word of faithers as cultists or as non Christian.

Truth is, a person who was my spiritual father for a time in my life was word of faith, and he was a huge blessing. An associate pastor at the Assembly of God I used to attend was word of faith, and he is an amazing Christian. I've met so many wonderful word of faithers in my life.

Maybe part of the problem for some is that you need to visit some word of faith churches. You will most likely not agree with some of the doctrines, but you will at least soften up on how severely critical you are.

You will realize word of faith believers are true Christians and love Jesus, just like you do!

I know plenty of WOF’ers. In fact, I once wuz one, for a long (and what I now feel was a wasted) decade of my life that led me down several dead-end theological roads that did not profit me or anyone else I ministered to. In fact, today I consider myself a recovering WOF—at least recovering from some of the extreme ear-pleasing (but impotent) doctrines I was taught.

But I will say that you are right: there are plenty of good Christian people who are WOF. Many of them live right here in my hometown and attend the local Rhema church, which, at the moment, is going through an identity crisis of its own.

I will also say, that some of the worst representatives of WOF I have yet to find (outside of religious TV), is right here on in this SFPC forum of CF, composed of Christians who seem to go to excessive lengths to defend the indefinable.


The WOF’ers I know personally are ...

... moving (or have moved) away from the 19th-century doctrine of guaranteed PHIA (now preferring to say, as the AOG has, that healing is “provided” in the atonement rather than “guaranteed"); ​

… are rejecting the “little gods” doctrine of KH as being more Mormonism than orthodox Christianity; ​

… are coming to grips with the fact that there are other kinds of “prosperity” than just the kind you can put in the bank, and that “true riches” have nothing to do with money; ​

… no longer adhere to the blab-it-grab-it method of exercising faith; ​

… are coming to understand that faith is as much trusting God when things do not go as expected than in getting what you want from God when you want it, ​

… and when they say “God is good”, it is God, not us, who gets to define what is “good” for us. ​

As long as this welcome trend continues, I see little wrong with WOF, but I will (and should) resist extremism no matter what form it takes or in what group it appears. I will "earnestly contend for the faith once delivered to the saints" (i.e., orthodoxy).

~Jim

If the first step in an argument is wrong everything that follows is wrong.
~C.S. Lewis, The Problem of Pain​

 

[psalms 91]

I know plenty of WOF’ers. In fact, I once wuz one, for a long (and what I now feel was a wasted) decade of my life that led me down several dead-end theological roads that did not profit me or anyone else I ministered to. In fact, today I consider myself a recovering WOF—at least recovering from some of the extreme ear-pleasing (but impotent) doctrines I was taught.

But I will say that you are right: there are plenty of good Christian people who are WOF. Many of them live right here in my hometown and attend the local Rhema church, which, at the moment, is going through an identity crisis of its own.

I will also say, that some of the worst representatives of WOF I have yet to find (outside of religious TV), is right here on in this SFPC forum of CF, composed of Christians who seem to go to excessive lengths to defend the indefinable.



The WOF’ers I know personally are ...

... moving (or have moved) away from the 19th-century doctrine of guaranteed PHIA (now preferring to say, as the AOG has, that healing is “provided” in the atonement rather than “guaranteed"); ​

… are rejecting the “little gods” doctrine of KH as being more Mormonism than orthodox Christianity; ​

… are coming to grips with the fact that there are other kinds of “prosperity” than just the kind you can put in the bank, and that “true riches” have nothing to do with money; ​

… no longer adhere to the blab-it-grab-it method of exercising faith; ​

… are coming to understand that faith is as much trusting God when things do not go as expected than in getting what you want from God when you want it, ​

… and when they say “God is good”, it is God, not us, who gets to define what is “good” for us. ​

As long as this welcome trend continues, I see little wrong with WOF, but I will (and should) resist extremism no matter what form it takes or in what group it appears. I will "earnestly contend for the faith once delivered to the saints" (i.e., orthodoxy).

~Jim

If the first step in an argument is wrong everything that follows is wrong.

~C.S. Lewis, The Problem of Pain​

I agree just as we all agree that the faith should not be watered down or compromised as incomplete. I believe that we can do this in a way that does not bash each other. Perhaps by sticking to one subject at a time as it is discussed without so many side roads? Perhaps by choosing words that are not hard but soft even with truth. By realizing that our truth is not everyones, we may want to teach them but it is still up to the Holy Spirit to convict them of truth and for them to accept it.