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Why can't Calvinism and Arminianism both be true?

sdowney717

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And honestly think about what is being taught here.

8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us,not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.


The verse says God is not willing that any of them perish but that all come to repentance.
GOD GRANTS REPENTANCE unto the faith.
So then all of these persons will be saved.
Part of the problem is people do not believe in the authority and power God has given to Christ over all flesh to give eternal life to all those God has given to Him. Read John 17.
His promise is eternal life to the sheep of Christ, Read John 10 again,

Christ said, My sheep hear my voice, I know them, and they follow Me and I give them eternal life and they will never perish and no one can take them out of my hand.
 
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DeaconDean

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Trying to get this back "on-track", it would be safe to state that according to Jacobus Arminus theology, the theology of the Remonstrants and Arminians, it is always based on what man does, or will do.

Least wise, that is what I have read in Arminus' own writing.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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DeaconDean

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Another dividing point is the belief systems between Calvinists and Arminians:

Monergism: the theological doctrine that regeneration is exclusively the work of the Holy Spirit (Calvinists)

Source

Synergism: "comes from a compound Greek word meaning “to work together,” is the view that God works together with us in effecting salvation." (Arminians)

Source

That is why both can't be true.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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PrettyboyAndy

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Another dividing point is the belief systems between Calvinists and Arminians:

Monergism: the theological doctrine that regeneration is exclusively the work of the Holy Spirit (Calvinists)

Source

Synergism: "comes from a compound Greek word meaning “to work together,” is the view that God works together with us in effecting salvation." (Arminians)

Source

That is why both can't be true.

God Bless

Till all are one.

Thank you for explaining, I did not even know what monergism and synergism was.

I understand that is one of the two big differences, I believe the second would be losing/not losing your salvation.

I believe that one can not lose their salvation, pursuant to Ephesians 1:13: the Holy Spirit seals the believer.

Now would if an Arminian would say God looked in time to see who would choose him, that still does not change they are synergists rather then the monergist calvinist?
 
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Hammster

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Hammster

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I did, I liked the message.
Then the question doesn't make sense in light of what he says. If I recall correctly, he in no way makes an argument for Arminianism.
 
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PrettyboyAndy

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Then the question doesn't make sense in light of what he says. If I recall correctly, he in no way makes an argument for Arminianism.

After reading through all these posts, I realised that.

I thought by him saying Man's Responsibility, he was making endorsing arminianism, which is not what he was doing.

I guess rather he was trying to explain how God can be soverign and choose those who he will, and at the same time bring judgement on those who did not choose God, even though they did not have any involvement in the decision?
 
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Hammster

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After reading through all these posts, I realised that.

I thought by him saying Man's Responsibility, he was making endorsing arminianism, which is not what he was doing.

I guess rather he was trying to explain how God can be soverign and choose those who he will, and at the same time bring judgement on those who did not choose God, even though they did not have any involvement in the decision?
And if I recall, he said that he can't reconcile them to a way that might be emotionally satisfying, but that it's what scripture teaches.
 
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FaithfulPilgrim

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I gave up on the two as I think it is beyond our understanding.

I just accept that God is sovereign but man is capable of voluntary actions and leave it at that.
 
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DeaconDean

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Now would if an Arminian would say God looked in time to see who would choose him, that still does not change they are synergists rather then the monergist calvinist?

Ahh...but they do according to the theology of Arminus. (cf. the foreknowledge of God)

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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Sovereign Grace

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Now would if an Arminian would say God looked in time to see who would choose him, that still does not change they are synergists rather then the monergist calvinist?

Listen to this that you posted..."God looked in time to see who would choose Him..." That reeks of process theism at best, and open theism at worst. If God had to looked through time to see who would choose Him, then He is not omniscience, and His election is based upon the merits of man. Neither are found in the bible if proper exegesis is employed. None, outside the drawing of God, would ever choose to seek Him. Romans 3:11 avers that.
 
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sdowney717

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Listen to this that you posted..."God looked in time to see who would choose Him..." That reeks of process theism at best, and open theism at worst. If God had to looked through time to see who would choose Him, then He is not omniscience, and His election is based upon the merits of man. Neither are found in the bible if proper exegesis is employed. None, outside the drawing of God, would ever choose to seek Him. Romans 3:11 avers that.

Arminians just twist the word to fit their ideas.
And God says no one seeks Him (Christ), they don not believe that either, they believe in a prevenient grace which does not exist.
So they do not believe what God has said.

I have thought many times the God of scripture is not the God they want to exist. They think God who chooses arbitrarily (their word I hear a lot from them) men an evil God.
 
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Skala

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Thank you for explaining, I did not even know what monergism and synergism was.

I understand that is one of the two big differences, I believe the second would be losing/not losing your salvation.

I believe that one can not lose their salvation, pursuant to Ephesians 1:13: the Holy Spirit seals the believer.

Now would if an Arminian would say God looked in time to see who would choose him, that still does not change they are synergists rather then the monergist calvinist?

Anytime, it is my pleasure! I love talking theology!

Monergism and synergism explained simply:

Monergism: Comes from two root words: Mono (single) ergos (work). "single work" or "one work". Similar words: "Monocle" (eyewear with one glass piece). Monotheism (theism with one deity).

Synergism: two root words: Syn (together) ergos (work). Similar word: Synchronize

Monergism is the idea that one party, or one input, is the active agent in a human beings regeneration (ie, being born again) God's input alone is required for the regeneration of a man.
Calvinism says man is spiritually dead, thus cannot act or assist in his own resurrection. God does it alone. A corpse cannot help itself be resurrected.

Synergism is the idea that two parties are working together, cooperatively, for the human being's regeneration. (God and man cooperating)
In synergism, if man does not cooperate, God is powerless to regenerate the man because the process requires input from both God and man.
Arminianism says that man is not spiritually dead, only spiritually sick. God is like a doctor, offering you medicine, but it's up to you to reach out and grab the medicine and swallow it. Thus, you and the doctor both took actions that caused you get well from your illness.

The reason Arminianism views it this way is because the gospel is preached to all people. So they view the gospel as merely God's offering assistance.

Calvinism views the gospel as more than God merely offering people salvation. In Calvinism, God actually works through the gospel to visit sinners and regenerate them. The gospel is merely the vehicle, the tool, that the holy spirit uses to reach people so that he can monergistically regenerate them, change their heart, remove their blindfold, etc.

In Arminianism, God doesn't do any of this. He only offers the gospel (God's part) and sits back and waits for man to do his part.

So Arminianism is completely missing out on a huge portion of God's activity. Thus, in Amrinianism, there is a lot less reason to worship God, and a lot less activity that God gets any credit, thanks, and adoration for.

You could say Arminianism has God as a lifeguard, and he tosses a flotation device to a person who is struggling to swim. The person must cooperate and grab the floaty, and hang on for dear life, with their own strength, as the lifeguard pulls them to the safety of the boat. Synergism

In Calvinism, the person is already drowned and dead and has sunk to the bottom of the sea. God is not just a lifeguard, he's a miracle worker and dives into the sea and drags the person to the shore and miraculously resurrects them from the dead. Monergism

The Bible plainly tells us that the Holy Spirit works through the gospel message and to rescue sinners from spiritual deadness:

14 How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.

And in this passage we see both election and the "effectual call" (ie, the spirit saving people through the vehicle of the gospel)

2 Thess 2:13-14
But we ought to give thanks to God always concerning you, brothers beloved by the Lord, that God has chosen you from the beginning unto salvation in the sanctification of the Spirit, and by faith of thetruth;
To this He called you through our gospel, so that you may share in the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
 
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PrettyboyAndy

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Anytime, it is my pleasure! I love talking theology!

Monergism and synergism explained simply:

Monergism: Comes from two root words: Mono (single) ergos (work). "single work" or "one work". Similar words: "Monocle" (eyewear with one glass piece). Monotheism (theism with one deity).

Synergism: two root words: Syn (together) ergos (work). Similar word: Synchronize

Monergism is the idea that one party, or one input, is the active agent in a human beings regeneration (ie, being born again) God's input alone is required for the regeneration of a man.
Calvinism says man is spiritually dead, thus cannot act or assist in his own resurrection. God does it alone. A corpse cannot help itself be resurrected.

Synergism is the idea that two parties are working together, cooperatively, for the human being's regeneration. (God and man cooperating)
In synergism, if man does not cooperate, God is powerless to regenerate the man because the process requires input from both God and man.
Arminianism says that man is not spiritually dead, only spiritually sick. God is like a doctor, offering you medicine, but it's up to you to reach out and grab the medicine and swallow it. Thus, you and the doctor both took actions that caused you get well from your illness.

The reason Arminianism views it this way is because the gospel is preached to all people. So they view the gospel as merely God's offering assistance.

Calvinism views the gospel as more than God merely offering people salvation. In Calvinism, God actually works through the gospel to visit sinners and regenerate them. The gospel is merely the vehicle, the tool, that the holy spirit uses to reach people so that he can monergistically regenerate them, change their heart, remove their blindfold, etc.

In Arminianism, God doesn't do any of this. He only offers the gospel (God's part) and sits back and waits for man to do his part.

So Arminianism is completely missing out on a huge portion of God's activity. Thus, in Amrinianism, there is a lot less reason to worship God, and a lot less activity that God gets any credit, thanks, and adoration for.

You could say Arminianism has God as a lifeguard, and he tosses a flotation device to a person who is struggling to swim. The person must cooperate and grab the floaty, and hang on for dear life, with their own strength, as the lifeguard pulls them to the safety of the boat. Synergism

In Calvinism, the person is already drowned and dead and has sunk to the bottom of the sea. God is not just a lifeguard, he's a miracle worker and dives into the sea and drags the person to the shore and miraculously resurrects them from the dead. Monergism

The Bible plainly tells us that the Holy Spirit works through the gospel message and to rescue sinners from spiritual deadness:

14 How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.

And in this passage we see both election and the "effectual call" (ie, the spirit saving people through the vehicle of the gospel)

2 Thess 2:13-14
But we ought to give thanks to God always concerning you, brothers beloved by the Lord, that God has chosen you from the beginning unto salvation in the sanctification of the Spirit, and by faith of thetruth;
To this He called you through our gospel, so that you may share in the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Great post, beautiful examples thank you
 
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SkyWriting

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Prove it.

God Bless

Till all are one.
Well Calvinists believe that man will do works of God? Correct? I can believe that God commands us to DO works without actually believing that such works actually save me.
 
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DeaconDean

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