Why are Christians so incredibly deceived about scripture?

[miknik5]

Thy will be done is sufficient
Be still and know that I am GOD

So what work is a man to do to be holy?

I'll point you to John 15

 

[-57]

"If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha." (1 Corinthians 16:22).
"If ye love me, keep my commandments." (John 14:15).

Here's where your theology falls apart.

You quoted those two verses. The first said if you don't love the Lord Jesus Christ then you are Anathema Maranatha.

The next verse say...if you love me, keep my commandments.

......Have you kept EVERY commandment of the Lord Jesus Christ? If not then by your own words YOU are "Anathema Maranatha".

 

[miknik5]

Check out YHWH'S TORAH before you decide.
Ask YHWH.
(HIS WAYS are so HIGHER than our ways - we need HIS WAYS)

Yep. HIS ways are!

and it's not even in a strong man to direct his own steps and lean not on your own understanding and yes remain in HIM and yes not by power or by might

Yes

I know

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

......Have you kept EVERY commandment of the Lord Jesus Christ? If not then by your own words

not.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Thy will be done is sufficient. Be still and know that I am GOD.
So what work is a man to do to be holy?
I'll point you to John 15

Why ?

 

[-57]

not.

Me too. I fail everyday. By some theological stands presented here I will face eternal damnation.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

.Have you kept EVERY commandment of the Lord Jesus Christ? If not then by your own words YOU are "Anathema Maranatha".

Sorry for not quoting fuller before .
NOT. i.e. "by your own words you are 'anathema maranatha' .
This
is not the condition, status nor expectation of any of the Apostles or disciples in Y'SHUA abiding as echad in HIM.
If any sin(s), there is an advocate with the FATHER,
except in some instances as revealed in HIS WORD.

Me too. I fail everyday. By some theological stands presented here I will face eternal damnation.

We aren't judged by anyone else here or on earth as regards eternal condemnation.

Y'SHUA'S WORD will judge us later, after or in the resurrection (HE said HE won't even judge us OR someone, Himself - HIS WORD ALREADY DELIVERED will judge).

 

[BobRyan]

Prayer so that one can be awakened by the Holy Spirit to see that with Sola Scripture one has to be very careful that one is not being led by the devil! He is a very clever demon.

Turns out scripture is to be trusted over man-made tradition of the magisterium

"How can that be?" you ask?



============== the details ====================
Notice what Jesus said about the obligation of others - when it comes to the "Commandment of God" -- the "Word of God" and "Moses said" -- in Mark 7:6-13


Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

Certainly from their point of view they would never have accused themselves of diminishing the Ten Commandments in the least.

But what does Christ accuse them of doing?

1. Using their own traditions to nullify one of the Ten Commandments.
2. He calls the Ten Commandments "Moses says" -- and "the Word of God" and "the Commandment of God"
3. He argues that even though they do not claim to be setting aside one of the Commandments of God - they in fact are by observing the example he gives in the case of the 5th Commandment.
4. He argues that this is just one example of the many things they do with their traditions - in this way - nullifying the Word of God. Contradicting the Commandment of God - one of the TEN.
5. He states that it nullifies their worship.
6. Jesus is not defending their additions -- he is defending God's Commandments

Jesus Himself admits that they are claiming to be proclaiming sacred tradition.

Matthew 23:2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
Matthew 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Turns out scripture is to be trusted over man-made tradition of the magisterium

Clarify? / Verify ---
"Turns out?"
I believe YHWH says SCRIPTURE(YHWH'S WORD)
is PERFECTLY ETERNALLY DESIGNED/ PURPOSED/ PLANNED
to be always trusted and relied upon;

man-made tradition was designed to oppose YHWH and HIS WORD, to deceive all people possible, and to gain power and control over the whole world all along.

 

[BobRyan]

Prayer so that one can be awakened by the Holy Spirit to see that with Sola Scripture one has to be very careful that one is not being led by the devil! He is a very clever demon.

That is the purpose of sola scriptura testing - to make sure one is not being lead by a cleaver demon.

Acts 17:11 "they studied the scriptures daily to SEE IF those things spoken to them by the Apostle Paul -- were SO"

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

That is the purpose of sola scriptura testing - to make sure one is not being lead by a cleaver demon.

Acts 17:11 "they studied the scriptures daily to SEE IF those things spoken to them by the Apostle Paul -- were SO"

Yes, so then,
what kind of person or teaching is and would be opposed to what SCRIPTURE SAYS ?

 

[John Hyperspace]

The church never had justification by faith until Martin Luther and the reformation. And once it was believed, then everyone slowly drifted in that direction of interpretation of scripture.

This has continued in the church. Reformation -> Baptist & Methodist -> Adventist -> Finney-Moody -> Pentecost -> Apostolic

Now what has happened to me is I currently attending a modern Full-Gospel church, but also participating in an apostolic evangelist group. And even among Bible teachers I listen to, I hear differences. Now, most differences, who cares?

But some of the differences I have encountered concern salvation itself and the Gospel.

Paul says:

But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse! - Galatians 1:8

But this is clearly happening... even happening among groups that are very similar. My church doesn't preach water baptism does anything, it is symbolic they say, and you just do it because you were told to. The apostolic group says it is required for salvation, as if you wont enter heaven without it.

And in my own research, I am trying to figure out who is right and who is wrong since I will be under a curse should I not get my interpretation correct.

My conclusion was a 3rd thing no one has ever preached before. This means that if I am correct, all of Christianity is cursed since I'm the only person with the true gospel.

And my human reaction is that this is ludicrous.

Why can't Christians understand the gospel? I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong, but shouldn't someone understand it? And that group that does understand it, why are they right and all other Christians dead wrong and cursed?

But this applies to any topic really about scripture. "I'm right because I have 5 verses plus my own interpretation of those 5 verses, and I ignored 10 verses to come up with these 5... " This seems to be Christianity's interpretation of scripture.

I feel that this is mainly due to the fact that most professing Christians follow tradition instead of seeking truth. When I was a young boy, I asked "Why is our church right, and everyone else is wrong?" And they said, "Because only we interpret the bible the right way." I asked, "All of the other Christians go to hell because they're not right?" "Yes." I thought about it for a minute and said in my heart, "Isn't it lucky that I was born into a family that has always went to the only right church?" and the older I got, the more I began to think, "Too lucky. Something seems off..."

People are taught by their parents, and accept that authority of truth, and usually grow up unable to see the predicament they're in. It's a prison that has slowly been erected around them one bar at a time; so by the time they're fully imprisoned, they don't even realize there are any bars at all. Now the "see" what they were taught "into" the bible. They don't "read out" of the bible, but they "read in" what they were taught. This is why they will pick their "5 verses" as "proof" because these are the "5 verses" that were taught to be read in a certain way, and called "proof"

A good gauge is this: I ask, "Are you a member of the same church as your parents?" If the answer is, "Yes" then, something is wrong. If the answer is "No" then it doesn't necessarily mean nothing is wrong, but it does mean, you're at least half-way home.

Add into this that, to a great many, Christianity is not so much a search for truth, but a social institution: an "agreement" on what is "real" in order to facilitate a feeling of belonging, and providing an "anchor" for handling life-situations. Others will simply use Christianity is a form of "self righteousness"; it isn't about a search for truth, it is about being able to say "See how righteous I am, look and see me in church; I am better than you, and that makes me feel good at life." There are as many variables as there are people, but for the most part, not many actually engage in a search for truth, but just a "reaffirming that I am right, and you are wrong." Or, "I am intelligent; you are not." A host of selfish reasons for professing Christ. And, unfortunately, this is the image of Christianity presented to the world, and this becomes a stumblingblock to those who seek from outside. Luke 11:52, Matthew 23:15, Jeremiah 9:3

But, the good news is that, to those who sincerely seek after, and thirst after, truth: it will be given to them. But they will be very few and very far between. Luke 11:9

 

[Monk Brendan]

If a Catholic can believe that....and not add to it...to obtain salvation they will be saved.

It IS taught, with nothing added. And millions believe it, and try to live it each day.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Is this self-sanctification?
Or, is it the work of the ONE who makes men holy?

More like... a person chooses of their own free will on whether or not they want the good work or fruit of Christ to flow within their life or not.


...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Do you understand the HOLY perfect unbiased impartial righteousness of GOD? Have you learned to be "perfect and holy" as our FATHER in Heaven?

Jesus says be ye perfect as the Heavenly Father is perfect. I don't believe Jesus was lying to us about that.


...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I feel that this is mainly due to the fact that most professing Christians follow tradition instead of seeking truth. When I was a young boy, I asked "Why is our church right, and everyone else is wrong?" And they said, "Because only we interpret the bible the right way." I asked, "All of the other Christians go to hell because they're not right?" "Yes." I thought about it for a minute and said in my heart, "Isn't it lucky that I was born into a family that has always went to the only right church?" and the older I got, the more I began to think, "Too lucky. Something seems off..."

People are taught by their parents, and accept that authority of truth, and usually grow up unable to see the predicament they're in. It's a prison that has slowly been erected around them one bar at a time; so by the time they're fully imprisoned, they don't even realize there are any bars at all. Now the "see" what they were taught "into" the bible. They don't "read out" of the bible, but they "read in" what they were taught. This is why they will pick their "5 verses" as "proof" because these are the "5 verses" that were taught to be read in a certain way, and called "proof"

A good gauge is this: I ask, "Are you a member of the same church as your parents?" If the answer is, "Yes" then, something is wrong. If the answer is "No" then it doesn't necessarily mean nothing is wrong, but it does mean, you're at least half-way home.

Add into this that, to a great many, Christianity is not so much a search for truth, but a social institution: an "agreement" on what is "real" in order to facilitate a feeling of belonging, and providing an "anchor" for handling life-situations. Others will simply use Christianity is a form of "self righteousness"; it isn't about a search for truth, it is about being able to say "See how righteous I am, look and see me in church; I am better than you, and that makes me feel good at life." There are as many variables as there are people, but for the most part, not many actually engage in a search for truth, but just a "reaffirming that I am right, and you are wrong." Or, "I am intelligent; you are not." A host of selfish reasons for professing Christ. And, unfortunately, this is the image of Christianity presented to the world, and this becomes a stumblingblock to those who seek from outside. Luke 11:52, Matthew 23:15, Jeremiah 9:3

But, the good news is that, to those who sincerely seek after, and thirst after, truth: it will be given to them. But they will be very few and very far between. Luke 11:9

Jesus says narrow is the way that leads into life and few be there that find it.

Hebrews 12:14 says without holiness, no man shall see the Lord.


...

 

[-57]

Jesus says be ye perfect as the Heavenly Father is perfect. I don't believe Jesus was lying to us about that.


...

If you're not perfect...then what?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yes. Every christian that has walked the earth and is alive today has unrepentent sin. That would include you.

When I say unrepentant sin, I am talking about sin that leads unto death (like hate, murder, lying, adultery, theft, etc.). If that is the kind of sin you are referring to, then it would not be true that all Christians abide in unrepentant sin. For example: Just look at the 144,000. For they were found without fault before the throne of God (Revelation 14:3-5).


...

 

[John Hyperspace]

Jesus says narrow is the way that leads into life and few be there that find it.

Indeed. But, can the few that find it, give it to those that did not? I recall Romans 10:20

Hebrews 12:14 says without holiness, no man shall see the Lord.

What do you think it means to "see the Lord"? To me, this means that without peace and holiness it's not possible to see the Lord everywhere around us, working through all things according to love. I'm reminded of 1 John 4:12 and 3 John 1:11

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

If you're not perfect...then what?

So far as I've seen on this forum, mostly,
it simply means
someone doesn't know what Y'SHUA meant,
or
someone doesn't want to give up their life to live HIS WAY
or
both.
It is awkward since so few people on earth care
and even more don't want to do what Y'SHUA says to do,
or what YHWH says to do -
they just want something from HIM.