Who should be allowed to adopt?

[ReformedChapin]

WHAT website? I keep telling you... Biblegateway.com you can click the links yourself!

Now, 430=450 talents, its a contradiction... either show me why it isn't, or I take it as an admission from you that it IS a contradiction, and cite you as a supporter of my claim that the Bible is flawed... otherwise you would have explained away the contradiction by now, wouldn't you?

You think I can't see stalling for time right in front of me? NEWGUY101 CONFIRMS CONTRADICTION IN THE BIBLE!!! NEWGUY101 CONFIRMS CONTRADICTION IN THE BIBLE!!!

Please don't misrepresent me...and grow up. BIBLEGATEWAY has no contradictions area....you are getting this from another website.

I can refute this with the proper context for the millionth time...I wont waste my time until you show me the source of your "contradictions."

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Please don't misrepresent me...and grow up. BIBLEGATEWAY has no contradictions area....you are getting this from another website.

I can refute this with the proper context for the millionth time...I wont waste my time until you show me the source of your "contradictions."

THE... SOURCE... OF...THIS... CONTRADICTION...IS... THE...BIBLE...WHERE...ELSE...DO...YOU...THINK...IT... COMES...FROM?

Talk is cheap. If you could refute it, you would have by now. Sti;;, nice to have definitive proof as to who is the finer Biblical scholar... I can support MY claims about the Bible (i.e. it has contradictions) while you (i.e. it is inerrant and has no contradictions) clearly cannot.

I know you're a bad looser, but I will TRY to be gracious in victory

 

[Gukkor]

WHAT website? I keep telling you... Biblegateway.com you can click the links yourself!

Now, 430=450 talents, its a contradiction... either show me why it isn't, or I take it as an admission from you that it IS a contradiction, and cite you as a supporter of my claim that the Bible is flawed... otherwise you would have explained away the contradiction by now, wouldn't you?

You think I can't see stalling for time right in front of me? NEWGUY101 CONFIRMS CONTRADICTION IN THE BIBLE!!! NEWGUY101 CONFIRMS CONTRADICTION IN THE BIBLE!!!

Man...burn...

 

[WalksWithChrist]

Please don't misrepresent me...and grow up. BIBLEGATEWAY has no contradictions area....you are getting this from another website.

I can refute this with the proper context for the millionth time...I wont waste my time until you show me the source of your "contradictions."

She posted direct links to the verses themselves on Biblegateway.

That is confusing to you how?

 

[ReformedChapin]

THE... SOURCE... OF...THIS... CONTRADICTION...IS... THE...BIBLE...WHERE...ELSE...DO...YOU...THINK...IT... COMES...FROM?

Talk is cheap. If you could refute it, you would have by now. Sti;;, nice to have definitive proof as to who is the finer Biblical scholar... I can support MY claims about the Bible (i.e. it has contradictions) while you (i.e. it is inerrant and has no contradictions) clearly cannot.

I know you're a bad looser, but I will TRY to be gracious in victory

Nope, you have a website...I know you do. And I know you want to make up the contradictions in your head. Have fun, my job isn't to convince...no one can.

 

[ReformedChapin]

She posted direct links to the verses themselves on Biblegateway.

That is confusing to you how?

There is no confusion. Those direct links are from another website citing biblegateway.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Nope, you have a website...I know you do. And I know you want to make up the contradictions in your head. Have fun, my job isn't to convince...no one can.

how do you think I'm making this up in my head? go and look in your own Bible then... right there, next to your elbow... go on, check the verses, they're just as contradictory in your hard copy Bible as they are in my head...

 

[EnemyPartyII]

To the wider room:

Help me out here guys, are 420 and 450 different numbers, or is that just in my head?

If two differeent sources use these numbers to describe the same incident, is that a contradiction, or is that just in my head too?

 

[david_x]

It is through God that a person is able to accomplish great things, but that doesn't mean that a person can't factually state that they accomplished something great.

Exactly.

 

[WalksWithChrist]

There is no confusion. Those direct links are from another website citing biblegateway.

*BUZZZ*

Try again. I double checked the linx just now. They are direct linx to biblegateway.

Linx to Bible verses.

This isn't rocket science here.

Checking a URL against a site is as simple as a click man! Give it a try.

 

[ReformedChapin]

how do you think I'm making this up in my head? go and look in your own Bible then... right there, next to your elbow... go on, check the verses, they're just as contradictory in your hard copy Bible as they are in my head...

There is no contradictions, you should brother reading verses in context not just looking up at websites online to satisfy yourself.

 

[tulc]

There is no contradictions, you should brother reading verses in context not just looking up at websites online to satisfy yourself.

All right here you go:

2 Chronicles 8

1And it came to pass at the end of twenty years, wherein Solomon had built the house of the LORD, and his own house,
2That the cities which Huram had restored to Solomon, Solomon built them, and caused the children of Israel to dwell there.
3And Solomon went to Hamathzobah, and prevailed against it.
4And he built Tadmor in the wilderness, and all the store cities, which he built in Hamath.
5Also he built Bethhoron the upper, and Bethhoron the nether, fenced cities, with walls, gates, and bars;
6And Baalath, and all the store cities that Solomon had, and all the chariot cities, and the cities of the horsemen, and all that Solomon desired to build in Jerusalem, and in Lebanon, and throughout all the land of his dominion.
7As for all the people that were left of the Hittites, and the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, which were not of Israel,
8But of their children, who were left after them in the land, whom the children of Israel consumed not, them did Solomon make to pay tribute until this day.
9But of the children of Israel did Solomon make no servants for his work; but they were men of war, and chief of his captains, and captains of his chariots and horsemen.
10And these were the chief of king Solomon's officers, even two hundred and fifty, that bare rule over the people.
11And Solomon brought up the daughter of Pharaoh out of the city of David unto the house that he had built for her: for he said, My wife shall not dwell in the house of David king of Israel, because the places are holy, whereunto the ark of the LORD hath come.
12Then Solomon offered burnt offerings unto the LORD on the altar of the LORD, which he had built before the porch,
13Even after a certain rate every day, offering according to the commandment of Moses, on the sabbaths, and on the new moons, and on the solemn feasts, three times in the year, even in the feast of unleavened bread, and in the feast of weeks, and in the feast of tabernacles.
14And he appointed, according to the order of David his father, the courses of the priests to their service, and the Levites to their charges, to praise and minister before the priests, as the duty of every day required: the porters also by their courses at every gate: for so had David the man of God commanded.
15And they departed not from the commandment of the king unto the priests and Levites concerning any matter, or concerning the treasures.
16Now all the work of Solomon was prepared unto the day of the foundation of the house of the LORD, and until it was finished. So the house of the LORD was perfected.
17Then went Solomon to Eziongeber, and to Eloth, at the sea side in the land of Edom.
18And Huram sent him by the hands of his servants ships, and servants that had knowledge of the sea; and they went with the servants of Solomon to Ophir, and took thence four hundred and fifty talents of gold, and brought them to king Solomon.

1 Kings 9

1And it came to pass, when Solomon had finished the building of the house of the LORD, and the king's house, and all Solomon's desire which he was pleased to do,
2That the LORD appeared to Solomon the second time, as he had appeared unto him at Gibeon.
3And the LORD said unto him, I have heard thy prayer and thy supplication, that thou hast made before me: I have hallowed this house, which thou hast built, to put my name there for ever; and mine eyes and mine heart shall be there perpetually.
4And if thou wilt walk before me, as David thy father walked, in integrity of heart, and in uprightness, to do according to all that I have commanded thee, and wilt keep my statutes and my judgments:
5Then I will establish the throne of thy kingdom upon Israel for ever, as I promised to David thy father, saying, There shall not fail thee a man upon the throne of Israel.
6But if ye shall at all turn from following me, ye or your children, and will not keep my commandments and my statutes which I have set before you, but go and serve other gods, and worship them:
7Then will I cut off Israel out of the land which I have given them; and this house, which I have hallowed for my name, will I cast out of my sight; and Israel shall be a proverb and a byword among all people:
8And at this house, which is high, every one that passeth by it shall be astonished, and shall hiss; and they shall say, Why hath the LORD done thus unto this land, and to this house?
9And they shall answer, Because they forsook the LORD their God, who brought forth their fathers out of the land of Egypt, and have taken hold upon other gods, and have worshipped them, and served them: therefore hath the LORD brought upon them all this evil.
10And it came to pass at the end of twenty years, when Solomon had built the two houses, the house of the LORD, and the king's house,
11(Now Hiram the king of Tyre had furnished Solomon with cedar trees and fir trees, and with gold, according to all his desire,) that then king Solomon gave Hiram twenty cities in the land of Galilee.
12And Hiram came out from Tyre to see the cities which Solomon had given him; and they pleased him not.
13And he said, What cities are these which thou hast given me, my brother? And he called them the land of Cabul unto this day.
14And Hiram sent to the king sixscore talents of gold.
15And this is the reason of the levy which king Solomon raised; for to build the house of the LORD, and his own house, and Millo, and the wall of Jerusalem, and Hazor, and Megiddo, and Gezer.
16For Pharaoh king of Egypt had gone up, and taken Gezer, and burnt it with fire, and slain the Canaanites that dwelt in the city, and given it for a present unto his daughter, Solomon's wife.
17And Solomon built Gezer, and Bethhoron the nether,
18And Baalath, and Tadmor in the wilderness, in the land,
19And all the cities of store that Solomon had, and cities for his chariots, and cities for his horsemen, and that which Solomon desired to build in Jerusalem, and in Lebanon, and in all the land of his dominion.
20And all the people that were left of the Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites, which were not of the children of Israel,
21Their children that were left after them in the land, whom the children of Israel also were not able utterly to destroy, upon those did Solomon levy a tribute of bondservice unto this day.
22But of the children of Israel did Solomon make no bondmen: but they were men of war, and his servants, and his princes, and his captains, and rulers of his chariots, and his horsemen.
23These were the chief of the officers that were over Solomon's work, five hundred and fifty, which bare rule over the people that wrought in the work.
24But Pharaoh's daughter came up out of the city of David unto her house which Solomon had built for her: then did he build Millo.
25And three times in a year did Solomon offer burnt offerings and peace offerings upon the altar which he built unto the LORD, and he burnt incense upon the altar that was before the LORD. So he finished the house.
26And king Solomon made a navy of ships in Eziongeber, which is beside Eloth, on the shore of the Red sea, in the land of Edom.
27And Hiram sent in the navy his servants, shipmen that had knowledge of the sea, with the servants of Solomon.
28And they came to Ophir, and fetched from thence gold, four hundred and twenty talents, and brought it to king Solomon.

There they are.
tulc(thinks some of the gold may have "fallen off the truck" somewhere)

 

[Phinehas2]

thanks tulc

But I think I should point out that however much gold, the gold was about four hundred and it was taken to Solomon.
the sort of contradiction we need to see is if one of the texts said there was gold taken to Solomon from Ophir and the other text said no-one went to Ophir and there was no gold taken to Solomon.
On the topic concerned, however we do have a real contradiction. The Bible only countenances man/woman union and celibacy and condemns same-sex sex, yet some claim same-sex sex is ok which is contarry to what the Bible says.
What is worth noting is why those who quibble about how much gold between the Chronocles and Kings accounts, should be so bothered when they cant merely disbelieve passages like 1 Cor 6, 1 Tim 1 and Romans 1.

 

[WalksWithChrist]

There is no contradictions, you should brother reading verses in context not just looking up at websites online to satisfy yourself.

Maybe sistering the verses would work better?

 

[EnemyPartyII]

thanks tulc

But I think I should point out that however much gold, the gold was about four hundred and it was taken to Solomon.
the sort of contradiction we need to see is if one of the texts said there was gold taken to Solomon from Ophir and the other text said no-one went to Ophir and there was no gold taken to Solomon.
On the topic concerned, however we do have a real contradiction. The Bible only countenances man/woman union and celibacy and condemns same-sex sex, yet some claim same-sex sex is ok which is contarry to what the Bible says.
What is worth noting is why those who quibble about how much gold between the Chronocles and Kings accounts, should be so bothered when they cant merely disbelieve passages like 1 Cor 6, 1 Tim 1 and Romans 1.

GOAL POST SHIFTING ALERT!!!!

If There is ANY contradiction in the Bible, then the Bible is NOT inerrant...PERIOD!

Thats not to say the Bible is invalid, or worthless... its just not perfect.

JE 8:8 The scribes falsify the word.
2TH 2:11-12 God deceives the wicked (to be able to condemn them).
(Note: Every word of God cannot prove true if God deceives anyone at all; the Bible cannot be trusted if the scribes falsify the word. The first reference is mutually exclusive with the other three. Thus, the Bible cannot be the perfect work of a perfect and loving God since one or more of the above references is obviously untrue. Note also: Some versions use the word "persuade" rather than "deceives." The context makes clear, however, that deception is involved.)

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear EnemyPartyII
I do accept your claim of goal post shifting and this is not the only instance where the Bible has different details. Nonetheless Christian chuches in general claim the Bible is inerrant and infalible is matters of faith, conduct and salvation.

However in your haste to disprove the bible so you can justify same-sex sex, I see you have failed to address the issue where you dont believe the exclusions and condemnations of same-sex sex. Why would you be bothered by two different amounts of gold taken from Ophor to Solomon when you dont believe Genesis 2, 19, Lev 18 and 20 Judges 19, Matthew 19, Mark 10, 1 Corinthians 6, 1 Timothy 1, Romans 1, Ephesians 5, Hebrews 13, 2 Peter 2, Jude 1. Clearly you arent really interested in the accuracy of the Bible so much as justfying what you want.

passages of Scripture used to define marriage as one man and one woman are descriptive, not prescriptive

Diffcult to justfy that as the pasages say that it was God's purpose that man and woman shall be united, and God created woman for man. The passages are most definatley prescriptive.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Dear EnemyPartyII
I do accept your claim of goal post shifting and this is not the only instance where the Bible has different details. Nonetheless Christian chuches in general claim the Bible is inerrant and infalible is matters of faith, conduct and salvation.

However in your haste to disprove the bible so you can justify same-sex sex, I see you have failed to address the issue where you dont believe the exclusions and condemnations of same-sex sex. Why would you be bothered by two different amounts of gold taken from Ophor to Solomon when you dont believe Genesis 2, 19, Lev 18 and 20 Judges 19, Matthew 19, Mark 10, 1 Corinthians 6, 1 Timothy 1, Romans 1, Ephesians 5, Hebrews 13, 2 Peter 2, Jude 1. Clearly you arent really interested in the accuracy of the Bible so much as justfying what you want.

Diffcult to justfy that as the pasages say that it was God's purpose that man and woman shall be united, and God created woman for man. The passages are most definatley prescriptive.

the whole point of pointing out Biblical contradictions and errors, is an exercise in showing that the Bible is NOT inerrant and changeless... and that therefore, sensible and reasonable, rational interpretation is not only acceptible, but REQUIRED to understand it... otherwise its just a bunch of conflicting, badly written claptrap

 

[tulc]

Christian chuches in general claim the Bible is inerrant and infalible is matters of faith, conduct and salvation.

...which isn't a problem generally, where the problem lies is when people start claiming that their understanding of scripture is also inerrent and infallible.
tulc(been called a "cafetereia Christian" so often it only amuses me anymore)

 

[Phinehas2]

Yes that is correct tulc, and we can see from those remarks about 'just your opinion' that what is just someones opinion on a particualr topic is actually and opinion shared by the majority of the church.
The problem doesnt just lie with people claiming it is their understanding, the problemis here telling individuals that its just their opinion, when in fact it isnt just their opinion.

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear EnemyPartyII

the whole point of pointing out Biblical contradictions and errors, is an exercise in showing that the Bible is NOT inerrant and changeless... and that therefore, sensible and reasonable, rational interpretation is not only acceptible, but REQUIRED to understand it... otherwise its just a bunch of conflicting, badly written claptrap

I agree with that except it doesnt mean the Bible is changeless. If you prospose to change the examples given how much gold are you proposing. What i think you want to do is suggest that the pronoucements against same-sex sex can be changed. I mean Genesis 2, 19, Lev 18 and 20 Judges 19, Matthew 19, Mark 10, 1 Corinthians 6, 1 Timothy 1, Romans 1, Ephesians 5, Hebrews 13, 2 Peter 2, Jude 1. ??
Maybe someone wont believe 1 Corintians 13 and all that stuff about love either.