Who goes to hell?

[Timothew]

Are you not aware that sin causes spiritual death?

Genesis 2:17 (NASB)
17 but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you will surely die."

Adam died spiritually the day he sinned, but not physically, as does everyone but Jesus. Have you not been born again?

You haven't been paying attention. Spiritual death caused by sin is clearly taught in the Bible.

1 Timothy 5:6 (NASB)
6 But she who gives herself to wanton pleasure is dead even while she lives.

Colossians 2:13 (NASB)
13 When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions,

Luke 15:24 (NASB)
24 for this son of mine was dead and has come to life again; he was lost and has been found.' And they began to celebrate.

The term "spiritual death" is not even in the bible so how could "spiritual death caused by sin" be "clearly taught in the bible"?

I pay attention to everything you post. That's why I disagree with you so much. Clearly the bible does not teach of a thing called "spiritual death" since "spiritual death" is not even in the bible, not even one time.

The verses you posted say nothing whatsoever about "spiritual death." The concept of spiritual death seems to be nothing more than an attempt to deny that people actually will die and be dead forever as a result of sin.

 

[Satt]

The term "spiritual death" is not even in the bible so how could "spiritual death caused by sin" be "clearly taught in the bible"?

I pay attention to everything you post. That's why I disagree with you so much. Clearly the bible does not teach of a thing called "spiritual death" since "spiritual death" is not even in the bible, not even one time.

The verses you posted say nothing whatsoever about "spiritual death." The concept of spiritual death seems to be nothing more than an attempt to deny that people actually will die and be dead forever as a result of sin.

^This

 

[dollarsbill]

The term "spiritual death" is not even in the bible so how could "spiritual death caused by sin" be "clearly taught in the bible"?

I pay attention to everything you post. That's why I disagree with you so much. Clearly the bible does not teach of a thing called "spiritual death" since "spiritual death" is not even in the bible, not even one time.

The verses you posted say nothing whatsoever about "spiritual death." The concept of spiritual death seems to be nothing more than an attempt to deny that people actually will die and be dead forever as a result of sin.

Those who haven't been 'born again' are still dead in their sins.

John 3:3 (NASB)
3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."

 

[Timothew]

Those who haven't been 'born again' are still dead in their sins.

John 3:3 (NASB)
3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."

Even the words You use prove my point. "still dead in their sins", They are not "eternally tortured in hell in their sins".

Dead in their sins refers to the ultimate outcome of their sins, which is death, not eternal torture in hell.

 

[Sadalmelik]

The term "spiritual death" is not even in the bible so how could "spiritual death caused by sin" be "clearly taught in the bible"?

I pay attention to everything you post. That's why I disagree with you so much. Clearly the bible does not teach of a thing called "spiritual death" since "spiritual death" is not even in the bible, not even one time.

The verses you posted say nothing whatsoever about "spiritual death." The concept of spiritual death seems to be nothing more than an attempt to deny that people actually will die and be dead forever as a result of sin.

 

[strangertoo]

It certainly isn't physical death. What would you call it?

Actually it clearly says they are dead even while they are alive.
sinners live in conflict with their conscience until they accept Jesus , and hence his command... and certainly sinners look 'dead' whilst alive because of the struggle of fighting themselves all the time... but they are not dead , anyone can FREELY CHOOSE to stop sinning by freewill , freely chosoe to love in obedience to Jesus... and the loving saints have a certain glow in their eyes, they look and feel more alive once accepting ceasing from sin... but even the spirit of sinners returns returns to God at death, the spirit is of God and cannot die, so there can be no spiritual death, God is not subject to death, death is for bodies , not spirit ...

I know you are trying to squeeze everyone into God's eternal Kingdom but it's just not gonna happen.

Untrue my friend, I cannot get anyone saved and have no intention of trying ... it is God who is saviour of all men , not me :-

1 Timothy 4:10 ...we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, ...

Isaiah 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

Isaiah 59:1 Behold, the LORD’S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save

God's perfect foolproof plan is declared , written... He cannot stop the many destroying themselves in this life[Matt 7:13] but can set up the kingdom and resurrect them all from hell and death [Rev 20:13]

, so countless many are later saved by works [ Rev 20:13, Rev 7:9-10] and then the final 'baptism of fire' in the 'lake of fire' for those resurrected from a second death as wages of sin in the new earth ... there is the plan briefly summarised but you need to read it all yourself, to understand what Jesus says, that ALL will accept him eventually, although few do in this life [Matt 7:14] :-

Rev 5:13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

Philippians 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

Revelation 20:10 (NASB)
10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

read a LITERAL translation , the torment only goes on to the 'ages' of the 'ages' , that is until the repentance of Satan at the end of time ...

even modern Physics has come to realise that time is CREATED and will end with this universe , and indeed again with the end of the new earth and heavens ... TIME is finite , there is no endless time, God is time-less, not dwelling in some mythical infinity of time... time is of the creation, not of the creator, God does not change, as men must do to live :-

Malachi 3:6 For I am the LORD, I change not;

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

A glimpse of eternity:

again, there is no infinity of time, time is created, finite, it always ends , just as all created things end, only the spirit of a man is ['breath'] of God ... the reality of a man is spirit, we are made in God's image, spirit, not God made in the image of man [even Jesus was translated later to spirit- after his resurrection to the flesh ... ]

Revelation 22:11 (NASB)
11 "Let the one who does wrong, still do wrong; and the one who is filthy, still be filthy; and let the one who is righteous, still practice righteousness; and the one who is holy, still keep himself holy."

this is indeed true in THIS earth , because the few find the way to Jesus [Matt 7:14] and the many are destroyed [Matt 7:13] ,but then countless many are saved [Rev 7:9-10] later, not just the few saved first to be the kings and priests of the kingdom come of Jesus ...

and the unrighteous of thisearth, the vast majority bar only 144,000 saints out of over 12 billion that ever lived, ALL these sinners destroyed now [Matt 7:13] are released from hell and death [Rev 20:13] ... these are Jesus words and I cannot even guess why you never read them and understood ...

 

[dollarsbill]

Even the words You use prove my point. "still dead in their sins", They are not "eternally tortured in hell in their sins".

Dead in their sins refers to the ultimate outcome of their sins, which is death, not eternal torture in hell.

Have you been born again? Some of us have.

1 Peter 1:23 (NASB)
23 for you have been born again not of seed which is perishable but imperishable, that is, through the living and enduring word of God.

Those who haven't been born again are dead in their sins.

Ephesians 2:4-5 (NASB)
4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),

 

[dollarsbill]

but they are not dead

Then why does the NT say they are dead when they are alive? Because they are dead spiritually.

1 Timothy 5:6 (NASB)
6 But she who gives herself to wanton pleasure is dead even while she lives.

1 Timothy 4:10 ...we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, ...

Only potentially. Those who don't repent will spend eternity in the Lake of Fire. God's promises of salvation are conditional upon believing and repentance.

John 3:36 (NASB)
36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

, so countless many are later saved by works [ Rev 20:13, Rev 7:9-10] and then the final 'baptism of fire' in the 'lake of fire' for those resurrected from a second death as wages of sin in the new earth ... there is the plan briefly summarised but you need to read it all yourself, to understand what Jesus says, that ALL will accept him eventually, although few do in this life [Matt 7:14] :-

You are giving false hope to the lost. The Lake of Fire is eternal.

read a LITERAL translation , the torment only goes on to the 'ages' of the 'ages' , that is until the repentance of Satan at the end of time ...

Which in no way denies that it is forever. Satan is going to repent??? Oh my.

this is indeed true in THIS earth , because the few find the way to Jesus [Matt 7:14] and the many are destroyed [Matt 7:13] ,but then countless many are saved [Rev 7:9-10] later, not just the few saved first to be the kings and priests of the kingdom come of Jesus ...

and the unrighteous of thisearth, the vast majority bar only 144,000 saints out of over 12 billion that ever lived, ALL these sinners destroyed now [Matt 7:13] are released from hell and death [Rev 20:13] ... these are Jesus words and I cannot even guess why you never read them and understood ...

Forever means FOREVER. And I wouldn't want to be held accountable for those who spend eternity in the fire because I told them everyone will be saved. Forever means FOREVER.

Revelation 14:9-11 (NASB)
9 Then another angel, a third one, followed them, saying with a loud voice, "If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he also will drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is mixed in full strength in the cup of His anger; and he will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11 "And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."

Eternity is a very long time to be wrong about this. If what you are saying is true then why did God warn us over and over and over ???

Ezekiel 3:18-21 (NASB)
18 "When I say to the wicked, 'You will surely die,' and you do not warn him or speak out to warn the wicked from his wicked way that he may live, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand. 19 "Yet if you have warned the wicked and he does not turn from his wickedness or from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but you have delivered yourself. 20 "Again, when a righteous man turns away from his righteousness and commits iniquity, and I place an obstacle before him, he will die; since you have not warned him, he shall die in his sin, and his righteous deeds which he has done shall not be remembered; but his blood I will require at your hand. 21 "However, if you have warned the righteous man that the righteous should not sin and he does not sin, he shall surely live because he took warning; and you have delivered yourself."

 

[Timothew]

Have you been born again? Some of us have.

1 Peter 1:23 (NASB)
23 for you have been born again not of seed which is perishable but imperishable, that is, through the living and enduring word of God.

Those who haven't been born again are dead in their sins.

Ephesians 2:4-5 (NASB)
4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),

Thanks for asking! Yes I have been born again. Therefore I will not go to the second death, I will be resurrected to eternal life to live forever with Jesus Christ. I will not perish because I have been made unperishable, but I'm afraid that those who have not been made unperishable remain perishable, and will perish in the second death.

 

[dollarsbill]

Thanks for asking! Yes I have been born again.

Which means you were dead, spiritually. All humans are spiritually dead unless/until they are 'born again'. That's what 'spiritual death' means. Alive but dead.

 

[Timothew]

Which means you were dead, spiritually. All humans are spiritually dead unless/until they are 'born again'. That's what 'spiritual death' means. Alive but dead.

No. I was not dead. I remember it well. I was alive, I was 20 years old and living in Idaho. I was alive but not dead. Dead is the opposite of Alive. You can't literally be both.

 

[dollarsbill]

No. I was not dead. I remember it well. I was alive, I was 20 years old and living in Idaho. I was alive but not dead. Dead is the opposite of Alive. You can't literally be both.

I've already quoted several Scriptures that say otherwise. Did you miss them? Why did you need to be 'born again' if you weren't spiritually dead? Were you born again physically?

 

[Timothew]

The greek "anothen" refers to being born "from above" being born all over again. Jesus was telling Nicodemus that he couldn't trust in being a jew for salvation. He must be born of the spirit, not born of the flesh. Hence, born again. It is a figure of speech, not a literal rebirth. Those that receive Jesus Christ are given the right to become children of God. We are put into God's family. We will be resurrected to eternal life.

 

[dollarsbill]

The greek "anothen" refers to being born "from above" being born all over again. Jesus was telling Nicodemus that he couldn't trust in being a jew for salvation. He must be born of the spirit, not born of the flesh. Hence, born again. It is a figure of speech, not a literal rebirth. Those that receive Jesus Christ are given the right to become children of God. We are put into God's family. We will be resurrected to eternal life.

And another NT alive but dead.

Revelation 3:1 (NASB)
1 "To the angel of the church in Sardis write: He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars, says this: 'I know your deeds, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead.

 

[phishin4min]

The greek "anothen" refers to being born "from above" being born all over again. Jesus was telling Nicodemus that he couldn't trust in being a jew for salvation. He must be born of the spirit, not born of the flesh. Hence, born again. It is a figure of speech, not a literal rebirth. Those that receive Jesus Christ are given the right to become children of God. We are put into God's family. We will be resurrected to eternal life.

I would say it very much a literal rebirth, because everything is different after being born again..........unless your like a dog and simply return to your vomit, and go back to the ways you once walked in before Christ made Himself known to you

 

[Timothew]

I would say it very much a literal rebirth, because everything is different after being born again..........unless your like a dog and simply return to your vomit, and go back to the ways you once walked in before Christ made Himself known to you

You mean, very much a symbolic rebirth because everything is different after being born again. A literal rebirth would be literally entering your mother's womb and being born again. It would be messy.

 

[Sadalmelik]

You mean, very much a symbolic rebirth because everything is different after being born again. A literal rebirth would be literally entering your mother's womb and being born again. It would be messy.

dude, thats a pretty gross thought.