Who’ll be tempted after the 1000 years?

HTacianas

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There is no "original church" except Christianity itself. Any church teaching that the Millennium is not future is teaching falsely. Look around, Satan is deceiving the nations right now so we know this isn't the Millennium and that's one thing out of many that proves the Mil is not now.

The Church at Antioch, where they were first called Christians, is still there. And it doesn't teach millenialism.

Forgive me, but you've given only your opinion in support of your opinion. The Chiliasm controversy was resolved by the Church a very long time ago.
 
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ewq1938

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The Church at Antioch, where they were first called Christians, is still there. And it doesn't teach millenialism.

Forgive me, but you've given only your opinion in support of your opinion. The Chiliasm controversy was resolved by the Church a very long time ago.

For some maybe but the majority of Christians in the past and now support Pre-Millennialism and so did most if not all the earliest church father's. Again, any people teaching against it are not teaching Rev 20 properly.
 
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HTacianas

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For some maybe but the majority of Christians in the past and now support Pre-Millennialism and so did most if not all the earliest church father's. Again, any people teaching against it are not teaching Rev 20 properly.

The early Church debated the idea back and forth until it was resolved. In modern times it is only a small minority who believe in it.
 
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ewq1938

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The early Church debated the idea back and forth until it was resolved. In modern times it is only a small minority who believe in it.

It remains the majority in Evangelical churches. It was the Catholic church and Origen that promoted the Amil doctrine. There was no such doctrine prior to Origen from what I have read.


http://www.christianpost.com/news/poll-what-evangelical-leaders-believe-about-the-end-times-49340/

"This end times theology is called premillennialism and 65 percent of surveyed evangelical leaders identify with it."

"The poll, released this week, found that 13 percent of those surveyed are amillennialists – believing that the non-literal millennial reign of Christ is happening now as Christ reigns at the right hand of the Father."

http://www.nae.net/resources/news/539-premillennialism-reigns-in-evangelical-theology

The January Evangelical Leaders Survey showed that 65 percent identify with premillennial theology, 13 percent with amillennial and 4 percent with postmillennial. Seventeen percent responded “other.”

I don't use this to prove Premill correct, just to show that in evangelical churches Premill is the belief of the majority.
 
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Not David

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It remains the majority in Evangelical churches. It was the Catholic church and Origen that promoted the Amil doctrine. There was no such doctrine prior to Origen from what I have read.


http://www.christianpost.com/news/poll-what-evangelical-leaders-believe-about-the-end-times-49340/

"This end times theology is called premillennialism and 65 percent of surveyed evangelical leaders identify with it."

"The poll, released this week, found that 13 percent of those surveyed are amillennialists – believing that the non-literal millennial reign of Christ is happening now as Christ reigns at the right hand of the Father."

http://www.nae.net/resources/news/539-premillennialism-reigns-in-evangelical-theology



I don't use this to prove Premill correct, just to show that in evangelical churches Premill is the belief of the majority.
I believe the Traditional Churches better than American Evangelism because I'm sure most of Traditional Protestants don't believe in the millennium either.
 
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ewq1938

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I believe the Traditional Churches better than American Evangelism because I'm sure most of Traditional Protestants don't believe in the millennium either.


From what I have read, Premill is the majority. Either way, it is what the bible says that is most important and it is purely Premill. The Amil version of events doesn't even appear in the scriptures.
 
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Not David

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From what I have read, Premill is the majority. Either way, it is what the bible says that is most important and it is purely Premill. The Amil version of events doesn't even appear in the scriptures.
I'm sure you don't believe there is a real dragon and two real beasts. Revelation is a book that needs to be read with caution.
 
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ewq1938

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I'm sure you don't believe there is a real dragon and two real beasts. Revelation is a book that needs to be read with caution.

Symbolism is easy to identify. It's just as easy to spot when symbolism is misapplied.
 
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Erik Nelson

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From what I have read, Premill is the majority. Either way, it is what the bible says that is most important and it is purely Premill. The Amil version of events doesn't even appear in the scriptures.
Still think we could clarify the issue further

Amil = correct, in the sense that the Church = Kingdom = from Christ in the first century AD onwards eternally

Premil = correct, in the sense that there is obviously portrayed some sort of "Second Coming Like Event" in Rev 19 pre-millennium
  • we're not (directly) contradicting what Amil's say --
    • millennium = age of Church, Church in power in its heyday / prime / highwater mark
    • Church existed pre-millennium, just not in power
    • Church exists post-millennium, just not in as much power
Postmil = correct, in that the Great White Throne of God, with Jesus permitted to sit upon as the Judge of all on Final Judgement Day, obviously blatantly arrives in Rev 20 after the Millennium

No camp can claim the others are making up or mis-interpreting Scripture.
  • Church = Kingdom = 30 AD onwards
  • Church Kingdom prophesied to have a 1000-year heyday highwater mark in power
  • Church Kingdom existed pre and continues to exist post millennium
  • something big happens pre-millennium (Rev 19)
  • something bigger happens post-millennium (Rev 20, GWT + FJ)
A further confusion arises, because post-millennium, Gog & Magog deceive the nations... doesn't seem to me to be much of a "reading in between the lines into the text" interpretation to presume, that Gog & Magog lead the nations by portraying themselves as some sort of (false) Messiah like figure...

such that, the GWT + FJ closely coincides with the (false) Messiah Magog's (false) millennium...

if so, then one strike against humans on FJ Day will be having rejected the (true) Messiah Jesus, only to turn right around and accept another (false) Messiah instead
 
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SvN.7

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The millennium is still future because of the events preceding it as recorded in the Book of Revelation and elsewhere, and those who are tempted are those who survived the Great Tribulation.

Anyone stating that the Millennium is a metaphor, has been fulfilled, or is happening now is pretty much adding their own twist to the scripture because no where does the Bible support such an idea.

The following verse has clearly not be fulfilled before because Jesus has never physically ruled from Earth yet, the Jews and Gentiles have never celebrated the feast of tabernacles in Jerusalem together, and Israel is still at war with its enemies.


Zechariah 14 -
This is the plague with which the Lord will strike all the nations that fought against Jerusalem: Their flesh will rot while they are still standing on their feet, their eyes will rot in their sockets, and their tongues will rot in their mouths. On that day people will be stricken by the Lord with great panic. They will seize each other by the hand and attack one another. Judah too will fight at Jerusalem. The wealth of all the surrounding nations will be collected—great quantities of gold and silver and clothing. A similar plague will strike the horses and mules, the camels and donkeys, and all the animals in those camps.

Then the survivors from all the nations that have attacked Jerusalem will go up year after year to worship the King, the Lord Almighty, and to celebrate the Festival of Tabernacles. If any of the peoples of the earth do not go up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord Almighty, they will have no rain. If the Egyptian people do not go up and take part, they will have no rain. The Lord will bring on them the plague he inflicts on the nations that do not go up to celebrate the Festival of Tabernacles. This will be the punishment of Egypt and the punishment of all the nations that do not go up to celebrate the Festival of Tabernacles.

On that day HOLY TO THE LORD will be inscribed on the bells of the horses, and the cooking pots in the Lord’s house will be like the sacred bowls in front of the altar. Every pot in Jerusalem and Judah will be holy to the Lord Almighty, and all who come to sacrifice will take some of the pots and cook in them. And on that day there will no longer be a Canaanitec in the house of the Lord Almighty.

Revelation 20
When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—and to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God’s people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them. And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

I bolded the parts that are clearly future events, because we've never seen anything like that before.
 
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Erik Nelson

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Zechariah 14, "nations vs. Jerusalem"

=

Revelation 20, "nations under Gog & Magog vs. camp of the Saints"

that and Final Judgement are, apparently, still future events
however, it's possible to interpret the present as the post-millennial epoch of mass deception (Rev 20:7-9), which has as yet not come to full culmination = nations gang up on "true Jerusalem" until "fire from heaven" brings about Final Judgement

if so, today = Rev 20:8 or so
 
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ewq1938

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Zechariah 14, "nations vs. Jerusalem"

=

Revelation 20, "nations under Gog & Magog vs. camp of the Saints"

that and Final Judgement are, apparently, still future events
however, it's possible to interpret the present as the post-millennial epoch of mass deception (Rev 20:7-9), which has as yet not come to full culmination = nations gang up on "true Jerusalem" until "fire from heaven" brings about Final Judgement

if so, today = Rev 20:8 or so


So the resurrection of the dead saints already happens as per Rev 20:4? When did that happen and why does no one know about it? Where are they? They are supposed to be immortals living on Earth ruling over the nations....I don't see the nations being ruled over by anyone but themselves.
 
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Erik Nelson

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So the resurrection of the dead saints already happens as per Rev 20:4? When did that happen and why does no one know about it? Where are they? They are supposed to be immortals living on Earth ruling over the nations....I don't see the nations being ruled over by anyone but themselves.
The Kingdom of Heaven is spiritually discerned

Paul tells us that the Resurrection is unto spiritual bodies

Personally offer that Rev 20:4-6 has been fulfilled by the veneration of the Saints & Martyrs with feast days, and as "patron saints" of this that & the other, since the early Church... their living memory has helped guide the Church since classical times... hence, in a spiritually discernable sense, the early martyrs and saints have been alive in power through the Church
 
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ewq1938

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The Kingdom of Heaven is spiritually discerned

Paul tells us that the Resurrection is unto spiritual bodies

Personally offer that Rev 20:4-6 has been fulfilled by the veneration of the Saints & Martyrs with feast days, and as "patron saints" of this that & the other, since the early Church... their living memory has helped guide the Church since classical times... hence, in a spiritually discernable sense, the early martyrs and saints have been alive in power through the Church


The resurrection of the dead in Christ is literal...dead people brought back to life but in glorified, immortal bodies. That hasn't happened yet so all of Rev 20 is future events.
 
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Erik Nelson

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The resurrection of the dead in Christ is literal...dead people brought back to life but in glorified, immortal bodies. That hasn't happened yet so all of Rev 20 is future events.
glorified immortal bodies does not imply something every human eye can directly observe

heavenly things are generally spiritually discerned

but, vaguely like Obi-won-Kenobi guides Luke Skywalker in Star Wars, the enduring Presences of the early Saints & martyrs continues to be discernable to this day...

they are alive in our memories and instruct in the Faith, even though "only Luke hears Obi-won talking to him"

today we remember the 2nd century AD saints Marcellus & Valerian, who were persecuted & perished in 177 AD under emperor Marcus Aurelius in Gaul modern France

https://www.catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=720
 
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ewq1938

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glorified immortal bodies does not imply something every human eye can directly observe

Christ was seen after his resurrection so yes, the immortal saints can also be seen and will be. Rev 20 is after the trib has ended...even the mark of the beast is mentioned and neither the AC nor that mark nor any of the trib events has happened.
 
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NW82

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I already did.

Now if we can, which of the original Churches teach the idea of a future millennium?
The Christian Church, at least any church that is teaching from the Book of Revelation (and not altering it).
 
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John 4:10

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Who are these people, specifically, that will be tempted after the 1000 years? Will they be having children?

There is no after 1000 years millennium reign. where do you come to the summation that the millennium reign of Jesus in Heaven will end?

I don’t understand if it’s believers in Christ who’ll be tempted a second time?

When the millennium reign of Christ begins everyone would have already biologically died and judged and no human remains for a second chance draw.

Or maybe the people who didn’t get saved during the second coming?

? it is confusing to say that the millennium reign of Christ begins when there are people left ho did not get saved which means that at his coming he has not destroyed the last enemy death. There is no one in human form to be saved anymore at Christ's coming Final Judgement of the Dead when the books are opened.

Or is it the unsaved dead who’ll be given back up from the grave before The Great Judgement?

? The Great White Throne Judgement happens at Christ's coming when he will judge the living and the dead. There is not anyone left that will not be judged.
 
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Tayla

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Reading revelations 20, and more specifically revelations 20:7-8.

Will believers/Christians be tempted AGAIN after the 1000 year millennial reign?
Who specifically will be tempted by satan after 1000 years? Will it be those who didn’t accept Jesus? Or believers/Christians will be tempted a second time?
The 1,000 years already ended, that's why Christians are tempted. The 1,000 years started with Jesus and ended 1,000 years later.
 
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The 1,000 years already ended, that's why Christians are tempted. The 1,000 years started with Jesus and ended 1,000 years later.


The 1000 years doesn't even start until after the mark of the beast comes and goes, and the dead saints killed for refusing the mark are resurrected to immortality....none of those things have happened yet so the 1000 years is still yet to happen.

We cannot be in the thousand years right now or any time in the past for this very simple reason:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Verse 4 says there are people that were beheaded in the tribulation because they refused to worship the beast and take the mark of the beast. That is found in Rev 13 so by Rev 20, the tribulation is over. That means before the thousand years even begins the tribulation found in Rev 13 is over. We therefore cannot be in the thousand years now because the beast did not rise up, the Antichrist did not rise up, and the mark of the beast does not exist yet nor is anyone being beheaded for refusing to worship the beast or take his mark.

If the tribulation found in Rev 13 has not yet happened, then the thousand years has not yet begun. That alone proves the Amil position to be false.

The second thing this proves is that the first resurrection has not yet occurred because it also only comes after the tribulation has ended




Rev 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
Rev 13:12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
Rev 13:13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
Rev 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
Rev 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

So, the mark only exists when the second beast, the false prophet, gives life to the image of the first beast and then causes all to receive a mark. If they already had the mark these verses would be untrue. This is the first time the mark of the beast is given to anyone. And it only happens during the 42 month tribulation.

The thousand years doesn't even begin until the saints refuse the mark and are beheaded either by the false prophet or those loyal to him during those 42 months. After that period ends, Christ returns and will resurrect those who were beheaded. That's all before Satan is bound in the pit and before the thousand years starts.

As the OP shows, Amil is a false doctrine because it teaches the thousand years is happening since the cross yet ignores all the things that have to happen before the thousand years even begins which are:

All things that must happen before the thousand years even begins

The rise of the first beast. (Found in Rev 13 which shows the beginning events of the tribulation)
The rise of the second beast. (Found in Rev 13 which shows the beginning events of the tribulation)
The creation of the image of the beast. (Found in Rev 13 which shows the beginning events of the tribulation)
The second beast giving life to the image of the beast. (Found in Rev 13 which shows the beginning events of the tribulation)
People given the mark of the beast. (Found in Rev 13 which shows the beginning events of the tribulation)
The full 1260 days ministry of the two witnesses. (Found in Rev 11 which shows mid and ending events of the tribulation)
The public murdering of the two prophets. (Found in Rev 11 which shows mid and ending events of the tribulation)
Their bodies lying in the street of Jerusalem. (Found in Rev 11 which shows mid and ending events of the tribulation)
The resurrection of the two prophets and ascending into heaven. (Found in Rev 11 which shows mid and ending events of the tribulation)
The sounding of the 7th trumpet/3rd woe which is when the second coming occurs. (Found in Rev 11 which shows mid and ending events of the tribulation)
The battle of Rev 19 and defeat of the beast and army. (Rev 19)
Beast and false prophet cast into the lake of fire. (Rev 20)
The resurrection of the beheaded dead of Rev 20. (Rev 20)
Casting Satan into the pit. (Rev 20)

THEN AND ONLY then does the thousand years begin. (Rev 20)

All those things must happen first before the thousand years is said to start and it is all because of one verse:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

These saints who were beheaded in the tribulation are brought back to life before the thousand years begins which means the tribulation period they died in had to happen first and there are a huge list of major events that happen in that tribulation period and just after it ends. All of the list happens before the thousand years begins.
 
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