• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.

Where is your evidence creationists?

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by revo74, Dec 8, 2011.

  1. Split Rock

    Split Rock Conflation of Blathers

    +647
    Agnostic
    Single
    I don't hate anyone either. Yet I am told that I am "full of hate" for posting here.


    My agenda is to support the teaching of science in public school science classes, and to keep religion out.


    Fastener is likely another Consul sock puppet. He has been told his comments are not welcome many times here by both sides of the debate. But, maybe you should talk to your friend Astridhere about her comments... such as this gem:

    Originally Posted by Astridhere
    "I reckon the atheists on any Christian forum are there because they are too stupid to engage in science forums so they bring their ignorance here in the hope that no one notices just how stupid they are..."
     
  2. Split Rock

    Split Rock Conflation of Blathers

    +647
    Agnostic
    Single
    I don't think people who believe in God are stupid. Most atheists I know don't think that either.
     
  3. Split Rock

    Split Rock Conflation of Blathers

    +647
    Agnostic
    Single

    1. And be convinced that faith requires rejecting reality? Not a very good ploy.


      Only people like consul and his many sock puppets.

      Same as above.
     
  4. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE Supporter

    +40,416
    United States
    Baptist
    Married
    US-Republican
    :cool: You obviously have good taste!
     
  5. JediMobius

    JediMobius The Guy with the Face

    +96
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    US-Others
    I agree in principle. I'm saying that the creation of soulful man could satisfy the condition of new and individual creation, especially the individual part. Still, I haven't ruled out mankind's creation ex-nihilo, circa the dawn of civilization. As you say, God can do what he wants, his way, regardless of how it looks to any of us down here. If darwinians cite genetic similarity, for example, the evidence is not convincing. Our genetic information is remarkably similar to all sorts of lesser creatures, so DNA doesn't seem to be a reliable indication of common ancestry in the long run.

    lol

    There is an important factor you may not be considering. Proper exegesis can make the difference between taking God at his word, and taking God at our own word. It is theologically perilous to equate "as it is written" to "as it is read." We are so far removed from the context of the original author's environment and audience, that even the most faithfully rendered translation can lead us a stray through our preconceptions. This is how poor doctrine manifests most often. More problematic is the fact that translations of the original text, even if rendered perfectly, eventually lose currency with language. Worse, the mind can also read colloquially when the translation was not rendered to include such parlance.

    So, to take the bible as it was written, not only do we need a modern, competent translation, we need other tools to aid our interpretation. These include a concordance dictionary and scholarly commentaries, both of which are even freely available on the internet.

    Now, because of these and other factors, the dynamics become much more complicated than take it or leave it. Besides, is your faith rooted in God himself, or the recording of his word? Truly, his word will not perish, but the written account of it might. For what absolute, perfect truth can even be communicated in our imperfect language?
     
  6. cupid dave

    cupid dave Guest

    +0

    ?
     
  7. mathclub

    mathclub Newbie

    597
    +6
    Atheist
    vnice owning of astrid here, i actually lol'd reading this.

    no doubt she has no substantiated evidence of anything, and puts a different level of requirement on some things if they fall outside what she already believes.

    Most atheists are far more consistent. Show us actual substantiated evidence and we will believe anything, not just what suits us.
     
  8. USincognito

    USincognito Milk-Bones for Cerberus is a cool album name Supporter

    +13,567
    United States
    Atheist
    Private
    Indeed. That's not the only mistake you have made numerous times before someone corrected you. That's also not the only mistake you have continued to make after several people correcting you numerous times.

    I don't have to deny such published research because it doesn't exist. The only research published has been to suggest that Au. afarensis is not ancestral to humans. And I'm going to explain that to you as I'm pretty sure that many others have already - that does not mean she's a chimp or "fully ape" or whatever other non sequitorial conclusions Creationists want to force on to those papers. That means that Au. afarensis could be a cousin species to the Austral line with did lead to Homo and, of course, sapiens. That position is hardly settled science though. There's a lot more evidence suggesting that Au. afarensis was the Austral lineage that did lead to Homo.

    Not nearly as much as I enjoy your apparent lack of a sense of irony. The Wiki entry and the content of The Ancestor's Tale is a perfect example of you cherry picking because it confirms your misunderstandings and a priori rejectionist position. You glom on to any paper, be it tentative, misrepresented by Creationists (Male sepecific Y) or any other thing that seems to support you and you clamp down on it like an alligator with a chicken (Turkana boy's skull looking "more like an orang" than a human).

    Your fantasies are as amusing as they disconnected from reality.

    Here's a perfect example of you not knowing what you're talking about or being such a disconnected layman that you don't even know how to express what you're trying to say properly. No one is suggesting Au. afarensis is "human". Heck, you can see right in the binomial name "Australopithecus afarensis" that the species is not even considered to be in the genus Homo. Is it ancestral to Homo, and thus to "humans" (i.e. H. sapiens)? Most likely. But since no one is suggesting Au. afarensis is "human" the rest of your response is meaningless.

    Look Crocodile Dundee, the slang isn't cute, endearing or helping to you communicate with your fellow English speakers. Just stop it.
     
  9. USincognito

    USincognito Milk-Bones for Cerberus is a cool album name Supporter

    +13,567
    United States
    Atheist
    Private
    Whenever someone starts with "In other words" rest assured an error or prevarication is about to follow. No surprise, that's the case with your comment.

    There's nothing in the quote you provided about when Coelacanths first appeared. How then could you suggest, "In other words" that when Coelacanth (sic) first appeared is speculation? The only thing one can draw from that quote is a pretty close approximation to the facts: Latimeria chalumnae and Latimeria menadoensis are (apparently) the only living species of a once widespread family (Actinistia) all other lines having died out during the Cretaceous. Macropoma the last fossil - note, not the only fossil, there are more than 120 species known from the fossil record - from the Cretaceous resembles the two Latimeria species.

    In one short paragraph and one "In other words" you've made several major mistakes, but I'm willing to bet your hubris will no doubt lead you to believe you "debunked evolution" and you'll continue to repeat it.
     
  10. USincognito

    USincognito Milk-Bones for Cerberus is a cool album name Supporter

    +13,567
    United States
    Atheist
    Private
    Did your grandparents and great aunts/uncles die as soon as you were born?
     
  11. Astridhere

    Astridhere Well-Known Member

    +40
    Christian
    Married
    I think a God that knows what he is doing has all the above covered.

    Why pin any salvation at all to a book that can be interpreted in accordance to mankinds reasonings. Intelligencia is not required.

    Indeed, there are scriptures that are not set in concrete eg biblical day. However, I do not think Jesus performed miracles in front of crowds to show off. Rather I believe Jesus sent a strong message to not deny the power of his Father who is greater.

    Another example in Genesis is the moon being created after the earth. This may have sounded quite ridiculous some time ago and yet it has been shown to be correct. This is amazing knowledge to be contained in a book so old.

    I am a proponent of an earth centred universe. I have provided some research to back this claim. Just because mankind has not worked out all the physics and I, a mere human, cannot answer every question on it does not mean that scripture is not correct in every way. Under this model there may well have been sufficient light and warmth from the afterglow of creation to grow plants yielding fruits before the dimming and subsequent formation of the sun.

    So I do disagree with you and all the intelligencia that comes from the reasonings of man that complicates a simple truth.
     
  12. USincognito

    USincognito Milk-Bones for Cerberus is a cool album name Supporter

    +13,567
    United States
    Atheist
    Private
    Stop with the "your side" garbage. Fastener is a sockpuppet of consol, a troll who was banned about two years ago, but keeps being able to get sockpuppets through the ban filter.

    That's 1 person.

    Go ahead and find any "hate" from me, pseudopod, Split Rock or any of the others who have been posting here for a while. I can post volumes of hate coming from Astrid alone in just the last 5 pages of this thread.

    You newbies think you have this place figured out, but those of us who have been here a long time are part of the community, whether you new folks like it or not.
     
  13. Astridhere

    Astridhere Well-Known Member

    +40
    Christian
    Married

    Oh how desperate of you to cherry pick and leave the substance of my post unadressed.

    Habils and erectus are a better example of population not morphing along together in perfect harmony.

    Do you think some islander populations are going to morph into mermaid like creatures in response to rising sea levels?

    Evos suggest creatures have morphed onto land and then back again many times so I assume your answer is Yes.
     
  14. USincognito

    USincognito Milk-Bones for Cerberus is a cool album name Supporter

    +13,567
    United States
    Atheist
    Private
    Instead of a surprisingly small non-sequitorial wall of text, why don't you just answer my question.

    Did your grandparents and great aunts/uncles die as soon as you were born?
     
  15. cupid dave

    cupid dave Guest

    +0

    Do you see evidence in Gen1:1, that the bible writers KNEW the Cosmos had a beginning and had not always been there as was long thought to be the case?

    Do you see evidence in Gen1:3-5, that the bible writers KNEW visible light did not appear at the Big Bang, but had to wait until stars formed during the Cosmic Dark Age?

    Do you see evidence in Gen1:9-10, that the bible writers KNEW a Pangea-like gathering togethaer of all the waters under heavenm were collected into ONE place, a universal sea, i.e. Panthalasso???
     
  16. cupid dave

    cupid dave Guest

    +0

    You worship as book report on the Bible that is medievl and now archaic.

    In spite that Daniel TOLD you the book was closed until this Age, when knowledge abounds and men travel to and fro as they do.

    4But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
     
  17. JNathanK

    JNathanK Newbie

    78
    +2
    Christian
    I'm a creationists but in the sense that I believe there's a ontological force pulling evolution toward a certain direction, and that direction is to give the physical universe a set of eyes and ears and a brain to perceive and contemplate itself with.
     
  18. Astridhere

    Astridhere Well-Known Member

    +40
    Christian
    Married

    Now you answer my question:

    Will some human population morph into aquatic creatures with the rise of sea levels, which is the basis of the ridiculous adaptive processes you lot present that are beyond any species adaptive ability that is limited?
     
  19. Astridhere

    Astridhere Well-Known Member

    +40
    Christian
    Married
    This above is an extrapolated straw grab. Creationists also accept adaptation. That is why pygmies and Americans are all just as human as each other.

    Do you know why the various peoples of the world are called races?

    Answer: Because evolutionists would look really silly if they called the various races different species. Yet if a bird changes beak size it gets a new species name. This is no different to suggesting a larger nosed race is a different species to the others and is adapting to a creature that will one day not be human. The same goes for colour and size.

    The bacteria argument is just as silly.

    Evolutionary scientists will never let real science and observation get in the way of a good story.

    .
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2012
  20. Astridhere

    Astridhere Well-Known Member

    +40
    Christian
    Married
    There is no solid evidence for evolution as I have demonstrated many times.

    Indeed evolution from a mouse deer to a whale is impossible and this is demonstrated and observed in the dog that will never be bred to be as large as a horse because its ability to adapt is limited, yet bacteria morphed into an elephant and whale.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2012
Loading...