Where is the Great Multitude from Rev 7:13,14

[Dead Eye]

Where did the Great Multitude come from?

Rev 7:13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, what are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?

Rev 7:13 And *(1st) of the elders (Rev 5:5) answered, saying (participating authority) unto me (John), What are these (the great (significant) multitude) which are arrayed in white (purity) robes (Rev 7:12)? and whence (where did they come from) came they?

Rev 5:5 And *one of the elders says to me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has prevailed to open the book, and to lose its seven seals.

What are these? (Rev Chapters 2&3

• Rev 7:9 After this I beheld, and lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and languages, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; Rev 7:10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God who sit upon the throne, and to the Lamb.
• Rev 7:14-17 And I said to him, Sir, you know. And he said to me, These are they (Tribulation Saints) who came out of great (significant) tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Rev 7:15 Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple (1000-year Kingdom): and he (Jesus) that sits on the throne will dwell among them (New Creation). Rev 7:16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst anymore; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. Rev 7:17 For the Lamb who is in the midst of the throne will feed them, and will lead them to living fountains of waters: and God will wipe away all tears from their eyes.

Significant Multitude are Tribulation Saints

Rev 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, you know. And he said to me, these are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.”

Rev 7:14a And I (John) said unto him (1st Elder), Sir, you know. And he said to me (John), These (the significant multitude) are they which came out of great (significant Tribulation (Saints), and have washed their robes,

It’s my belief the Seven Seals take place between the Resurrection and Tribulation. About a Seven Year Period of Time, beginning with the conclusion of the gog war (Ezek 38, 39) and ending with the conclusion of the Seventh Seal (Rev 8:1-5).

Rev 7:14a And I (John) said unto him, Sir, you know. And he said to me (John), These (the great multitude) are they which came out of great tribulation (Saints),

Different Groups of Saints

Christians are Resurrected, Denominationalist remain on Earth

Scourge Saints: Rev 5:8-10 Rev 6:9-11

Tribulation Saints before the Image Rev 7:9-17 Dan 9:27

Beheaded Tribulation Saints: Rev 13:7, 12:6, 14-17, Rev 14:12,13 Rev 15:2-4 Rev 20:4

From Resurrection to the 8th Seal are the group of Scourge Saints: Rev 5:8-10 Rev 6:9-11 (do not enter tribulation)

1st Trumpet until the last thirty days of the 6th Trumpet are a group of Tribulation Saints: Rev 7:9,10, 14-17 (not necessarily beheaded)

From the last thirty days of the 6th Trumpet through the Great Tribulation: Rev 13:7 Rev 14:6,7 Rev 14:9-11 Rev 15:2-4 Rev 20:4 (Image Tribulation Saints these saints are beheaded)

6th Trumpet Kingdom Saints are from the last thirty days of the 6th Trumpet through the Great Tribulation: Rev 12:6, 14-17

Rev 7:14 continues

Rev 7:14b (significant multitude) and made them (robes) white in the blood of the Lamb (tittle of Jesus).

Denominationalists left on Earth that are Victorious through the Word of God and the Testimony of Jesus Christ are given the nineteen gifts offered by Jesus. Rev chapters 2&3

Beginning of Denominationalism Matt 26:14-16 Mark 14:15, 44 Acts 3:14,15 Luke 22:5,6 Luke 22:47,48 unholy kiss John 12:6-money bag Luke 22:5,6 Rev 1:18 3:20 Isa 28:15-18-SCOURGE {Jer 6:30 Luke 18:33 2Tim 3:7-9 Titus 1:16 Rev 2&3})

Nineteen Gifts offered by Jesus to the Membership within the Seven Divisions forming the General Assembly of the Denominational Church system left on Earth:

1st Division Ephesus Rev 2:7 Eat of Tree of Life, Access to Midst of Paradise of God

2nd Division Smyrna Rev 2:10,11 Crown of Life, Escapes 2nd Death.

3rd Division Pergamos Rev 2:17 Hidden Manna, White Stone, New Name

4th Division Thyatira 2:26-29 Power over Nations, Rod of Iron, Morning Star

5th Division Sardis Rev 3:5,6 White Raiment, Eternal Life, Confession

6th Division Philadelphia Rev 3:12,13 Pillar, Rest, Name of God, City of God, New Name Jesus

7th Division Laodicea Rev 3:21,22 Sit with Jesus on Throne

The Blood of the Lamb

Rev 18:24 And in her (Jerusalem) was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Rev 19:2 For true and righteous are his judgments: for he has judged the great harlot (Jerusalem), which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.

Rev 5:9 And they sung a new song, saying, you are worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for you were slain, and have redeemed us to God by your blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, how long, O Lord, holy and true, do you not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

Rev 12:11 And they overcame him (son of perdition) by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

 

[tailgator]

The saints which come out of great tribulation are the saints who have not died and are alive once the United States starts dropping nukes everywhere .They are from the nations.



The saints who die in the previous 42 months who do not worship the Israeli government or it's image nor receive it's mark and are killed for the their testimony of Jesus will be resurected and will reign with Christ.They are Israel.

 

[ViaCrucis]

All the Faithful of all times. There is one Holy Church, both on earth and in heaven.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Diamond72]

Where did the Great Multitude come from?

All tongues, tribes, people and nations.

 

[Douggg]

Where did the Great Multitude come from?

John sees the souls of the great multitude in heaven.

They will come out of the great tribulation, dying during that time.

 

[keras]

John sees the souls of the great multitude in heaven.

They will come out of the great tribulation, dying during that time.

Revelation 7:1-3 sets an earthly scene. Nowhere in that chapter is heaven mentioned.
It is also quite wrong to think they are dead people.

They are living Christian peoples, gathered from the nations and settled into all of the holy Land. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26, +

We are clearly told about the GT martyrs; Revelation 20:4-6

Rev 7:14 does not say 'the Great Tribulation', which comes years later. It says; great tribulation or as the RE Bible puts it; a great ordeal;. Which obviously refers to the just happened Sixth Seal worldwide disaster

 

[Diamond72]

Revelation 7:1-3 sets an earthly scene. Nowhere in that chapter is heaven mentioned.

Chaper 7 talks about the throne of God. The throne of God is described in the Bible, particularly in the books of Isaiah, Ezekiel, and Revelation. It is often depicted as a radiant and glorious seat surrounded by angelic beings.

If the throne of God is not in Heaven, then where is the Throne of God? Hebrews 4:16: "Let us then approach the throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need"12. This verse encourages believers to come boldly before God’s throne to seek mercy and grace.

The Lords prayer starts off: "Our Father that art in Heaven"

Our Father, Who art in heaven, Hallowed be Thy Name. Thy Kingdom come, Thy Will be done, On earth as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, our daily bread, And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

 

[Diamond72]

Rev 7:14 does not say 'the Great Tribulation

Revelation 7:14 speaks of those who have come out of the great tribulation: "These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb"

 

[keras]

Chaper 7 talks about the throne of God. The throne of God is described in the Bible, particularly in the books of Isaiah, Ezekiel, and Revelation. It is often depicted as a radiant and glorious seat surrounded by angelic beings.

Almighty God, His Throne, angels and heaven are all Spiritual beings or entities.
They are in another dimension, but if God wills it; they can be seen on or from the earth. Ezekiel 1:1 and Acts 7:56 are examples.

One Day soon, the Christian peoples will gather in the holy Land and the Lord will reveal Himself to them. 2 Thess 1:10, Revelation 14:1

Revelation 7:14 speaks of those who have come out of the great tribulation: "These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb"

The word 'the' is not in the Bible verse of Rev 7:14.
That 'tribulation', is not the Great Trib of the 7 Trumpets and Bowls.

People need to be careful to not jump to conclusions, There is no mention of heaven, or of any bodily changes in Rev 7:1-14
Rev 7:15-17, is a Prophecy about Gods peoples in the new heaven and earth. As Rev 21:1-7 describes.
The false teaching of a 'rapture to heaven' has confuzed many. They have to find somewhere to fit in that wrong idea, but there is no scripture which says such a thing. Pauls Prophecy in 1 Thess 4:16-17, is a gathering to where Jesus is; in Jerusalem. Matthew 24:30-31

We are earth people, we never leave this planet and eventually - God and heaven come down to us. Rev 21:1

 

[Douggg]

Almighty God, His Throne, angels and heaven are all Spiritual beings or entities.
They are in another dimension, but if God wills it; they can be seen on or from the earth. Ezekiel 1:1 and Acts 7:56 are examples.

keras, the throne of God is in heaven. Where John beheld the great multitude that came out of great tribulation (whether the word "the" is in the text or not is irrelevant).

Heaven where God's throne is - is beyond the stars of the universe, the cosmos. Whether you want to call that in another dimension or not, does not change the fact that God's throne is not here on earth. And neither were the great multitude that John saw.

The great multitude that John saw before the throne of God were the great tribulation martyrs, their souls. Their martyred bodies not yet redeemed, bought back to life, that will will happen in Revelation 20:4-6.

 

[Diamond72]

We are earth people, we never leave this planet

Maybe you never leave the planet but Jesus tells me about my mansion in Heaven. Perhaps there is a time when Heaven will come down to the Earth. Revelation 21 10 "He showed me the holy city, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God".

 

[keras]

keras, the throne of God is in heaven. Where John beheld the great multitude that came out of great tribulation (whether the word "the" is in the text or not is irrelevant).

Heaven where God's throne is - is beyond the stars of the universe, the cosmos. Whether you want to call that in another dimension or not, does not change the fact that God's throne is not here on earth. And neither were the great multitude that John saw.

The great multitude that John saw before the throne of God were the great tribulation martyrs, their souls. Their martyred bodies not yet redeemed, bought back to life, that will will happen in Revelation 20:4-6.

What pretentious nonsense!
I proved that Gods Throne can be seen from the earth, if God wills it.

Nobody is dead in Revelation 7, you falsely think that. That Chapter is years before the Great Trib, of the final 3 1/2 years before Jesus Returns.

Maybe you never leave the planet but Jesus tells me about my mansion in Heaven. Perhaps there is a time when Heaven will come down to the Earth. Revelation 21 10 "He showed me the holy city, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God".

I have no wish to leave earth. I do not evade my responsibilities. Matthew 28:19-20

That time is AFTER the Millennium. Rev 21:1

 

[Diamond72]

That time is AFTER the Millennium. Rev 21:1

We rule and reign with Christ for 1,000 years. Either that is literal or symbolic in some way. I assume you believe that this is literal. So does this involve some sort of resurrection?

While we are at it, what say you about the final judgement?

 

[keras]

We rule and reign with Christ for 1,000 years. Either that is literal or symbolic in some way. I assume you believe that this is literal. So does this involve some sort of resurrection?

The Millennium reign of King Jesus will be a literal thousand years. Reiterated six times. Also proved by the given time periods in the Bible.

The only people brought back to life by Jesus at His glorious Return, will be the martyrs killed during the 42 month reign of the 'beast. They do lot receive immortality yet.

While we are at it, what say you about the final judgement?

Daniel 7:9-10 and Revelation 20:11-15 say it all. Only then does anybody become immortal.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Almighty God, His Throne, angels and heaven are all Spiritual beings or entities.
They are in another dimension, but if God wills it; they can be seen on or from the earth. Ezekiel 1:1 and Acts 7:56 are examples.

One Day soon, the Christian peoples will gather in the holy Land and the Lord will reveal Himself to them. 2 Thess 1:10, Revelation 14:1

The word 'the' is not in the Bible verse of Rev 7:14.
That 'tribulation', is not the Great Trib of the 7 Trumpets and Bowls.

People need to be careful to not jump to conclusions, There is no mention of heaven, or of any bodily changes in Rev 7:1-14
Rev 7:15-17, is a Prophecy about Gods peoples in the new heaven and earth. As Rev 21:1-7 describes.
The false teaching of a 'rapture to heaven' has confuzed many. They have to find somewhere to fit in that wrong idea, but there is no scripture which says such a thing. Pauls Prophecy in 1 Thess 4:16-17, is a gathering to where Jesus is; in Jerusalem. Matthew 24:30-31

We are earth people, we never leave this planet and eventually - God and heaven come down to us. Rev 21:1

Keras, Rev 3:10 is about the future 7-year Trib that only unbelievers enter. Rev 4:1 is wholly in the future. Rev 22:8 proves apostle John never left the island of Patmos. It was just one angel who showed him everything he heard and saw in his entire vision of Revelation. The proof is in John's own words, in Rev 22:8 (ESV): I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I heard and saw them, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who showed them to me,

Therefore, John merely wrote about Rev 4:1, as well as all else he heard and saw in his vision of Revelation. Again, John attests to that fact in Rev 22:8.

1 Th 1:10 is apostle Paul's first verse about the pre-Trib rapture of the Church. Here's 1 Th 1:10 (ESV): and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come.

God’s wrath is well-defined in Ezekiel 14:21 (NLT): “Now this is what the Sovereign Lord says: How terrible it will be when all four of these dreadful punishments fall upon Jerusalem—war, famine, wild animals, and disease—destroying all her people and animals.

In the Trib, the wrath of God begins no later than Rev 6:4 regarding “wars” that will suddenly break out all over the world. Here's Rev 6:4 (NLT): Then another horse appeared, a red one. Its rider was given a mighty sword and the authority to take peace from the earth. And there was war and slaughter everywhere.

So, we know that God’s wrath will come in the 2nd seal. That satisfies the requirement for God’s wrath at the beginning of the Trib, for the purposes of 1 Th 1:10.

“Delivers us” in 1 Th 1:10 relates to the second usage of “deliverance,” in the Bible. That second usage translates to “snatch away.” Therefore, that verse is about our being “snatched away" just before God’s wrath comes in the Trib. We know from Rev 6:4 that God’s wrath will come in the 2nd seal.

In 1 Th 1:10, we will be raptured (snatched away) from Earth immediately prior to the Trib due to God’s wrath about to come in the 2nd seal.

That is what Jesus means in Rev 3:10 by His words, "I will keep you from the hour of trial.” We believers will not enter the 7-year Trib.

 

[Diamond72]

Revelation 20:11-15 say it all

This does not explain what the second death is.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

The Millennium reign of King Jesus will be a literal thousand years. Reiterated six times. Also proved by the given time periods in the Bible.

The only people brought back to life by Jesus at His glorious Return, will be the martyrs killed during the 42 month reign of the 'beast. They do lot receive immortality yet.

Daniel 7:9-10 and Revelation 20:11-15 say it all. Only then does anybody become immortal.

Revelation 20:12 cites "the dead." It also says "then the dead were judged..." Of the groups below, which group is left not judged upon the GWTJ? Answer: those who died in sin. Rev 20:12 says nothing about "the dead IN CHRIST." The "dead in Christ" are specifically distinguished from "the dead" when it comes to these very specific judgments.

Also, 1 Th 4:16 raises "the dead in Christ." What percentage of "the dead in Christ" is raised? The only truthful answer is 100%. That accounts for 100% of the "dead in Christ." Who's not raised in 1 Th 4:16? The dead who died in sin. They are not raised until the GWTJ.

These are the future judgments. None occur together. That is proven by the times of their occurrence. No person is judged twice. Each judgment is final.

The Judgment Seat of Christ (2 Cor 5:10) happens on the day of the pre-Trib rapture (1 Th 1:10). That is strongly implied to occur on the day of the rapture by 2 Tim 4:8 ("on that day"), meaning the day of the pre-Trib rapture (1 Th 1:10). This is further implied by what happens in 1 Th 4:16-17, which occur with 1 Cor 15:52. We are changed into our eternal bodies (1 Cor 15:52), then we are raptured (1 Th 4:17). There is only one destination with our eternal bodies: Heaven.

The Trib then starts, and these are the judgments that occur, in sequence:

The AC and the false prophet: Rev 19:20 (during Armageddon).

After Armageddon: Matt 25:31-46. These are the judgments of the sheep (Matt 25:31-40) and goats (Matt 25:41-46). The sheep are "the elect" in Matt 24:31, and the goats are the unbelievers who survive the Trib.

After the MK: Satan is judged in Rev 20:10.

Then the GWTJ (Rev 20:11-15). The GWTJ only judges the folks who died in sin. That happens to be the only group not yet judged. No person is judged twice. Each judgment is final. Therefore, the GWTJ can only be about "the dead" who died in sin.

 

[keras]

This does not explain what the second death is.

Revelation 20:14.....The Lake of fire is the second death.
What Revelation 20:4-6 tells us that the martyrs who will be killed during the 42 month period of 'beast' rule and who Jesus will resurrect when He Returns, may die again , but they will receive immortality and will never get thrown into the Lake of Fire.

 

[keras]

Then the GWTJ (Rev 20:11-15). The GWTJ only judges the folks who died in sin. That happens to be the only group not yet judged. No person is judged twice. Each judgment is final. Therefore, the GWTJ can only be about "the dead" who died in sin.

This idea is an attempt to change and add to Revelation 20:14. It does not differentiate between the saved and the unsaved.

EVERYBODY must stand before God in Judgment. There is no way that even a born again Christian can avoid it.
Jesus will Judge the nations at His Return, but it isn't until after the Millennium that every individual will be Judged.

The whole idea of a 'rapture to heaven', which you are locked into, is false and is never going to happen.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

This idea is an attempt to change and add to Revelation 20:14. It does not differentiate between the saved and the unsaved.

EVERYBODY must stand before God in Judgment. There is no way that even a born again Christian can avoid it.
Jesus will Judge the nations at His Return, but it isn't until after the Millennium that every individual will be Judged.

The whole idea of a 'rapture to heaven', which you are locked into, is false and is never going to happen.

Keras, every Bible verse can't carry every detail about what it relates to. It is expected that we know other Bible verses that complete the details that are pertinent to other verses. For example, you say that Rev 20:14 doesn't differentiate between the saved an unsaved. But, it does. If you understood Hades, it is only for unbelievers. Luke 16:22-23 (NIV): “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side.

Luke 16:23 defines Hades as only for unbelievers.

The GWTJ only tries those who died in sin. You're ignoring the judgments that come before the GWTJ. All who died in Christ are raised at 1 Th 4:16. All living believers, along with the newly raised dead in Christ, are transformed into our glorified bodies, and we are raptured in 1 Th 4:17. Rev 4:1 is the verse that gets us to Heaven. Apostle John provably never left the island of Patmos during his vision of Revelation. That is proven in John's own words in Rev 22:8. That makes Rev 4:1 a future event, the pre-Trib rapture of the Church.